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Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

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Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

So, its basically a "do Dems turn out" election. Its not too much more complicated than that.

This basically describes 90% of every election above the state leg level. When we vote we win, hence the popular vote pluralities in 5 of the last 6 presidential elections. Unfortunately, for a variety of reasons all of which to be honest reflect poorly on us, we do not typically vote in midterms.

So the question becomes, is this a typical midterm? As of today I'd say yes -- I do not see any sort of wave or compelling narrative on the left that would lead to the kind of turnout that would reverse systemic midterm losses. Add in the accident of the awful landscape of seats and as of 9/15 I see no reason to think the GOP won't pick up the Senate and increase their House majority. I'd say that this is as good a time as any to see blue dogs lose to clear the way for genuine liberals in the next cycle, but truth be told almost every DINO is gone, along with almost every RINO.

This election won't change anything -- a 49-51 Senate won't do anything more than a 51-49 Senate and the House will still be on the Crazytrain. This just sets up field position for the 2016 election.

Or to put it another way, you know how every election they say "this is the most important election in memory"? Well, 2014 is the least important election I can remember. And because of that, the GOP should prosper.
 
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Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

This basically describes 90% of every election above the state leg level. When we vote we win, hence the popular vote pluralities in 5 of the last 6 presidential elections. Unfortunately, for a variety of reasons all of which to be honest reflect poorly on us, we do not typically vote in midterms.

So the question becomes, is this a typical midterm? As of today I'd say yes -- I do not see any sort of wave or compelling narrative on the left that would lead to the kind of turnout that would reverse systemic midterm losses. Add in the accident of the awful landscape of seats and as of 9/15 I see no reason to think the GOP won't pick up the Senate and increase their House majority. I'd say that this is as good a time as any to see blue dogs lose to clear the way for genuine liberals in the next cycle, but truth be told almost every DINO is gone, along with almost every RINO.

This election won't change anything -- a 49-51 Senate won't do anything more than a 51-49 Senate and the House will still be on the Crazytrain. This just sets up field position for the 2016 election.

Or to put it another way, you know how every election they say "this is the most important election in memory"? Well, 2014 is the least important election I can remember. And because of that, the GOP should prosper.

Correct. For the last 20 years, since the dawn of the Clinton Era, the elections are all about Dem turnout. There are more Dems than Republicans, including the leaners, indy's etc, so it becomes a matter of will they vote or not. In the 80's there were more Goopers than Dems (in votes not party registration) but now its reversed. The problem is a political party can't thrive on low turnout elections for very long. The notion that the 2014 electorate will mirror 2010 misses an important point: there are less Republicans around now than there was 4 years ago as they're an older population, and there's more Dems as younger people keep entering the voting population.

Where I disagree somewhat is the idea that keeping the Senate isn't important. Its highly unlikely the GOP wins the White House in 2016 regardless of who's in the Senate majority. Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Rick Perry etc is a clown show. So, the key is gaining as many Senate seats as possible. I'd rather be starting the 2016 election with 50-52 seats instead of 48. That way when Johnson, Ayotte, Toomey and Kirk suck the pipe, as well as possibly Rubio and Grassley's seat if they mercifully retire, it gives a cushion and gets close to the magic 60 mark on legislation if you can get the dwindling GOP moderate Senators (Collins, Murkowski) on board.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

This basically describes 90% of every election above the state leg level. When we vote we win, hence the popular vote pluralities in 5 of the last 6 presidential elections. Unfortunately, for a variety of reasons all of which to be honest reflect poorly on us, we do not typically vote in midterms.

So the question becomes, is this a typical midterm? As of today I'd say yes -- I do not see any sort of wave or compelling narrative on the left that would lead to the kind of turnout that would reverse systemic midterm losses. Add in the accident of the awful landscape of seats and as of 9/15 I see no reason to think the GOP won't pick up the Senate and increase their House majority. I'd say that this is as good a time as any to see blue dogs lose to clear the way for genuine liberals in the next cycle, but truth be told almost every DINO is gone, along with almost every RINO.

This election won't change anything -- a 49-51 Senate won't do anything more than a 51-49 Senate and the House will still be on the Crazytrain. This just sets up field position for the 2016 election.

Or to put it another way, you know how every election they say "this is the most important election in memory"? Well, 2014 is the least important election I can remember. And because of that, the GOP should prosper.
It would make a Supreme Court justice appointment interesting.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

It would make a Supreme Court justice appointment interesting.

It won't matter. If the GOP wins the Senate they'll kill any nominee in committee, whereas if the Dems hold the GOP will fillibuster any nominee. Same result.

There may actually never be another SCOTUS nominee confirmed until the Senate goes to simple majority for all cloture votes, and that's about a decade away. The GOP is backed into a corner by their own extremism and they understand their tenuous hold on the Court is the only thing between them and an internal party revolution that will make the current TP insurrection look quaint and polite.
 
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Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

If only the GOP stuck to their guns to get their appointments like the Dems do. The GOP presidents over time have nominated way too many middle of the road candidates, while the Dems make sure they get folks in there who rule the way they want them to. Probably THE biggest failure of the GOP, going back at least to the Reagan era.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

If only the GOP stuck to their guns to get their appointments like the Dems do. The GOP presidents over time have nominated way too many middle of the road candidates, while the Dems make sure they get folks in there who rule the way they want them to. Probably THE biggest failure of the GOP, going back at least to the Reagan era.

To liberals it seems exactly the opposite. The Dems nominate centrists while the GOP nominates lunatics. I know you're talking about judges, but let's look at recent presidents. Reagan and Dubya were both extremists; GHWB, Clinton and Obama were all centrists. Liberals are so far on the outside of the Dem system begging for crumbs that when a liberal is mentioned as a presidential contender they are written off immediately as impossible, while the far right is at the very center of the GOP, calling the shots, and utter nutbars win GOP primaries.
 
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Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

To liberals it seems exactly the opposite. The Dems nominate centrists while the GOP nominates lunatics.
I'm not so much talking about position (though I can see that we see the subject differently), but that GOP presidents have nominated a number of justices that end up voting regularly with the liberal side of the court, while you don't see the same happening the other direction. The history is pretty clear on this if you look at a rundown of justices, who they were nominated by, and how they end up voting.

I suppose you could make the argument that some GOP presidents haven't really been that conservative, but I don't think that's what you're saying.
 
Where I disagree somewhat is the idea that keeping the Senate isn't important. Its highly unlikely the GOP wins the White House in 2016 regardless of who's in the Senate majority. Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Rick Perry etc is a clown show. So, the key is gaining as many Senate seats as possible. I'd rather be starting the 2016 election with 50-52 seats instead of 48. That way when Johnson, Ayotte, Toomey and Kirk suck the pipe, as well as possibly Rubio and Grassley's seat if they mercifully retire, it gives a cushion and gets close to the magic 60 mark on legislation if you can get the dwindling GOP moderate Senators (Collins, Murkowski) on board.
Not to get slightly off topic but, I'd love Murkowski to just bail on the GOP and go Independent. The Alaska GOP is being steered by the Palin/Tea Party crowd and, as her last election showed, she can win as an Independent. She's got pretty broad support from the middle of the spectrum as well. And actually, if she was Independent, she could deal well enough to get some breaks for the State.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

I'm not so much talking about position (though I can see that we see the subject differently), but that GOP presidents have nominated a number of justices that end up voting regularly with the liberal side of the court, while you don't see the same happening the other direction. The history is pretty clear on this if you look at a rundown of justices, who they were nominated by, and how they end up voting.

I think part of this is the systemic pressures of the jobs: presidents tend to drift towards the right, justices tend to drift towards the left. There are all sorts of theories as to why this happens, but it winds up with conservatives feeling they were "robbed" of conservative justices and liberals feeling they were "robbed" of liberal presidents.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

Where I disagree somewhat is the idea that keeping the Senate isn't important. Its highly unlikely the GOP wins the White House in 2016 regardless of who's in the Senate majority. Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Rick Perry etc is a clown show. So, the key is gaining as many Senate seats as possible. I'd rather be starting the 2016 election with 50-52 seats instead of 48. That way when Johnson, Ayotte, Toomey and Kirk suck the pipe, as well as possibly Rubio and Grassley's seat if they mercifully retire, it gives a cushion and gets close to the magic 60 mark on legislation if you can get the dwindling GOP moderate Senators (Collins, Murkowski) on board.

I agree with this -- as I said, this election is about field position so we don't want to start 2016 buried deep in our own zone. My wife has a theory which I am not sure I share yet that if the GOP wins the Senate it will actually cost them extra seats because then the House imbeciles will actually get their bills all the way to Obama for veto, and the public will read the bills and think, "Christ on a Popsicle stick, we've got to fumigate the Republicans from Congress." Imagine, say, Congress passing one of these dumb Death to Obamacare stunts. As Obama vetoes it, people will start thinking about how effed they'd be if the GOP actually got its way. It was all fine when their tantrums didn't have any effect, but now the danger would become more real.

I'm not sure the mass of lofo voters would engage like that. My impression is if somebody hasn't figured it out by now they're never figuring it out.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

If only the GOP stuck to their guns to get their appointments like the Dems do. The GOP presidents over time have nominated way too many middle of the road candidates, while the Dems make sure they get folks in there who rule the way they want them to. Probably THE biggest failure of the GOP, going back at least to the Reagan era.

This may be true of Reagan, but really, how many federal judges are left that he nominated? Assuming he didn't make any lame duck appointments, the most recent Gipper appointees have been there for 26 years. I'm guessing whether he appointed flaming liberals or flaming conservatives, few of them are left at this point outside of the two on the SCOTUS (one if which is a True Believer and one they'd probably like to have back).

So, as I often tell you Bob, Reagan belonged to a different era that's long since over. ;) If you're saying GWB appointed a slew of liberals, I'm sorry but I find that very hard to believe.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

The notion that the 2014 electorate will mirror 2010 misses an important point: there are less Republicans around now than there was 4 years ago as they're an older population, and there's more Dems as younger people keep entering the voting population.

It's true there are fewer, although remember that we haven't really start cutting into the enormous die-off of Republicans -- the super old people (80+) are still as likely to be leftover from the FDR alignment; they're also more heavily female and thus more likely to be moderate to left. The merely old people (60-80) are the ones who were shaped by the Reagan realignment. Deaths in that cohort really represent the biggest threat for Republicans worried about non-replacement. By 2020 this will start to be a serious partisan problem, but not so much yet.

Where I disagree somewhat is the idea that keeping the Senate isn't important. Its highly unlikely the GOP wins the White House in 2016 regardless of who's in the Senate majority. Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Rick Perry etc is a clown show. So, the key is gaining as many Senate seats as possible. I'd rather be starting the 2016 election with 50-52 seats instead of 48. That way when Johnson, Ayotte, Toomey and Kirk suck the pipe, as well as possibly Rubio and Grassley's seat if they mercifully retire, it gives a cushion and gets close to the magic 60 mark on legislation if you can get the dwindling GOP moderate Senators (Collins, Murkowski) on board.

We're at 55 at the moment, so to get to 60 we'd need a net switch of 5 seats over these two elections. I suppose that's possible, but I think it's a lot more likely that after the 2016 cycle we'll be right back where we are now, at 55, albeit perhaps with a Dem House.

And if we're looking at history we should beware of WH fatigue. 1988 was the only election since Truman where a party nailed a third+ term. The other 6 times it was a possibility since Ike, 1960, 1968, 1976, 1992, 2000 and 2008, the public threw the bums out.
 
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Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

This may be true of Reagan, but really, how many federal judges are left that he nominated? Assuming he didn't make any lame duck appointments, the most recent Gipper appointees have been there for 26 years. I'm guessing whether he appointed flaming liberals or flaming conservatives, few of them are left at this point outside of the two on the SCOTUS (one if which is a True Believer and one they'd probably like to have back).

So, as I often tell you Bob, Reagan belonged to a different era that's long since over. ;) If you're saying GWB appointed a slew of liberals, I'm sorry but I find that very hard to believe.
Given the long tenures of Supreme Court justices, looking back to the Reagan era is reasonable in this case. In case you hadn't noticed, one of your favorites, Scalia, was appointed by Reagan. :p Not to mention Kennedy, who is a swing vote, not in the conservative camp by any means. Less than conservative appointments include O'Connor (Reagan) and Souter (Bush Sr.). Throw in Roberts somewhat for his moving around on cases at times, and if you had four solid conservatives on the court instead of those, you'd have seen a good number of cases decided differently. No such weak links on the Dem appointments.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

And I thought the article was about an individual. Huh.

Who was returned to his seat by all those true values voters in SC.

The GOP is vulnerable to charges of being hypocrites because for 20 years they ran on the platform that they had the divine right of The Jeebus for everything they did. It is... enjoyable... to see those words turn to ashes in their mouths.

Don't want to be tarred with the same brush? Next time object when your party struts around like Father Coughlin.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

Who was returned to his seat by all those true values voters in SC.

The GOP is vulnerable to charges of being hypocrites because for 20 years they ran on the platform that they had the divine right of The Jeebus for everything they did. It is... enjoyable... to see those words turn to ashes in their mouths.

Don't want to be tarred with the same brush? Next time object when your party struts around like Father Coughlin.
Rev. Al Sharpton?
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

To his credit, he has better taste in women than Slick Willy. That counts for something; not much, but something.

Slick Willy gets a bad rap because of Monica. The women he hooked up with before the presidency were in JFK's league.

Just more evidence to never elect Southerners to anything.
 
Re: Campaign 2014: The Epic Struggle To Win The Senate And Change Nothing

Rev. Al Sharpton?

Rev. Al is a different kind of hypocrite. He's in the "play the X card" where X is the victim-group of the day. Like GOPers constantly whining that any criticism of Bibi, even by Jews, is "anti-Semitism," or Christians whining about not being able drag gays from pick-ups because RELIGIOUS FREEDUMB!!11!! :rolleyes:
 
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