Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Plenty of racist and sexist liberals out there too. I know a bunch.

Let me guess. BLM is "racist," right? And feminism is "sexist"?

 

[geezer]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

This is true: The dems were afraid of admitting that Obamacare is a poorly designed failure, and that reality avoidance cost them with the people who are being ground into the dirt. The only stated objective it ever met was getting more people insured, but the cost to everyone else (remember the "affordable" part of that legislation?) was astronomical... millions of dollars per new insure.
The only long-term solution will be to disguise/spread out the costs more: hello single-payer. In the meantime, it's going to suck even more than it does now.

 

[St. Clown]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Both of my parents voted Trump. They voted based on one issue this time around, and that is health care/insurance. In the years since Obamacare was put into place their premiums have increased by 7x, while deductibles and out of pocket maximums have increase 2-3x what they were previously. That is a pretty **** good motivator to get someone to vote a certain way, all of the other issues be ****ed.

I spoke briefly with my neighbor this morning. He and his wife voted Trump for the same reason. He told me that he has bottom-tier Obamacare insurance and paid $1,000/month this year for his family. In 2017 that same insurance - still his best deal, he tells me, - jumps to $1,750/month.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Kep gets it. At least, until his next post about nuking the South.

The South is not where this race was lost...

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

I spoke briefly with my neighbor this morning. He and his wife voted Trump for the same reason. He told me that he has bottom-tier Obamacare insurance and paid $1,000/month this year for his family. In 2017 that same insurance - still his best deal, he tells me, - jumps to $1,750/month.

$2500/month for my parents

 

[Gurtholfin]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Let me guess. BLM is "racist," right? And feminism is "sexist"?

Could you be more of a tool?

Yes, it could only be those things.

For such a deep thinking scholar, you sure do like to assign your bias and prejudices upon others a lot.

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

The South is not where this race was lost...

Why do you think I'm plotting to move?

 

[mookie1995]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

This is true: The dems were afraid of admitting that Obamacare is a poorly designed failure, and that reality avoidance cost them with the people who are being ground into the dirt. The only stated objective it ever met was getting more people insured, but the cost to everyone else (remember the "affordable" part of that legislation?) was astronomical... millions of dollars per new insure.
The only long-term solution will be to disguise/spread out the costs more: hello single-payer. In the meantime, it's going to suck even more than it does now.

rushed and poorly planned. plus allowing too many cooks in the kitchen.

as badly as hilly and the secret panel tried this in 1992, they went far extreme on the other side her.
mookie will give tD a chance to split it down the middle here.

we have semi-regulated power now. maybe that is a start for setting this up again.

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

As much as I don't like Trump, I'm in a wait and see mode. I don't have faith in him to succeed, but I'll give him an opportunity to do just that before I claim this to be a complete failure.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

I said this yesterday:

I'm thrilled to report that I have convinced someone to vote for the first time. This person told me a couple months back that they don't vote because they don't know the races well enough. I posted this (below) on Facebook last night and it apparently made an impact. I just got a text message asking how best to find out where to vote and get more info.

She told me later, after she had voted, that she wasn't going to vote originally but my post had influenced her and wanted to thank me. So fast-forward to around 10:30 PM, I had left my phone upstairs and was watching in horror. I get two text messages:

WHat's the status? I just got done with tennis

Oh f_ck

I finally read them around 2 AM and was too upset to reply.

I still want to talk to her today and let her know that this shouldn't discourage her from voting in the future. If anything, it must be a wakeup call that these things can happen if people don't vote.

It must have been horrific to vote for the first time and see everything you're voting for be repudiated in such an efficient way. A part of me felt awful for encouraging her to vote only to be Minnesota Vikinged and watch the kick said wide left.

 

[Jimjamesak]

And those people... roughly half the country, feel the same way about you.

Good and bad is a matter of perspective when people are looking at themselves.


I'm on your side, but this place is a bubble.

You can't beat them or convert them if you don't understand why they feel the way the do. No just understand it, but feel it.

Some of you are hilariously naive.

Oh I understand, I live in the middle of it and hear it everyday, and a metric *ton today. "The Government and it's overbearing regulations are costing us jobs and our freedoms!" "Obama only got elected because he promised more welfare for the black people!" Oh I've heard it. These are the people who cry about jobs going away and costs going up and then turn and tell Native Alaskans who depend on federal funding that they "can just move to somewhere with jobs."

They're myopic, selfish idiots who have zero perspective on anyone else's life.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

I think it's reasonable to wonder if turnout would have been stronger with a different candidate.

Especially since it looks like turnout is what determined this outcome.

GREAT turnout by a motivated pro-Trump/ANTI CLINTON group and lackluster turnout by unmotivated/uninspired Dems.

It wasn't great turnout. They got almost exactly the same turnout as 2012. Almost exactly.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Could you be more of a tool?

Yes, it could only be those things.

For such a deep thinking scholar, you sure do like to assign your bias and prejudices upon others a lot.

Cut him some slack...we Bernie People who voted Hillary feel it twice as bad right now. Plus he works with lots of GOPers...

I said after Kerry lost in '04 that the Dems need a new strategy...they cant play "High Horse" and hope that everyone is just willing to come along for the ride. These elections are not about policy as much as they are about making people believe you know what the hell you are doing and it will help them out. Obama did that in spades...Hillary never was able to do that. (that is what Drumpf did better than most)

It is time to get rid of the old ways and join the (metaphorical) war. Bring back Howard Dean and his 50 state strategy. Stop playing to the middle and show why people need some progressive ideas in their life. Instead of heady rhetoric and wonky TV shows they need to be out there on the ground, showing people how things can be better. Be engaged, dont be elite. Treat people as humans, but also understand that they dont care enough to remember the details they just want to know how their life can improve.

The lesson to learn is that people dont care if they are being lied to if they think ultimately their life will be better despite the lie. People didnt care that Reagan lied, or Slick Willy or Dubya and they certainly dont care that Drumpf lied 75% of the time. People want to feel good, they want to believe their lives will always be on the upswing. It is why they buckle to fear. Hillary tried but she came off insincere. The Dems need someone that connects, that has charisma...and who the people for the most part will believe do what is in their (singular) best interest.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

#notmypresident is starting to make the rounds.

I don't like this line of thinking. I find the man to be abhorrent. Or whatever word is stronger than abhorrent. But he is our President. We need to own it, learn from it, do the best we can to limit the damage, and be ready two years from now with a plan to fix the damage.

 

[mookie1995]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

mookie is just glad scarlet didn't dump her 401k as she was asking to do last night

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

mookie is just glad scarlet didn't dump her 401k as she was asking to do last night

My company stock has gone up $14 per share in the last week.

 

[geezer]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

They're myopic, selfish idiots who have zero perspective on anyone else's life.

I admire the points that Gurtholfin is making. Understand that when you vent your frustration in this way, you're doubling down on the hateful rhetoric you pretend to be attacking. "Obama only got elected because he promised welfare to blacks!" is the righty equivalent of saying Trump wants to deport all Muslims or stop women from getting any health care. These grotesque distortions are adding to other people's frustration and putting up walls.

 

[ericredaxe]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

It wasn't great turnout. They got almost exactly the same turnout as 2012. Almost exactly.

Actually they got a little less. The difference was that about 6 million less showed up for the dems.

 

[Scarlet]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

Both of my parents voted Trump. They voted based on one issue this time around, and that is health care/insurance. In the years since Obamacare was put into place their premiums have increased by 7x, while deductibles and out of pocket maximums have increase 2-3x what they were previously. That is a pretty **** good motivator to get someone to vote a certain way, all of the other issues be ****ed.

Oh, so all that will magically disappear now that Trump is in office and repeals it? Thank God!!

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XXV: Fin

I didn't, couldn't, vote for Trump for several reasons, one being the bucket of issues that can be categorized as "social garbage." I think I fall on the liberal side of center on social topic, and it really ****es me off when we as a country wasting time rehashing abortion, or fighting over who can marry who. That crap has driven me away, despite me being more of a fiscal conservative. I didn't like either major candidate, and didn't vote for either.

At the same time, I can see the motivation that drove people to Trump, even if I didn't agree with it. I underestimated how many of these people there were, but so did many people. It is a mistake to simply call all Trump voters racist, or sexist, or stupid, because they're not. Just like it would be idiotic to make similar wide sweeping comments about Hillary voters, those wouldn't be accurate either.

I hope this presidency isn't marred by endless social BS, but I don't have much faith that this hope will be answered.

Someone, I'm pretty sure it was Kepler, made a post about this. The poster said they might not be riding around a burning cross with pillowcases on their heads, but it's a sort of silent and soft racism. Or look at the sexism. Donald Trump made so many sexist and demeaning comments about women, it should have been an immediate disqualifier for him to be President. By voting for him they indicated they're ok with that. By women wearing shirts the day after saying "Donald Trump can grab me by my p***y" they reinforced that.