Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

Call me an optimist, but nothing is more trite than the tried and true "we're facing the abyss because we've lost our values" schtick. We've seen it in every GOP campaign and we've seen it in the Sanders campaign.

Here's a novel concept. Revolutionary I'm sure, but here goes. As wonderful as I think I am, I also realize the world doesn't agree with me on every issue. That doesn't make the rest of the world corporate sellouts, wusses, or complacent hacks. What happens is not everybody arrives at the same place in the same time. I personally realized this when gay marriage hit Massachusetts. When it first happened I wasn't sure why we couldn't have civil unions as a reasonable compromise. Over a short period of time, I came around to the idea. That doesn't make me a bigot. I just wasn't there yet. Likewise if someone had told me in those couple of weeks/months that I was, it wouldn't have helped their cause.

Even worse though is dismissing the heroic efforts of some people to drag the country as far left as it has come over the last few decades. Yes in hindsight actions taken in 1992 may not seem liberal almost 25 years later, but for the times they were. JFK was a liberal for the era he lived in. Nowadays people take things like Civil Rights for granted. That's not right IMHO. Bill Clinton was a liberal in his day. As is Barack Obama. Dismissing all these people as disappointing corporate shills is stark raving stupid. Yet too many people on the left seem to want to indulge in this lunacy.

You can try to win a game by throwing hail mary passed into the endzone all game and get 4 INT's for every TD (the Peyton Manning way ). Or you can drive the ball down the field over time and score that way. One method has proven to be far more successful than the other...

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

I'd really like Rubio to go away.

If you want Rubio to go away you squeeze him out between Cruz and Christie. Joey Bag o' Donuts has to do well enough in NH and SC that his campaign strategy of jumping up and down on the podium screaming "ISIS!" over and over again like a howler monkey starts to take hold among the type of GOP voters who spell "diplomacy" with ammunition.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

Call me an optimist, but nothing is more trite than...

The two halves of your discussion are exactly contradictory. The social advances and the economic regressions of the last 50 years only happened because radicals (on social issues, the left; on economic issues, the right) put so much pressure on the establishment that it had to bend so that it wouldn't break. If you could make an argument that Hillary will do something substantive about the concentration of economic and political power among a small group of Haves I would listen. But making peace with the status quo, when it is so blatantly unhealthy, is neither prudent nor admirable, and it's the real betrayal of the people who put their dicks on the line the last half-century.

 

[LynahFan]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

So now you'll have lived in TX and FL? All you need is KS for the hat trick.

Served 8 months there in 2012...and let's not forget that I grew up in TN. I figure I'm really just missing AL, MS, GA, and SC for the Royal Flush (7 card stud). AL has Huntsville, and LockMart is in GA, Boeing is in SC, and Northrop manufactures Global Hawks in MS, so I'm saying there's a chance....!

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

The two halves of your discussion are exactly contradictory. The social advances and the economic regressions of the last 50 years only happened because radicals (on social issues, the left; on economic issues, the right) put so much pressure on the establishment that it had to bend so that it wouldn't break. If you could make an argument that Hillary will do something substantive about the concentration of economic and political power among a small group of Haves I would listen. But making peace with the status quo, when it is so blatantly unhealthy, is neither prudent nor admirable, and it's the real betrayal of the people who put their dicks on the line the last half-century.

Kep, I don't know what's happened to you lately, but the anger seething through your posts is unbecoming of you. If you want to wake up every morning looking for things to p iss you off, guess what? You'll succeed. But at what price? Your Sanders supporting pals have basically labeled the last two Dem Presidents as sell outs. That's going to do wonders driving turnout in the general election. If Sanders truly commanded a liberal army that was going to overturn the political establishment, where the hell were they in Iowa? He would have won by 20 points, right? Where were they in 2014? 2010? Why didn't he command them to flood the polls and elect progressive Dems? Russ Feingold went down in 2010 for example. Why didn't Bernie's Army save him? Or is he too Establishment for you as well?

Getting elected is about making friends, not finding enemies. Nobody is saying keep the status quo. What we are saying is don't blow everything up and hope like hell a guy who's been in Washington for 25 years is going to suddenly remake the country in his image. I just don't see The Messiah in Bernie Sanders. I see another politician who I happen to like but who's proposals will only get a Republican elected with a GOP Congress, who will proceed to undo what "the people who put their dicks on the line the last half-century" have accomplished. Radicalism isn't always the best policy. You'd be far better served pledging undying loyalty to Lizzy Warren, a far more effective and realistic progressive leader than Bernie Sanders even though she's been in DC less than a quarter of the time Sanders has.

 

[joecct]

The two halves of your discussion are exactly contradictory. The social advances and the economic regressions of the last 50 years only happened because radicals (on social issues, the left; on economic issues, the right) put so much pressure on the establishment that it had to bend so that it wouldn't break. If you could make an argument that Hillary will do something substantive about the concentration of economic and political power among a small group of Haves I would listen. But making peace with the status quo, when it is so blatantly unhealthy, is neither prudent nor admirable, and it's the real betrayal of the people who put their dicks on the line the last half-century.

See my post at 3:44am yesterday. It's about 6 pages back on my 'droid.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

Megyn doesn't call me. She uses a hammer and sickle signal on her roof.

Must spread rep... (Actually, there are a couple of jokes that write themselves here...)

 

[joecct]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

This may explain Bernie

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...hp_hp-more-top-stories_pot-8am:homepage/story

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

This may explain Bernie

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...hp_hp-more-top-stories_pot-8am:homepage/story

This certainly explains his support amongst young voters and old hippies!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...juana-proposal-would-be-a-big-deal/?tid=a_inl

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

I live in a caucus state and it is a pain in the ***. I wasn't enrolled in a political party until 2008, so I couldn't caucus (although I voted D, Gore and Kerry, in the first two elections I was old enough to vote in). In 2008 I joined the Democrat Party to caucus for Obama (my wife did as well), and we ended up being the difference makers in our precinct. Instead of taking 10 minutes to vote in a primary you get to spend a couple hours at the caucus.

I get that. I do. I just don't think it's totally out of line to have to spend a few hours discussing your choice in the nomination process and hearing the other side. Skin in the game kind of thing.

And I really don't find the rules all that bizarre. I mean, have they ever lived in the US before? Have they read any of our other election rules? A coin flip is hardly convoluted and I think it's universally accepted as fair.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

The Rover Report: Iowa Style.

Before I get to the Dems, this Rubio flogging is pathetic. The guy finished 3rd even with candidates 1-2 and 4 (Cruz, Trump, Carson) splitting the Nutter vote. Yet he's the frontrunner?

Yeah, because he is seeing/predicting the endgame as opposed to a state that blows at predicting the GOP nomination over the last 20 years. He way outperformed expectations.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

Served 8 months there in 2012...and let's not forget that I grew up in TN. I figure I'm really just missing AL, MS, GA, and SC for the Royal Flush (7 card stud). AL has Huntsville, and LockMart is in GA, Boeing is in SC, and Northrop manufactures Global Hawks in MS, so I'm saying there's a chance....!

I was thinking of crazy states, not Neanderthal ones. After FL, TX and KS you need AZ for the golden sombrero of state nuttiness.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

You'd be far better served pledging undying loyalty to Lizzy Warren, a far more effective and realistic progressive leader than Bernie Sanders even though she's been in DC less than a quarter of the time Sanders has.

You keep trying to jam me into your pre-set narratives, but none of them fit. Also, I'm not writing from an angry place -- the only true anger I've felt in politics was when Dubya and the Neocons were destroying our country.

But if you're worried about Bernie that's good, because the more Bernie pushes Hillary the better a candidate she will be.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

You keep trying to jam me into your pre-set narratives, but none of them fit. Also, I'm not writing from an angry place -- the only true anger I've felt in politics was when Dubya and the Neocons were destroying our country.

But if you're worried about Bernie that's good, because the more Bernie pushes Hillary the better a candidate she will be.

^ This. So much this. So much.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

I cannot believe people are falling for this clown. He's the worst. He's the biggest fake on a stage of fakers.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/201...-carolina-sen-tim-scott-s-endorsement-n509541

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

You keep trying to jam me into your pre-set narratives, but none of them fit. Also, I'm not writing from an angry place -- the only true anger I've felt in politics was when Dubya and the Neocons were destroying our country.

But if you're worried about Bernie that's good, because the more Bernie pushes Hillary the better a candidate she will be.

Kep no offense but go back and re-read some of your posts. Call it anger, rage, or righteous indignation but you are one PO'd dude. We can debate all you want about whether that's justified or not but you're far more bitter in your writing about corporate sellout Dems who had the gall to think Obama's been a solid progressive President than you ever did about people who supported GWB.

Lets say Bernie can push Hillary leftward, but there's also a point where she and we have to step off the crazy train. IMHO his tax proposals are where we all need to jump and roll, even if the train is still moving. Feel free to launch yet another personal attack against me about having no balls or other such nonsense but that's not going to change the utter unrealistic aspects of his policies (which isn't a dirty attack against the man) and how raising taxes on the working poor is a horrific idea.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

No one captures the gravitas of the American democratic process better than the New York Daily News.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

But if you're worried about Bernie that's good, because the more Bernie pushes Hillary the better a candidate she will be.

Bernie with a fleet of D9 Caterpillars can't push hard enough for Hillary to be a good candidate, but she will be the Dems' candidate.

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - Snow White and the 7 dwarfs.

Funny comment on DK after a post about how Trump is a loser for coming in 2nd...

"Rubio won by coming in third. Trump lost by coming in second. Sanders won by coming in second. Hillary lost by coming in first. Everyone hates Cruz."

 

[Jimjamesak]

Call me an optimist, but nothing is more trite than the tried and true "we're facing the abyss because we've lost our values" schtick. We've seen it in every GOP campaign and we've seen it in the Sanders campaign.

Here's a novel concept. Revolutionary I'm sure, but here goes. As wonderful as I think I am, I also realize the world doesn't agree with me on every issue. That doesn't make the rest of the world corporate sellouts, wusses, or complacent hacks. What happens is not everybody arrives at the same place in the same time. I personally realized this when gay marriage hit Massachusetts. When it first happened I wasn't sure why we couldn't have civil unions as a reasonable compromise. Over a short period of time, I came around to the idea. That doesn't make me a bigot. I just wasn't there yet. Likewise if someone had told me in those couple of weeks/months that I was, it wouldn't have helped their cause.

Even worse though is dismissing the heroic efforts of some people to drag the country as far left as it has come over the last few decades. Yes in hindsight actions taken in 1992 may not seem liberal almost 25 years later, but for the times they were. JFK was a liberal for the era he lived in. Nowadays people take things like Civil Rights for granted. That's not right IMHO. Bill Clinton was a liberal in his day. As is Barack Obama. Dismissing all these people as disappointing corporate shills is stark raving stupid. Yet too many people on the left seem to want to indulge in this lunacy.

You can try to win a game by throwing hail mary passed into the endzone all game and get 4 INT's for every TD (the Peyton Manning way ). Or you can drive the ball down the field over time and score that way. One method has proven to be far more successful than the other...

Wow. Nice long form "* you" to those of us in the working class getting screwed over. "Don't worry, you'll get something eventually!" is not a very compelling argument.