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Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

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Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Flaming liberal Bill Kristol chimes in:

Remember Michael Dukakis (1988) and John Kerry (2004)? It's possible to lose a winnable presidential election to a vulnerable incumbent in the White House (or in the case of 1988, a sitting vice president). So, speaking of losing candidates from Massachusetts: Is it too much to ask Mitt Romney to get off autopilot and actually think about the race he's running?


Adopting a prevent defense when it's only the second quarter and you're not even ahead is dubious enough as a strategy. But his campaign's monomaniacal belief that it's about the economy and only the economy, and that they need to keep telling us stupid voters that it's only about the economy, has gone from being an annoying tick to a dangerous self-delusion.

As Frank Cannon and Jeff Bell, among others, have pointed out, the economy is not an automatic path to victory. It does provide a favorable backdrop for this year's campaign. But what are voters to think when they hear the GOP nominee say, as he did yesterday to CBS’s Jan Crawford, "As long as I continue to speak about the economy, I'm going to win"? That they're dopes who don't know the economy's bad, but as long as the Romney campaign keeps instructing them that it is bad, they'll react correctly and vote the incumbent out of office?

The economy is of course important. But voters want to hear what Romney is going to do about the economy. He can "speak about" how bad the economy is all he wants—though Americans are already well aware of the economy's problems—but doesn't the content of what Romney has to say matter? What is his economic growth agenda? His deficit reform agenda? His health care reform agenda? His tax reform agenda? His replacement for Dodd-Frank? No need for any of that, I suppose the Romney campaign believes. Just need to keep on "speaking about the economy."

The Romney campaign will answer that they're imitating Bill Clinton in 1992, who famously focused on "the economy, stupid." But Bill Clinton was a full spectrum presidential candidate, with detailed policy proposals on welfare reform, health care, education, and foreign policy. He also made real efforts to convince the voters he was different from the losing Democratic candidates who preceded him ("a new kind of Democrat," "ending welfare as we know it," a hawkish-sounding foreign policy, Sister Souljah, etc.). So far, the Romney campaign doesn't resemble the Clinton campaign. It seems to be following more comfortably in the tradition of the five post-Cold War Republican presidential candidates who preceded Romney. They received 37.5 percent, 40.7 percent, 47.9 percent, 50.7 percent, and 45.7 percent of the vote, respectively. The average GOP presidential vote in these last five elections was 44.5 percent. In the last three, it was 48.1 percent. Give Romney an extra point for voter disillusionment with Obama, and a half-point for being better financed than his predecessors. It still strikes me as a path to (narrow) defeat.

By the way, Romney made his comment about speaking about the economy on July 4th—a date that might suggest there's more to the American experiment than the economy.
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Flaming liberal Bill Kristol chimes in
Bill Kristol giving political advice is like Billy Crystal giving comedy advice. If he ever had anything useful to say, it's been irrelevant for a decade.
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Bill Kristol, whether or not playing the part of Captain Obvious, is absolutely right.
Romney has zero chance of winning this election. It's over. He has nothing to say that is of any interest to anyone.
So how about those Wild?
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Bill Kristol, whether or not playing the part of Captain Obvious, is absolutely right.
Romney has zero chance of winning this election. It's over. He has nothing to say that is of any interest to anyone.
So how about those Wild?
I can't tell if this is sandbagging or not. :confused: :)

Right now Nate Silver gives Romney about a 31% chance of winning the election -- I'd say that's about right.

Kristol's an idiot, but he's also a very dependable watercarrier for the Neocons, so it's interesting to see this gadfly approach from them. I wonder if this is an early salvo in a campaign to get a True Believer Neocon on the ticket.
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Right now Nate Silver gives Romney about a 31% chance of winning the election -- I'd say that's about right.

Sell.

Seriously, I consider myself a very conservative person, but I wouldn't consider voting for Mitt Romney. He just doesn't bring anything at all to the table. I still think the Republicans should just concede this election now and concentrate on other goals.
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Sell.

Seriously, I consider myself a very conservative person, but I wouldn't consider voting for Mitt Romney. He just doesn't bring anything at all to the table. I still think the Republicans should just concede this election now and concentrate on other goals.

There's a lot of noise on the Republican side because they still haven't figured out how a slam dunk case at the Supreme Court clanked off the rim. I've got a guy on facebook that worked for a conservative think tank or two out of college and about 90% of his posts are carrying water for Romney/anti-Obama stuff, and most of his friends click like and have a little pow wow agreeing with it and screaming about stupid liberals and socialists.

In the last handful of days, two of his posts have included commentary that while Romney has $3 million in a Swiss bank, Obama spends $4 billion a day in debt on the government. When challenged on what would change by electing Romney other than Romney having $4.2 billion per day, no one answered. Today was that Obama's campaign has spent $20k at Staples, and since Staples was once saved by Bain, blah blah blah.

......that's what you've got now?
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

SI wouldn't consider voting for Mitt Romney. He just doesn't bring anything at all to the table.

Money.

Friends with money.

Friends with friends with money.

Romney comes from that economic strata that's like the upper crust Brits in "The Ruling Class." People so rich they aren't so much people any more as they are dynastic entities. They usually just buy whoever wins the election, but this times they've decided it's safer to appoint one of their own.

 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Money.

Friends with money.

Friends with friends with money.

I understand he brings money which supports Republican Party goals, and provides his biggest advantage in trying to get elected. However, I and millions of other libertarian-leaning conservatives don't give a rat's rectum about any party's goals or status or standing for their own sake, and won't vote Romney. By the next election, I expect another 10% of America will be on board with the realization that Republican does not equal conservative.
Also, as I understand there's no way his fundraising can keep up with Obama's anyway, so $ isn't so much an advantage as just enough to let him play the game. I guess, as a way to keep PR firms and TV stations in business, the Romney campaign at least will provide a trickle down employment benefit for a few more months, if nothing else good.

also: the correct British TV analogy in this day and age is "Downton Abbey". Nobody watches that other show.
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

and then the European compromise that decreases the chance of a Euro implosion.
Correction: delays it. The only thing their meetings have accomplished is a perpetual cycle of kicking the can a little further down the road. In a few months, we'll be right back to crisis mode.
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

I understand he brings money which supports Republican Party goals, and provides his biggest advantage in trying to get elected. However, I and millions of other libertarian-leaning conservatives don't give a rat's rectum about any party's goals or status or standing for their own sake, and won't vote Romney. By the next election, I expect another 10% of America will be on board with the realization that Republican does not equal conservative.
Also, as I understand there's no way his fundraising can keep up with Obama's anyway, so $ isn't so much an advantage as just enough to let him play the game. I guess, as a way to keep PR firms and TV stations in business, the Romney campaign at least will provide a trickle down employment benefit for a few more months, if nothing else good.

also: the correct British TV analogy in this day and age is "Downton Abbey". Nobody watches that other show.
"The Ruling Class" was a movie, not a TV show. I think you were thinking of "Upstairs Downstairs," which was the 70's version of DA. :)

Though you understand the Republican Party is at least as far if not farther from conservative principles as the Democratic Party, I don't think millions of other libertarians are there yet. We have been predicting libertarians will get sick of the GOP for 20 years, and for the most part they still justify voting R as the lesser of two evils. Even now, when it's the greater of two evils between the two majors, the Republicans can still take them for granted. By rights the Libertarian candidate should probably poll 10-15% of the popular vote. Instead, they poll less than 1%. That means libertarians are either voting D (unlikely), R (likely), another party (very unlikely), or sitting it out.
 
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Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

I can't tell if this is sandbagging or not. :confused: :)

Right now Nate Silver gives Romney about a 31% chance of winning the election -- I'd say that's about right.

Kristol's an idiot, but he's also a very dependable watercarrier for the Neocons, so it's interesting to see this gadfly approach from them. I wonder if this is an early salvo in a campaign to get a True Believer Neocon on the ticket.

I would have said it was higher 4 months ago (without Romney having secured the nomination yet). But its going to go from maybe above 30% to below it quickly.

What Romney needs is time. Time for Europe to blow up and Americans to get scared. Unless there is a major problem somewhere in the economy and Europe is the most likely reason, Obama does win...and with just a few months left, time is about up on that.
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

flagdude, you have valid points, but you make it sound like hypocrisy against the Declaration of Independence is a new thing. To which I respond:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal...
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Well, if there's ever a year where a libertarian can justify "throwing his vote away", this is it. Down ticket, the Republicans will hold enough in the House and Senate to continue to hamstring Obama, and Romney is Obama-lite in deeds.
 
Re: Elections 2012 -- Kull Wahad!!!

Well, if there's ever a year where a libertarian can justify "throwing his vote away", this is it. Down ticket, the Republicans will hold enough in the House and Senate to continue to hamstring Obama, and Romney is Obama-lite in deeds.

i c wut u did thar

Just hope Ron Paul doesn't win the suit against Romney, as he'll motivate the base. You have all the young'ins that want liberty, and the sheeple voting for Romney are voting against Obummer anyway, so they'd vote Republican if Mussolini were on the ticket.
 
i c wut u did thar

Just hope Ron Paul doesn't win the suit against Romney, as he'll motivate the base. You have all the young'ins that want liberty, and the sheeple voting for Romney are voting against Obummer anyway, so they'd vote Republican if Mussolini were on the ticket.
Il Duce DID make the trains run on time. :D
 
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