Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Fact is a lot of progressive goals at this point in time need court sanctioned approval to proceed. While I agree its better to do things legislatively, you can't do that if the SCOTUS is ruling against you.

For example, we need not pass any new legislation giving the EPA expanded powers. What the EPA needs is the court's blessing as it uses the authority it already possesses to tighten emissions standards.

Same thing on campaign financing. Gun control as well. And the VRA. Until you get that 5th vote, you can pass laws regarding these subjects all day but they'll get shot down. I do agree that some libs got lulled into a false sense of security after Roberts boned his conservative masters on the ACA, and then Kennedy less surprisingly endorsed gay marriage.

IF Dems win WH, Senate and narrow gap in House, one of the first things I'd like to see done is a law complementing the Voting Rights Act. In that we need some uniform laws passed regulating what forms of ID are acceptable at polling places, requiring any such ID's are free to obtain and not a burden to obtain (no sending people to an overcrowded RMV that conveniently isn't staffed in minority areas like PA Goopers tried to do), making sure ballots and polling station access is equal across a state, etc etc etc. But, again, with an unfriendly court even if you pass that bill it will get struck down most likely despite its common sense approach to the problem of voting shenanigans.

In this election, at this time, for progressives to think big and push the envelope left, you need that SCOTUS. Its not any more complicated than that.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Fact is a lot of progressive goals at this point in time need court sanctioned approval to proceed. While I agree its better to do things legislatively, you can't do that if the SCOTUS is ruling against you.

For example, we need not pass any new legislation giving the EPA expanded powers. What the EPA needs is the court's blessing as it uses the authority it already possesses to tighten emissions standards.

Same thing on campaign financing. Gun control as well. And the VRA. Until you get that 5th vote, you can pass laws regarding these subjects all day but they'll get shot down. I do agree that some libs got lulled into a false sense of security after Roberts boned his conservative masters on the ACA, and then Kennedy less surprisingly endorsed gay marriage.

IF Dems win WH, Senate and narrow gap in House, one of the first things I'd like to see done is a law complementing the Voting Rights Act. In that we need some uniform laws passed regulating what forms of ID are acceptable at polling places, requiring any such ID's are free to obtain and not a burden to obtain (no sending people to an overcrowded RMV that conveniently isn't staffed in minority areas like PA Goopers tried to do), making sure ballots and polling station access is equal across a state, etc etc etc. But, again, with an unfriendly court even if you pass that bill it will get struck down most likely despite its common sense approach to the problem of voting shenanigans.

In this election, at this time, for progressives to think big and push the envelope left, you need that SCOTUS. Its not any more complicated than that.

We are in violent agreement.

After banning bribes, the voter suppression has got to be stopped. Maybe it's possible to nullify all those laws under the 24th Amendment unless the ID is free and universally available. Or issue a free, universal federal ID (98% of the bureaucracy is already in place with SSN) and pass a federal law that the states must accept it. Supremacy Clause, muthafukkas.

And using the penal system to disenfranchise them durn coloreds is obviously a brutalization of citizens. After you do your time your voting rights are restored in full. The state doesn't have the authority to deny you that right.

A national standard for drawing districts is just as important, but that one's almost impossible since by definition the lawmakers who are elected have every motivation to keep the system corrupt. That one has to be a grassroots movement that defies the will of Congress (well, the House at least) and the State Legs and still gets done, and I'm not sure how you do that. It would be interesting to see how the 17th got through.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

We are in violent agreement.

After banning bribes, the voter suppression has got to be stopped. Maybe it's possible to nullify all those laws under the 24th Amendment unless the ID is free and universally available. Or issue a free, universal federal ID (98% of the bureaucracy is already in place with SSN) and pass a federal law that the states must accept it. Supremacy Clause, muthafukkas.

And using the penal system to disenfranchise them durn coloreds is obviously a brutalization of citizens. After you do your time your voting rights are restored in full. The state doesn't have the authority to deny you that right.

A national standard for drawing districts is just as important, but that one's almost impossible since by definition the lawmakers who are elected have every motivation to keep the system corrupt. That one has to be a grassroots movement that defies the will of Congress (well, the House at least) and the State Legs and still gets done, and I'm not sure how you do that. It would be interesting to see how the 17th got through.

Along with ID, they need to make Election Day a federal holiday. Hell let the busses run for free to help out those who cant drive themselves. (they do it for other holidays, do it for this one) You want to make things seem more legit, give everyone equal access. If they dont vote then they have zero right to whine.

Agreed on giving the right to vote back to criminals, and we need to do a better job of making sure the wrong people arent thrown off the rolls because they share a name. Florida threw 10k people off the rolls in 2000 mostly black and urban people. This needs to be stopped...

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Along with ID, they need to make Election Day a federal holiday. Hell let the busses run for free to help out those who cant drive themselves. (they do it for other holidays, do it for this one) You want to make things seem more legit, give everyone equal access. If they dont vote then they have zero right to whine.

Vote by mail works great in OR -- turnout is in the 60s and that's despite nobody under 40 knowing what "mail" is.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Vote by mail works great in OR -- turnout is in the 60s and that's despite nobody under 40 knowing what "mail" is.

Do they provide the stamps, because if not BLM is going to protest that The Post Office is trying to prevent Dem Coloreds from voting

(sadly I aint kidding as much as I should be...that organization is out of control now)

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Along with ID, they need to make Election Day a federal holiday. Hell let the busses run for free to help out those who cant drive themselves. (they do it for other holidays, do it for this one) You want to make things seem more legit, give everyone equal access. If they dont vote then they have zero right to whine.

Agreed on giving the right to vote back to criminals, and we need to do a better job of making sure the wrong people arent thrown off the rolls because they share a name. Florida threw 10k people off the rolls in 2000 mostly black and urban people. This needs to be stopped...

Wasn't Election Day once a holiday? Not that it matters much, as many places are open on holidays because that's when you get the most business. Also, there are some states, such as NY, with statutes where an employer is required by law to allow two hours for voting, so long as you exercise this a few days prior to the day.

 

[St. Clown]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Do they provide the stamps, because if not BLM is going to protest that The Post Office is trying to prevent Dem Coloreds from voting

(sadly I aint kidding as much as I should be...that organization is out of control now)

BLM had a rally in the skyway at the Hennepin County Government Center on Friday during the lunch hours. I walked by it on my way to The Burger Place, and counted 3 black people and 15 whiteys. Add to that, the building is all tile and glass so it echoes everything. So of course they were using a bullhorn causing every word to come right back at themselves and distorting everything. It was like a badly executed bit from a horrible movie.

 

[St. Clown]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Wasn't Election Day once a holiday? Not that it matters much, as many places are open on holidays because that's when you get the most business. Also, there are some states, such as NY, with statutes where an employer is required by law to allow two hours for voting, so long as you exercise this a few days prior to the day.

It might have been in certain states, but never at the federal level.

I disagree with election day being a holiday. Making time for voting during a normal day shows commitment to self governance. If you can't be inconvenienced a little one time per year, then I don't care if you vote or not.

As to those holidays with free bus rides, those are anti-drunk driving efforts put on by Metro Transit, not in specific celebration of New Years Day or the Irish a few months later.

 

[Spartanforlife4]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

It might have been in certain states, but never at the federal level.

I disagree with election day being a holiday. Making time for voting during a normal day shows commitment to self governance. If you can't be inconvenienced a little one time per year, then I don't care if you vote or not.

As to those holidays with free bus rides, those are anti-drunk driving efforts put on by Metro Transit, not in specific celebration of New Years Day or the Irish a few months later.

Standing in line for up to four hours in some places just to show "self governance" for what is supposed to be a right is a stupid reason not to make it a holiday.

Now, why everyone doesn't take advantage of early/absentee voting, I'll never know.

 

[St. Clown]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Standing in line for up to four hours in some places just to show "self governance" for what is supposed to be a right is a stupid reason not to make it a holiday.

Now, why everyone doesn't take advantage of early/absentee voting, I'll never know.

That's a failure of the local polling locations, either intentionally (Phoenix location stories come to mind) or accidentally. I've never had to stand in line more than 20 minutes waiting to vote.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Do they provide the stamps, because if not BLM is going to protest that The Post Office is trying to prevent Dem Coloreds from voting

(sadly I aint kidding as much as I should be...that organization is out of control now)

Yes, the return postage is included, as it should be.

That would in fact be a way to drive down turnout for particular groups. Any time you make something a pain in the *** you are driving down participation by people who don't have their sh-t together. Most vote suppression is by increasing the hassle of doing things. That aint OK.

BLM is wrong that it's targeted at blacks. It's targeted at the poor. Racism is private, but hassling the poor is systemic. It's the American Way.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Along with ID, they need to make Election Day a federal holiday. Hell let the busses run for free to help out those who cant drive themselves. (they do it for other holidays, do it for this one) You want to make things seem more legit, give everyone equal access. If they dont vote then they have zero right to whine.

Agreed on giving the right to vote back to criminals, and we need to do a better job of making sure the wrong people arent thrown off the rolls because they share a name. Florida threw 10k people off the rolls in 2000 mostly black and urban people. This needs to be stopped...

This is another area where I think the Republican party has chosen the wrong plan of attack. If their goal is voter suppression as the left claims, there is probably nothing better the Republicans can do than support election day as a federal holiday. People have to take their own time, and not their employers, to vote. Heck, they have to get out of bed and away from in front of the tv to go and do something that most of them probably weren't interested in doing anyway.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

This is another area where I think the Republican party has chosen the wrong plan of attack. If their goal is voter suppression as the left claims, there is probably nothing better the Republicans can do than support election day as a federal holiday. People have to take their own time, and not their employers, to vote. Heck, they have to get out of bed and away from in front of the tv to go and do something that most of them probably weren't interested in doing anyway.

You should probably have thrown in a "shiftless" or a "lackadaisical" to complete the stereotype.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

You should probably have thrown in a "shiftless" or a "lackadaisical" to complete the stereotype.

Because I'm not naive enough to think that declaring election day a holiday from work will cause the masses to flood to the polls?

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

Because I'm not naive enough to think that declaring election day a holiday from work will cause the masses to flood to the polls?

It's not the masses. People who are unemployed now have plenty of time to vote on a Tuesday. It's people who are bogged down with other responsibilities -- kids and jobs. People who are responsible and who can't fit in what is, after all, an irrational choice.

If you want to deliberately set hurdles to voting let's at least make it something sensible. Limit the vote to multilingual people who scored at least 700 on each portion of the SAT. After all, if you can't manage that your input is hardly worthwhile to the nation.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

It's not the masses. People who are unemployed now have plenty of time to vote on a Tuesday. It's people who are bogged down with other responsibilities -- kids and jobs. People who are responsible and who can't fit in what is, after all, an irrational choice.

If you want to deliberately set hurdles to voting let's at least make it something sensible. Limit the vote to multilingual people who scored at least 700 on each portion of the SAT. After all, if you can't manage that your input is hardly worthwhile to the nation.

If they're bogged down with kids, they're not going to have time to vote. Unless you're really wanting to shoot another gorilla.

Also, you've disenfranchised the majority of the military with your SAT requirement, as they take ASVAB. Plus all those midwesterners with their wacky ACT thing.

 

[joecct]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

I've advocated in other posts that the national elections should be on July 4th and the results should be celebrated with "bonfires and illuminations" (but not AK-47s fired into the air).

Congress starts on September 1 and the inauguration is in mid-September, where the Washington weather is a lot better than in January (or March).

 

[SJHovey]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

It's not the masses. People who are unemployed now have plenty of time to vote on a Tuesday. It's people who are bogged down with other responsibilities -- kids and jobs. People who are responsible and who can't fit in what is, after all, an irrational choice.

If you want to deliberately set hurdles to voting let's at least make it something sensible. Limit the vote to multilingual people who scored at least 700 on each portion of the SAT. After all, if you can't manage that your input is hardly worthwhile to the nation.

B.S. It's hilarious how lefties are quick to accept anecdotal "evidence" that my evil boss just wouldn't let me leave in time to vote as gospel (pun intended) but anecdotal evidence of voter fraud as so much hooey.

There is literally no credible evidence that a person's obligation to get up and go to work during election day interferes one bit with a person's ability or willingness to go and cast a vote. What you hate to admit is probably 50% of the population really doesn't care to vote one way or the other.

I do have a very low opinion of the electorate in general. Segments are lazy, shiftless, lackadaisical, refuse to become informed and as a result turn out uninterested. The fact that parties feel the need to beat the bushes on election day to guilt, embarrass, force, coddle or bribe people to go to the polls bothers me not because of alleged voter fraud (which is largely mythical), but because if that is really what is necessary to get you there I don't deem you worthy of having a say in how we run things.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

B.S. It's hilarious how lefties are quick to accept anecdotal "evidence" that my evil boss just wouldn't let me leave in time to vote as gospel (pun intended) but anecdotal evidence of voter fraud as so much hooey.

There is literally no credible evidence that a person's obligation to get up and go to work during election day interferes one bit with a person's ability or willingness to go and cast a vote. What you hate to admit is probably 50% of the population really doesn't care to vote one way or the other.

I do have a very low opinion of the electorate in general. Segments are lazy, shiftless, lackadaisical, refuse to become informed and as a result turn out uninterested. The fact that parties feel the need to beat the bushes on election day to guilt, embarrass, force, coddle or bribe people to go to the polls bothers me not because of alleged voter fraud (which is largely mythical), but because if that is really what is necessary to get you there I don't deem you worthy of having a say in how we run things.

I agree that its very unlikely that bosses discourage or are even anything less than supportive on average. Its more likely the...'boy, you know I'd love to vote...but the big meeting fell on today...I guess next time'. People create short term work related excuses to not vote...just like they create short term work related excuses to not go on vacations.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XII: What Have We Done To Deserve This?

I agree that its very unlikely that bosses discourage or are even anything less than supportive on average. Its more likely the...'boy, you know I'd love to vote...but the big meeting fell on today...I guess next time'. People create short term work related excuses to not vote...just like they create short term work related excuses to not go on vacations.

When you go on vacation, you end up missing everything and have to spend more time catching up than to be productive.