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College Football Players---Students or Employees?

J

jericho

mascot extraordinaire
With the ruling handed down that Northwestern football players can unionize because they are legally "employees" of the school, this can change the landscape of college athletics in every sport. If this ruling is upheld, I think we will immediately see the elimination of scholarships for all incoming players. I love the results of the survey that says a majority of the athletes would change majors if they weren't athletes. I wonder if there was a question that asked "how many of you would have been able to get in to the college if you weren't an athlete?" That would have been interesting to see the results.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/26/us/northwestern-football-union/index.html?hpt=hp_bn1
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

I'm smelling a return of Ivy League football to national prominence...smells goooooood!
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

jericho said:
With the ruling handed down that Northwestern football players can unionize because they are legally "employees" of the school, this can change the landscape of college athletics in every sport.
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I'll bet that the IRS can't wait to start assessing income taxes on the scholarship money! :eek:

oops, be careful what you wish for.....
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

FreshFish said:
I'll bet that the IRS can't wait to start assessing income taxes on the scholarship money! :eek:

oops, be careful what you wish for.....
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I believe the scholarships are non-taxable grants. So they should be safe. The lead guy (former QB) said it was about medical protection first and foremost, and not getting paid.

I said, cool story bro.
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

FreshFish said:
I'll bet that the IRS can't wait to start assessing income taxes on the scholarship money! :eek:

oops, be careful what you wish for.....
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Nah - they'd have to tax all grants-in-aid (including Pell Grants and other need-based grants), and there's no way they'd go that route.
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

JF_Gophers said:
I believe the scholarships are non-taxable grants. So they should be safe. The lead guy (former QB) said it was about medical protection first and foremost, and not getting paid.

I said, cool story bro.
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As they are now, yes. But if it's determined that scholarships are a college athlete's compensation, then shouldn't they now be called "salary(ships?)" and thus, subject to income tax regulations? :confused:
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

jericho said:
As they are now, yes. But if it's determined that scholarships are a college athlete's compensation, then shouldn't they now be called "salary(ships?)" and thus, subject to income tax regulations? :confused:
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Salary would be in addition to or in place of the scholarships. If they went that route. Which then would be taxable income. But even other (non-sport) university employees are eligible for grants to go to school.
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

JF_Gophers said:
I believe the scholarships are non-taxable grants. So they should be safe. The lead guy (former QB) said it was [not] about ... getting paid.
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So they are "employees" except they are not paid? I wonder how that works....:confused:




Ahhh.....i get it now. they want the players to receive payment while in college to endorse products. To me, this smells like a power play by sports agents, and has little to do with the "student athletes" and a lot to do with the $$$$ lighting up the eyes of the "union" that will "represent" the players. So they can be exploited both by the colleges and again by their agents too! :(
 
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Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

LynahFan said:
Nah - they'd have to tax all grants-in-aid (including Pell Grants and other need-based grants), and there's no way they'd go that route.
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Why would grants fall under the same category? When you look at the athletic scholarships, the student is receiving an education (payment-in-kind) for services rendered to the school. Work-study wages are taxable, essentially students performing tasks for the school with the intent that they're using the money to fund their educations. How is an athletic scholarship different from work-study? Meanwhile, Pell grants are simply money given so a student can pay for school. There's nothing else required of a student, no services rendered back to the university.
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

My hope for this whole thing is that it is a catalyst for the slow moving NCAA to actually make changes to their system for student-atheletes. So that there is a good system in place and the players don't feel the need to unionize. Then good would have come from this.

Unionization would be on a school-by-school (and sport-by-sport?) basis and would make an even more uneven playing field.

St. Clown said:
Why would grants fall under the same category? When you look at the athletic scholarships, the student is receiving an education (payment-in-kind) for services rendered to the school. Work-study wages are taxable, essentially students performing tasks for the school with the intent that they're using the money to fund their educations. How is an athletic scholarship different from work-study? Meanwhile, Pell grants are simply money given so a student can pay for school. There's nothing else required of a student, no services rendered back to the university.
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According to the Federal website they are essentially the same thing:

Grants and scholarships are often called “gift aid” because they are free money—financial aid that doesn’t have to be repaid. Grants are often need-based, while scholarships are usually merit-based.
 
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Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

If more football money has to stay in the football program to give more to student-athletes, think of the carnage in the rest of the athletic department, which is kept afloat in many cases by the money thrown off by the football program. It would depend on how big the dollars got, but the potential is there to really crater a lot of other sports if football money ends up largely staying with football. Or the university has to come up with a good chunk of additional athletic funding for other largely non-revenue sports.
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

You all seem to be overlooking one thing:

The lead guy (former QB) said it was about medical protection first and foremost, and not getting paid.
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It's so that an 18-year-old football player doesn't get paralyzed and then told, "Sorry, insurance only covers $100,000 and then you're on your own!"

This ruling will never stand anyway. Way too many holes, not to mention a favorite topic around here: Title IX.
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

Bob Gray said:
If more football money has to stay in the football program to give more to student-athletes, think of the carnage in the rest of the athletic department, which is kept afloat in many cases by the money thrown off by the football program. It would depend on how big the dollars got, but the potential is there to really crater a lot of other sports if football money ends up largely staying with football. Or the university has to come up with a good chunk of additional athletic funding for other largely non-revenue sports.
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Or, gasp, they could reduce the operating expenses of the football program in some areas (coaches' salaries come to mind) in order to have the $$$ to pay the players.
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

LynahFan said:
Or, gasp, they could reduce the operating expenses of the football program in some areas (coaches' salaries come to mind) in order to have the $$$ to pay the players.
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They certainly could. Meaning it's theoretically possible. Is it likely? I don't think so.
 
Re: College Football Players---Students or Employees?

Bob Gray said:
They certainly could. Meaning it's theoretically possible. Is it likely? I don't think so.
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I think it's inevitable. If your coach is running a program that is netting $50M to the university, he probably really is worth $5M per year. However, if you have to start paying your players, sharing in marketing revenue, etc, so the program's net return to the general fund is only $10M, would you really pay your coach $5M? Or, put differently, if the school does continue to pay the coach $5M, you can bet that they're going to be pressuring him to cut costs in order to preserve as much as possible profit for the university (i.e. increase the $10M return).
 
JF_Gophers said:
Title IX has no direct effect on this issue.
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Hmmm. I saw a story linked by someone on Twitter that title IX and players in non-revenue sports would render this ruling moot. Will look back to find it.
 
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