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Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

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Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

bigblue_dl said:
Take a step back and consider this. I am usually a conservative voter, and post that way around here, I've argued with most of you over one issue or another, and you probably have had a pretty low opinion of me in the past. In this, I am with you guys, I don't think any of those things are acceptable, I don't think there is any logical way those behaviors should be twisted into some ****ed up patriotism, and I think the things Trump has said and done are horrible. I would like to think that there are others like me as well.
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Arguing is what makes this country great when it is done for the right reasons :)

(I do not have a low opinion of you...even though I think your threatened to beat me up once :p )
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Kepler said:
Both sides have problems, but let's drop the pretense that the threat to "civility" was coming from the left this time around. The tidal wave of filth that came from the right, starting with its nominee and radiating out through his supporters, hasn't been equalled in US politics since Strom Thurmond and his lynch mob.
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I won't argue with that.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Kepler and Scooby,

It doesnt matter if it is a false equivalency it is what a large portion of this country believes. You need to step back and see that or you are going to watch everything you stand for go away. Do you really think the average person in rural Michigan or in the Iron Range thinks the two dont equal? They do...they may be wrong but you telling them that wont make them believe it or change their politics. They saw Hillary's scandals and Drumpf's to be the same because they both impacted them the same. They voted for who they were told would help them the most.

All politics is local...start listening to the people and you will win. Howard Dean got that...the Clintonistas never did.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Handyman said:
Arguing is what makes this country great when it is done for the right reasons :)

(I do not have a low opinion of you...even though I think your threatened to beat me up once :p )
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in the 2012 election thread he gave me negative rep with this comment: "Go lick the halfrican in chief's taint, you useless liberal bastard." To be fair I may have called him a stupid redneck or something in response to his post of "Last night made me sick to my stomach. It is sad to see how stupid the country has gotten. I'm embarrassed to share a state and country with these liberal pieces of ****.". (but 'halfrican' seems kind of racist)
 
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Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Handyman said:
Yes the Dems need to back off this starting at the Inaugural. Point out the racist stuff but stop painting with a wide brush.
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Disagree. The 'go along to get along' attitude of not pointing out casual, systemic racism got us a president that, less than one month before the election, said five black teenagers should have been put to death because "they shouldn't have been [in a public park] anyway" more than a decade after DNA evidence exonerated them.

I don't see any reason to let people off the hook for the "I can't defend, but I will support" nonsense that Paul Ryan and Jason Chaffetz pulled during the campaign. Just because you don't want to, because it's ugly and it doesn't make you feel good about yourself, isn't an excuse to not have to.

Treat civil rights like they're not a big deal and you'll end up with another generation of Just Don't Cares showing up at the polls more concerned about the next emailz! than treating everyone by the same set of rules and laws.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Handyman said:
Kepler and Scooby,

It doesnt matter if it is a false equivalency it is what a large portion of this country believes. You need to step back and see that or you are going to watch everything you stand for go away. Do you really think the average person in rural Michigan or in the Iron Range thinks the two dont equal? They do...they may be wrong but you telling them that wont make them believe it or change their politics. They saw Hillary's scandals and Drumpf's to be the same because they both impacted them the same. They voted for who they were told would help them the most.

All politics is local...start listening to the people and you will win. Howard Dean got that...the Clintonistas never did.
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So, I have to agree that Obama is a marxist? No. That what Trump said isn't racist? No. Sorry. I have morals and standards.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

ScoobyDoo said:
So, I have to agree that Obama is a marxist? No. That what Trump said isn't racist? No. Sorry. I have morals and standards.
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I too have morals and standards. Well, morals. Moral. Maybe.

But I believe Handy is saying that we don't have to believe the right's lies, but we have to operate with the knowledge that the white working class does.

You don't criticize the gunman with the hostage. You don't make any sudden moves; you talk to him calmly and and you stall him at least until the sniper has a clear shot.
 
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Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

BassAle said:
in the 2012 election thread he gave me negative rep with this comment: "Go lick the halfrican in chief's taint, you useless liberal bastard." To be fair I may have called him a stupid redneck or something. (but 'halfrican' seems kind of racist)
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I'd like to think that I've matured and grown up a bit in the last several years. Less reactionary and less emotional, and take the time to look at issues more fully than I used to.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

MaizeRage said:
Disagree. The 'go along to get along' attitude of not pointing out casual, systemic racism got us a president that, less than one month before the election, said five black teenagers should have been put to death because "they shouldn't have been [in a public park] anyway" more than a decade after DNA evidence exonerated them.

I don't see any reason to let people off the hook for the "I can't defend, but I will support" nonsense that Paul Ryan and Jason Chaffetz pulled during the campaign. Just because you don't want to, because it's ugly and it doesn't make you feel good about yourself, isn't an excuse to not have to.

Treat civil rights like they're not a big deal and you'll end up with another generation of Just Don't Cares showing up at the polls more concerned about the next emailz! than treating everyone by the same set of rules and laws.
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^^^^^
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

bigblue_dl said:
To slightly change the subject. Did anyone listen to Trump's acceptance speech? To me, he said all the right things, and really departed from what we've seen throughout the election. Can we actually believe him? I doubt it, but I was surprised with how he actually came across during that speech.
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I thought he said "all the right things" and then I thought - I bet some of his more ardent supporters aren't happy with in. And this I saw this news today and realized his speech was just a crock. Maybe he was tired because it was, like, 3am, and he just read what someone put in front of him.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

MaizeRage said:
Disagree. The 'go along to get along' attitude of not pointing out casual, systemic racism got us a president that, less than one month before the election, said five black teenagers should have been put to death because "they shouldn't have been [in a public park] anyway" more than a decade after DNA evidence exonerated them.

I don't see any reason to let people off the hook for the "I can't defend, but I will support" nonsense that Paul Ryan and Jason Chaffetz pulled during the campaign. Just because you don't want to, because it's ugly and it doesn't make you feel good about yourself, isn't an excuse to not have to.

Treat civil rights like they're not a big deal and you'll end up with another generation of Just Don't Cares showing up at the polls more concerned about the next emailz! than treating everyone by the same set of rules and laws.
Click to expand...

If you spend your time calling everyone who supports the GOP a racist you will continue to lose.

Go after the policies, go after the people proposing them...dont fall into the trap of saying everyone on that side is evil or you are no better than the Anti-Obama crowd.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

ScoobyDoo said:
So, I have to agree that Obama is a marxist? No. That what Trump said isn't racist? No. Sorry. I have morals and standards.
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That isnt what I said. If you are going to just blindly post without actually trying to understand what people are saying what is the point?

You dont have to agree with people to LISTEN to them. Currently the Left just ignores them or shouts them down and guess what happened...again.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Handyman said:
If you spend your time calling everyone who supports the GOP a racist you will continue to lose.

Go after the policies, go after the people proposing them...dont fall into the trap of saying everyone on that side is evil or you are no better than the Anti-Obama crowd.
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No. No. No. No. We're calling everyone who supports a racist a racist. See the difference?
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Kepler said:
I too have morals and standards. Well, morals. Moral. Maybe.

But I believe Handy is saying that we don't have to believe the right's lies, but we have to operate with the knowledge that the white working class does.

You don't criticize the gunman with the hostage. You don't make any sudden moves and you stall him at least until the sniper has a clear shot.
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There it is! Kepler gets it!

The Right spent 8 years listening to Middle America...they went to Michigan and WI and listened to what people outside the cities wanted. The Left ignored them and told them what the needed from ivory towers on high. Well when one person is in front of you talking to you and the other is 200 miles away and only seen on TV it is easy to see who the average person will vote for.
 
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