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Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

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Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

What decisions were those?

Obamacare for one. Luckily, at my company, they grandfathered senior employees into the original health care program (I would be one of them). The new people? They are paying out their arse for health care right now. Rising costs and such.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Wait wait wait. Romeny and McCain were completely incompetent and W was only sometimes incompetent?
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Wait wait wait. Romeny and McCain were completely incompetent and W was only sometimes incompetent?

W was more corrupt than incompetent. However, the specific instances he was incompetent were HUGE.
 
So you idiots would gladly and willingly vote for a corrupt and incompetent moron just to shoot the finger at the political establishment? What are you, six?

If you'd paid attention at all you'd know I'm not six, I'm not an idiot and I'm not voting for Trump.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

As someone who is on record as sitting this entire stupid-*** election out, the amount of heated vitriol I've gotten from people on BOTH sides, often using the exact same rhetoric ("A VOTE FOR X IS A VOTE FOR Y!!!," "HOW CAN YOU SIT THIS OUT AND LET CLINTON/TRUMP BECOME PRESIDENT?!?!?") has been very, VERY illuminating. Both sides seem to realize they've nominated the worst possible candidates, and are just rooting for their political sports team at this point.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

As someone who is on record as sitting this entire stupid-*** election out, the amount of heated vitriol I've gotten from people on BOTH sides, often using the exact same rhetoric ("A VOTE FOR X IS A VOTE FOR Y!!!," "HOW CAN YOU SIT THIS OUT AND LET CLINTON/TRUMP BECOME PRESIDENT?!?!?") has been very, VERY illuminating. Both sides seem to realize they've nominated the worst possible candidates, and are just rooting for their political sports team at this point.

Yeah, pretty much. And guess what? Given today's media, and populace, it will only get worse. "Idiocracy" is certainly turning prophetic. So is "God Bless America." (movies everyone should watch)
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Yeah, pretty much. And guess what? Given today's media, and populace, it will only get worse. "Idiocracy" is certainly turning prophetic. So is "God Bless America." (movies everyone should watch)

As I recall, the writers of "Idiocracy" actually penned a "the movie was not an instructional manual" letter to America a few months back.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Not really. Right wing propaganda, memes, and morons aside, Clinton is going to make a fine president.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

I am not rooting for either team, I am rooting for what is best for the Country and specifically me. I prefer money for education, I prefer to have an EPA that can help regulate the water and air so we dont die of poisoning, I prefer a funded Planned Parenthood cause it is better women have access to services instead of just telling them to keep their legs crossed and pray they dont get knocked up, I prefer science and research being funded, I prefer a non-crumbling infrastructure, I prefer regulations to try and prevent oil spills and other environmental disasters, I prefer national parks, I prefer equal rights...

One candidate can keep most of that a possibility, one of them is guaranteed not to. The choice is simple...

Put it another way...if Drumpf gets elected he will be the leader of the Party, a party that controls Congress. He will get to decide how to break the tie on the Supreme Court meaning he will nominate a conservative. That will ostensibly mean he will control all three branches of the Government. No GOPer will dare go against the sitting President (let alone one who beat Clinton without the help of the Old Guard GOP Base) cause they will get primaried and sanctioned by Reince "Himmler is Hero" Priebus. Speaker Ryan will start to cut the budget on everything but the military (and they will love passing Drumpf's tax plan that favors the rich) and regulations on all industry will be walked back. The Conservative Court wont help in all of these cases of voter restriction which will do nothing but disenfranchise more voters and most likely Big Business and the Banks will run roughshod again. With Drumpf's rhetoric often being racist and sexist ya gotta believe the world wont like when he takes office (or his antics) and his new "Alt Right/Racist" base will be legitimized. There is zero percent chance he walks back any of the comments or actions and doubles down cause there is no one to stop him.

If you can honestly justify giving anyone let alone a clown like Drumpf that much power (even hypothetically) then you probably never studied history and should probably do some research. (this happens every few hundred years or so and the outcome is always the same) There will be no check against him, and he doesnt have the conscience or the brain to understand the difference between what is good for the country/world (pardon the pun) trumps what is good for him.

But hey, maybe we can get our very own "V" in 20 years or so...it worked so well in the movie ;)

So while I still think he loses...I am not going to sit idly by as people try to pretend that voting for him is even close to the same as voting for her. That is completely offbase and is almost as big of a falsehood as the crap that spews out of his mouth daily.
 
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Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Not really. Right wing propaganda, memes, and morons aside, Clinton is going to make a fine president.

Yes, everyone who disagrees with Hillary is a moron. There are absolutely no reasons whatsoever to oppose her. None.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

I am not rooting for either team, I am rooting for what is best for the Country and specifically me. I prefer money for education, I prefer to have an EPA that can help regulate the water and air so we dont die of poisoning, I prefer a funded Planned Parenthood cause it is better women have access to services instead of just telling them to keep their legs crossed and pray they dont get knocked up, I prefer science and research being funded, I prefer a non-crumbling infrastructure, I prefer regulations to try and prevent oil spills and other environmental disasters, I prefer national parks, I prefer equal rights...

One candidate can keep most of that a possibility, one of them is guaranteed not to. The choice is simple...

Put it another way...if Drumpf gets elected he will be the leader of the Party, a party that controls Congress. He will get to decide how to break the tie on the Supreme Court meaning he will nominate a conservative. That will ostensibly mean he will control all three branches of the Government. No GOPer will dare go against the sitting President (let alone one who beat Clinton without the help of the Old Guard GOP Base) cause they will get primaried and sanctioned by Reince "Himmler is Hero" Priebus. Speaker Ryan will start to cut the budget on everything but the military (and they will love passing Drumpf's tax plan that favors the rich) and regulations on all industry will be walked back. The Conservative Court wont help in all of these cases of voter restriction which will do nothing but disenfranchise more voters and most likely Big Business and the Banks will run roughshod again. With Drumpf's rhetoric often being racist and sexist ya gotta believe the world wont like when he takes office (or his antics) and his new "Alt Right/Racist" base will be legitimized. There is zero percent chance he walks back any of the comments or actions and doubles down cause there is no one to stop him.

If you can honestly justify giving anyone let alone a clown like Drumpf that much power (even hypothetically) then you probably never studied history and should probably do some research. (this happens every few hundred years or so and the outcome is always the same) There will be no check against him, and he doesnt have the conscience or the brain to understand the difference between what is good for the country/world (pardon the pun) trumps what is good for him.

But hey, maybe we can get our very own "V" in 20 years or so...it worked so well in the movie ;)

This is good. I also want no illegal immigrants. I don't mind immigrants. I want them to come to this country legally and contribute to society. I want equal rights for LGBT, I want (and probably will forever hope for) racism to disappear (in obvious and non-obvious forms). I want people to work for their money (inheritance is a different animal; some people got lucky in that regard, so be it).
 
...
I tried to explain away the coughing fits and the pneumonia induced fainting, and have always chalked up the Clinton health crap as just that, crap. But right now even I'm beginning to wonder.
Is this why she made fewer public campaign events in August and spent more time in private, expensive fund raising events? The optics of her comments after the bombings on Saturday looked awful. She was haggard, drawn and her voice was missing most of its shrillness, meaning it was weak. More cancelled events today?
...

And I wonder the same about Trump. Every audio quip CBS Radio plays of his in the last month makes me wonder just how much cocaine he's using to power through his schedule.

He sounds tired at every campaign stop. Every clip I hear he speaks slower and slower in.


It's like listening to a life size Teddy Ruxpin try to use the last bit of dead batteries.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

And I wonder the same about Trump. Every audio quip CBS Radio plays of his in the last month makes me wonder just how much cocaine he's using to power through his schedule.

He sounds tired at every campaign stop. Every clip I hear he speaks slower and slower in.


It's like listening to a life size Teddy Ruxpin try to use the last bit of dead batteries.

Someone in his campaign was able to convince him to read off the GD teleprompter instead of just egg-belching his way through a speech, and while it's helped avoid the more egregious stupidity we all saw early on, he's clearly bored to death with it. Dude's a narcissist; he loves adulation, THRIVES on it. He got the big cheering crowds by being a total butthole, so he still wants to do that.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Yes, everyone who disagrees with Hillary is a moron. There are absolutely no reasons whatsoever to oppose her. None.

Sure there are. Heck I'm far from enamored by her. The problem is the amount of noise that's been disguised as reasonable opposition far outweighs the policies they should be targeting. She's a liar (not a trait unique to her), she's not trustworthy (Trump won't release his tax returns, has shady dealings with Putin..), she's the establishment (Trump may not be a politician per se but he's played the game and he's completely entrenched in the machine), she's not healthy (Trump's provided a 1 page letter from a non-certified medical "consultant" whereas records of this magnitude are generally in the dozens), etc., etc.

My problem is a vote for Trump is about allure not substance. Hillary has baggage without question - but does her shenanigans discredit her on the basis of the expected mentality a President in 2016 should have? I'd say just the opposite. I don't need my President to be Honest Abe I need them to be effective. Hillary may lie her way to the ends, Trump for me is the ends. ;)

If you'd paid attention at all you'd know I'm not six, I'm not an idiot and I'm not voting for Trump.

Not that he needs my defense but I don't have the impression that SJ is a Trump bobo.
 
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Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

In the light of Wells Fargo, should a question at "debate" #1 be on Glass-Steagall?
 
Obamacare for one. Luckily, at my company, they grandfathered senior employees into the original health care program (I would be one of them). The new people? They are paying out their arse for health care right now. Rising costs and such.

That's on your employer. My cost for my low deductible family plan hasn't gone up in 8-9 years (and it only had one small increase before that, I've been on the plan 11 years). Instead my employer implemented a wellness program to encourage healthy behavior and they covered whatever increases there were.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

As someone who is on record as sitting this entire stupid-*** election out, the amount of heated vitriol I've gotten from people on BOTH sides, often using the exact same rhetoric ("A VOTE FOR X IS A VOTE FOR Y!!!," "HOW CAN YOU SIT THIS OUT AND LET CLINTON/TRUMP BECOME PRESIDENT?!?!?") has been very, VERY illuminating. Both sides seem to realize they've nominated the worst possible candidates, and are just rooting for their political sports team at this point.

I don't think the dems have nominated the worst possible candidate--not by a long shot. Not the one I preferred, but certainly qualified. I also don't think Trump is the worst possible. Or should I say scariest possible. That honor I would give to Cruz. But as a group, I'd say the GOP primary field was as weak as it's been in my memory, and I think that is the effect the far right has had on that party--those voters who are socially extremely conservative and who are especially given to fear of diversity, foreign threat, and change generally. I don't think many of the posters here fit that description, but that base has kidnapped GOP party, not because they outnumber the more level-headed but because they are like the swing vote--whoever wants to win in that party needs those voters.

Why now? I don't see the Trump phenomenon as a finger in the face of the establishment, though Hovey made a pretty good point, as he often does. But Trump is, if anything, the 50s establishment. Make America Great Again, with him and to those to whom he is trying to appeal, is nothing more than Make America White Again. He is still living in the 1950s.

We are living in a time when people who are susceptible to fear have much to worry about. It is harder to make a living wage without a college degree. Without a degree, which is prohibitively expensive for many, you can no longer assume that if you learn a trade or get hired by a reliable company you will be able to 1) stay employed with that company long enough to retire and 2) make a living wage while you are working for them. So people are susceptible to fears about their own economic future. Although we are living in a time of peace compared to just about any time in recent history, people are bombarded by news of terrorist acts that scare them. They know how to digest the knowledge that tens of thousands of their children are dying in a war in another country, but this terrorism is something different. It sometimes happens in our cities, it does not make sense to them, and the bad guy are most certainly from another tribe. In their eyes, a Godless tribe.

So people susceptible to fear, whether it is for economic or security reasons, are susceptible to politicians who use that fear to manipulate them. Ant that is what that tail wagging the GOP dog has done. It has capitalized on fear of the godless wanting to ruin the institution of marriage and of our way of life, fear of muslims who will cut our heads off, fear of foreigners generally who will take our jobs and buy our skyscrapers. And when people's fears have been aroused to a certain point, they fear everything around them. That is where The GOP political machine miscalculated. It used fear as a tool for many years, but the mob it created has gotten out of their control.

Hovey was right when he observed that many people thought it was amusing when the mob was breaking windows over on the GOP side of town but not so much now that it is doing the same on our side of Main Street. But the swing vote population is not that large a pool, and they are also susceptible to fear tactics. Not as much as the far right, IMO, but they are. And Trump appeals to them too. He will keep mexicans and muslims out of their towns and schools without costing us money, he will find good people who know how to take care of bad buys abroad, and he will not be controlled by big money bad guys here in our own country. And if you are increasingly driven by fear and uncertainty, what is there not to like about that?

Edit: Reading this, it's kind of an embarrassing ramble. But what the heck--not my first.
 
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