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Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

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Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

geezer said:
That's one thing about AMERICA. Every health scare is trumpeted as ARMAGEDDON FOR SURE THIS TIME FOR SURE, whether it's anthrax, ebola, measles, or toenail fungus. It kind of kills reasonable discussion of actual risks.
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I'm surprised society hasn't collapsed yet from the latest toenail fungus outbreak.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

geezer said:
That's one thing about AMERICA. Every health scare is trumpeted as ARMAGEDDON FOR SURE THIS TIME FOR SURE, whether it's anthrax, ebola, measles, or toenail fungus. It kind of kills reasonable discussion of actual risks.
Click to expand...

Reasonable discussion doesn't sell copies, generate clicks, or find viewers or listeners. Hyperbole sells.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/02/04/schoolvaccinationrates/22840549/

"Nearly one in seven public and private schools have measles vaccination rates below 90% — a rate considered inadequate to provide immunity, according to a USA TODAY analysis of immunization data in 13 states."

That is one of the more important numbers. It does not matter if a nationwide average vaccination is above 90%, as all it takes is pockets of low vaccination to allow the disease to propagate. And just because you are vaccinated, does not mean you are immune. One would have to get titers drawn to see if they had a good enough immune response or if the immune response was retained (which is required for many diseases for some who work in certain medical fields, think heme/onc, NICUs)

Think of it as wearing a bullet proof shield that covers 95% or so of your body vs not. You may get hit and be ok, but there will always be the chance you get shot through the 5% that is missing. Still much better protection than not wearing one at all.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

WisconsinWildcard said:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/02/04/schoolvaccinationrates/22840549/

"Nearly one in seven public and private schools have measles vaccination rates below 90% — a rate considered inadequate to provide immunity, according to a USA TODAY analysis of immunization data in 13 states."

That is one of the more important numbers. It does not matter if a nationwide average vaccination is above 90%, as all it takes is pockets of low vaccination to allow the disease to propagate. And just because you are vaccinated, does not mean you are immune. One would have to get titers drawn to see if they had a good enough immune response or if the immune response was retained (which is required for many diseases for some who work in certain medical fields, think heme/onc, NICUs)

Think of it as wearing a bullet proof shield that covers 95% or so of your body vs not. You may get hit and be ok, but there will always be the chance you get shot through the 5% that is missing. Still much better protection than not wearing one at all.
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That's an epic fail of our government, health care system, and education system.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

The CDC is now suggesting that many people age 37 and up think about getting a measles shot because the original vaccinations might not have been as effective as the pros would have liked them to be.

Why Many Adults Should Get Their Measles Shot — Again

When the measles shots first came out, there were different types: the version containing “live” virus, which is still in use today, and the “killed” or inactivated measles vaccine, which was withdrawn in 1967 because it quickly lost its effectiveness over time. In fact, in a 1965 study, only one quarter of the children given three doses of the “killed” vaccine over a three-month period still had measles antibodies a year later. And even after a yearly booster injection, 43 percent of children exposed to measles developed it.

The CDC recommends that people who were vaccinated prior to 1968 with either inactivated (killed) measles vaccine or a measles vaccine of unknown type should be revaccinated with at least one dose of live attenuated measles vaccine.

The only way to know which vaccine you received is by looking at your medical records. If you don’t have specific documentation, consider getting a shot.

Large-scale measles vaccinations began in 1963, but it wasn’t until 1989 that the American Academy of Pediatrics began recommending that two doses of the live vaccine be given to children after their first birthday. That’s because if you get one dose, it’s 95 percent likely to be effective — but with two doses it’s 99 percent effective. In 1989 — and this still stands today — health officials determined that kids either be given this second “booster” shot between ages 11 and 12, or when they enter school between ages 4 and 6 years.

In 1989, 11 and 12 year olds were born in 1977 and 1978 — so anyone born from those years forward probably got a second dose of the vaccination as a kid. You may have also received a second shot if you’re a healthcare worker, travel internationally, or went to college. But given this data, people born before 1978 should check their medical records.
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Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

Well, I guess I'll ask my doctor about it then. If I were Bob I'd just skip it altogether.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

I asked my doctor if I needed a booster or anything when I was in there last week. She said I was covered with my original vaccines.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

We used to get shots at school with those staple guns, not sure what they were called but you stepped up and wam, shot done. Don't think there was much concern for blood borne pathogens. Not sure what the shots were even for as I've had most of the diseases they give shots for.
 
walrus said:
We used to get shots at school with those staple guns, not sure what they were called but you stepped up and wam, shot done. Don't think there was much concern for blood borne pathogens. Not sure what the shots were even for as I've had most of the diseases they give shots for.
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cooties.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

geezer said:
That's one thing about AMERICA. Every health scare is trumpeted as ARMAGEDDON FOR SURE THIS TIME FOR SURE, whether it's anthrax, ebola, measles, or toenail fungus. It kind of kills reasonable discussion of actual risks.
Click to expand...

I guess it depends on where you live.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

St. Clown said:
The CDC is now suggesting that many people age 37 and up think about getting a measles shot because the original vaccinations might not have been as effective as the pros would have liked them to be.

Why Many Adults Should Get Their Measles Shot — Again
Click to expand...
So, given this, it sounds like we're way below (and probably have been for a long while) the herd protection level people have been talking about.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

Bob Gray said:
So, given this, it sounds like we're way below (and probably have been for a long while) the herd protection level people have been talking about.
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Well, for people like me, born in 77, I know that I had at least one MMR shot. That puts me in their 95% immunized category vs. the 99%, where the CDC wants us. I'm not overly worried about it, but I'm keeping it on my list to aske my physician during my annual checkup this summer.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

St. Clown said:
Well, for people like me, born in 77, I know that I had at least one MMR shot. That puts me in their 95% immunized category vs. the 99%, where the CDC wants us. I'm not overly worried about it, but I'm keeping it on my list to aske my physician during my annual checkup this summer.
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'72 here. I had 2 shots, but was in the group where they were concerned about the timing, so I had a 3rd booster at age 18 in order to be allowed to enroll at Cornell. Should get me up to the 99.9% category - it's going to just be the cockroaches and I someday...
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

Bob Gray said:
So, given this, it sounds like we're way below (and probably have been for a long while) the herd protection level people have been talking about.
Click to expand...

No. Not at all. The reason for the previously stated booster is because in post-vaccine surveillance, titers of antibodies have revealed that the immunity has faded to below acceptable levels. For measles, the first vaccination provides about 95% effective immunity and the second, bumps it up to 99%. Overtime, this immunity fades in all of us (to varying degrees with varying diseases). I do not have the numbers, but lets assume it fades by 5% by the time you are 60. The people with 99 are sitting ok at 94, but the 95 is at 90 which may be to low. Given how infectious measles is, we would like that number to be very high.

Also remember, people who are vaccinated do get the disease, however, at much lower rates. Take two populations of 1000 people with the same exposure. 10 of maximally vaccinated people would be expected to get the disease whereas nearly all of those unvaccinated would be expected to get it. This allows the disease to propagate in a community and gives the vaccinated much higher chance of eventually getting the disease.

The term is herd immunity and frame of reference is important. Overall, we as a country are above it for measles by most numbers I have seen. However, all it takes is pockets below that and the disease can propagate. If you have herd immunity in your community, great. But all it takes is the community next to you not to have it and your community may be susceptible. Measles is not eradicated worldwide so it was only a matter of time for it to be introduced into a low vaccine uptake area and for it to spread.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

Certainly if it fades only slightly over time, then yes, the herd immunity would not be significantly impaired. The way several articles talked about it, I had, possibly wrongly, the impression that it faded a lot more significantly than that, at least in some cases.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

Bob Gray said:
Certainly if it fades only slightly over time, then yes, the herd immunity would not be significantly impaired. The way several articles talked about it, I had, possibly wrongly, the impression that it faded a lot more significantly than that, at least in some cases.
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Stop reading "articles." Seriously. They very seldom improve understanding and are littered with too many factual errors. Science writers are not scientists and I have yet to meet one, save maybe potholer54 (youtube) who represents the claims in a scientific article accurately. Most are written by non-science writers and those tend to be even worse.

So herd immunity is a theoretical threshold, different for every disease, based on a large set of variables. It is also very important to determine the "herd" as frame of reference is important. One of the variables is if a person is considered immune, that is, not able to obtain and spread the disease. That number is estimated based, in part, on vaccination rates and how effective the vaccine and boosters are. We may be overestimating the "immune" variable because of lower vaccine efficiency but that number (for this case) should not be a large overestimation. Although it would increase the "immune" for herd immunity, the proposed booster's largest effect is protecting individuals who are already vaccinated from new outbreaks caused by low vaccine uptake communities.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - Run-HRC? Honest Injun? Gott Mitt Himmel? RyanRubioCruzCrud?

I almost laughed out loud! Stop reading "articles"? You have no idea what kind of "articles" I read. You post good info, but you are too persnickety, especially if you think someone sees things differently than you. I await your telling all others who reference "articles" that they should stop, seriously. :p
 
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