What's new
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

Bulldogs 09-10 Season

Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

With UMD being on the road and Minnesota home is probably the reason why the WCHA chose to do what they did. Martin wasn't there last year either at Ridder. I'm sure the WCHA will be represented this weekend at the DECC in front of their hometown crowd against North Dakota. I'm sure the Bemidji State people are happy about that as well.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

I don't have a problem with Harss getting the majority of starts.. Steck can be a good backup goaltender but she's had some moments in her 2 years that can make you want her to stay the backup.

I guess I have the confidence in Shannon Miller's goaltending choices and have only questioned that once in 11 years (when she played Martin over Riitta in the NCAA Final in Lake Placid after Riitta beat BC in double OT.)
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

I guess I have the confidence in Shannon Miller's goaltending choices and have only questioned that once in 11 years (when she played Martin over Riitta in the NCAA Final in Lake Placid after Riitta beat BC in double OT.)

I couldn't agree more! Who knows what would have happened? The only consolation I feel about that is that WI was just a machine that year . . . I can't imagine UMD could have beat them . . . but Riitta deserved the start there . . . I'll always think that.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

Steck can be a good backup goaltender but she's had some moments in her 2 years that can make you want her to stay the backup.

I can understand your comment if it's with respect to last season, which would also presuppose that you don't cut her any slack for barely being able to skate a few months prior to the beginning of the season, (and you may want to read the first part of my original post on this to understand what else she was apparently having to deal with early last season). But what moments has she had this season that you are referring to?
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

It's just .. the few goals she does give up.. aren't usually good goals.. maybe that wouldn't happen with more playing time? I'd still like to know that she wouldn't come up injured again in non-game activities....
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

I'm late getting into this Steck debate and I admit I haven't read each post carefully, but I'm curious how people believe Steck could challenge Harss. Harss was brought in because Steck A. Hasn't panned out and B. Is very injury prone. Harss has been nothing short of pretty darn solid most of the season, minus two or three games before UMD started their huge unbeaten streak. Plus, what has she saved now, like almost 900 pucks? I like Steck, but Harss is the better goalie, and clearly has Miller's and the team's confidence.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

This is something that cuts both ways. UMD fans always claim that they are disrespected, but yet they frequently say things that are disrespectful to others, like your statement above. Minnesota fans knew early on that these February games were going to be a challenge. UMD, SCSU, and UW are good teams -- all finished in the top half of the league. The problem for Minnesota was execution at key times. We weren't good enough on those days to win more games than we did. To act like it was unheard of that we didn't wind up with more points is either disrespectful to the Huskies, the Badgers, or Heaven forbid, the Bulldogs. UMD also could have won the outright title, had they fared better against the Buckeyes a week earlier, but they were somewhat fortunate to get the two points that they did.

How about instead of focusing on OUR feelings-- we focus on the players. These young women have busted their a**es to get to where they are. Nope, nobody really expected it and I'm sure the players knew that. Yet they battled on. They grew, they learned, and they pulled it off in the end with their co-captain at the Olympics (not to mention the other bajillion players but I've about had it with that excuse.) THEY deserve to be respected with the same presentation that the U received. I'm not suggesting that BSU was the place to do that... but tomorrow afternoon? Before practice? In the middle of the day when their fans can't whoop and holler for them? Bullsh*t.

I'm on draft three of an email to the suits at the WCHA.

And ARM, don't take this the wrong way. I hear what you are saying and you are right... it goes both ways with passionate fans. I just quoted you because that seemed like a good place to start.

This all leads me to think that there's an awful lot of pontificating about our beloved teams when really, what do we know? Really? Are we that all-knowing about what happens in our respective teams in the locker rooms, on the ice, off the ice? Maybe we should be stop wagging our finger so much online and just appreciate that this awesome sport for women has grown so much and we, the lucky fans who could only dream to be in the players spots get to enjoy it so much.

Watching the Olympics this week has made me realize that our competitors are also our teammates form other teams. High school, college, and nations. How awesome is it that there is a highly anticipated game coming up Thursday where we get to see many of our Alumni playing across four nations for a coveted medal? They say that competition brings out one's true character and I think we could all be humbled by the character that many of our favorite players bring to the ice.

It's about the women. It's not about us.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

THEY deserve to be respected with the same presentation that the U received. I'm not suggesting that BSU was the place to do that... but tomorrow afternoon? Before practice? In the middle of the day when their fans can't whoop and holler for them?
I agree with you; that does seem like a very strange time. I'd have done it pregame on Friday night at this point, although the ideal time is always immediately, when the joy of winning is fresh for the players. One could say that Friday might be a distraction, but Friday's game is just the start of a best-of-three first-round game, not something like a win or go home NCAA quarter. It wouldn't be much different than a Senior Night ceremony or a banner drop at the start of the year. It could be done after Friday's game, but the problem then is if UMD should lose, it robs the event of its fun.

I would guess that from the player perspective, the trophy is secondary to the feeling they experienced celebrating on the ice with their teammates. They know that they won a championship, whether or not anyone from the WCHA showed up to confirm it.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

It's just .. the few goals she does give up.. aren't usually good goals.. maybe that wouldn't happen with more playing time? I'd still like to know that she wouldn't come up injured again in non-game activities....

I think you meant to say "gave up"...past tense...as in last year (and again, at least part of her performance last season was addressed in the first part of my original post) since she's only given up 1 goal this year. I just checked her stats on UMD's site...

http://www.collegehockeystats.net/0910/teamstats/mndw

This year she has a .979% save percentage and a .41 goals against average!!
I'd love to have a goaltender on my team who has moments like this. I understand that the amount of time that she has played this year is not a huge sampling but you have to look at what she's done with what Miller has given her...especially if you're going to hold her up to that standard for last season after coming back from a major injury as well as having to deal with the handicaps mentioned in my initial post...if you are going to be objective you have to keep these things in perspective. Which, now you've got me thinking, if you are going to hold her to last season's stats let's try to compare apples to apples...

Looking at the box scores and stats on UMD's site, and assuming my quick calculations are correct, Steck played about 2.33 games last season scattered in several bits and pieces and one start/complete game. Looks like a total of 7 goals against with a 2.99 goals against average with a .875% save percentage. Harss's first 2.33 games played this season resulted in 8 goals against with a 3.43 goals against average and a .849% save percentage....and she wasn't coming back from a major injury, at least not that I'm aware of...and she played all of this in a straight sequence except for a break of only one period. So if we're going to be objective, unless there's something else that should be considered...there you have it.

I agree that she certainly has had more than her share of bad luck with respect to injuries in the last few years but, luckily, apart from the major injury there has been only a little down time as a result...hopefully that is over with.

Here's another question for your consideration that came up a couple days ago. Steck split two series with Harss at the end of January (all four games were won by UMD) and allowed 1 goal in 2 games. Harss allowed 4 goals in 2 games against the same opponents. More back of the envelope calculations from the box scores show Steck's stats in those two games being .50 goals against/game average with a .975% save percentage. Harss's stats in her two games against the same opponents were 2.0 goals against/game average with a .9273% save percentage. That being the case would you have expected Steck to get at least one start in the next series vs. UM? Turned out, she didn't. Next series vs.OSU...again, would you be thinking it was likely? Again, turned out she didn't...and Harss allowed 9 goals in both those games and UMD split the series with OSU and were lucky to get the one win in OT. Based on Harss's performance in that series and Steck's performance in her 2 previous starts a couple of weeks earlier would it have been reasonable to think that Steck might get at least one if not both BSU games? Some of us here thought so. But again, didn't happen. Didn't seem to make any sense to us...based on attempting to be as objective as possible.

Just sayin'...just askin'.

But I'm glad that we're having this discussion since it has caused me to look closely at the stats which certainly seem to support the points made in my initial post.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

I'm late getting into this Steck debate and I admit I haven't read each post carefully, but I'm curious how people believe Steck could challenge Harss. Harss was brought in because Steck A. Hasn't panned out and B. Is very injury prone.

With all due respect, may I suggest that if that's the case that you do go back and read each post on this topic (not that there are many...my initial post is #427) so that you become informed and acquainted with the facts. Making statements like this that have no basis in reality is not very helpful. To say that "Harss was brought in because Steck hasn't panned out" shows no objective understanding of the situation and implies that you think that UMD's having only one goaltender this season would have been a good idea. Miller's recruiting another goalie, whether it was Harss or anyone else, was obviously necessary in order to rectify that situation.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

Miller's recruiting another goalie, whether it was Harss or anyone else, was obviously necessary in order to rectify that situation.

I don't think another goalie is going to be added next season . . . if you were looking at the committments thread and saw a goalie listed (Potvin) for UMD that is an error . . . she is actually going to UND.

As to the rest about Steck . . . I think if she had not gotten injured so early in the season we'd have seen more competition for the "starting" role. However, Harss took the job by the throat and has done exceptional. Coach Miller's comfortable with her and I think that's really what it comes down to . . . You can bet that in the pressure of the playoffs the coach is not about to change what worked so well all season. And, I also wouldn't rule out a Steck start if UMD wins the first game against UND this weekend.

I think Steck's had a few tough breaks here in Duluth . . . but the other thing we don't know is how she practices . . . I mean I'm sure she gives it 100% or more, but Coach Miller sees her a lot more than we do.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

That being the case would you have expected Steck to get at least one start in the next series vs. UM? Turned out, she didn't. Next series vs.OSU...again, would you be thinking it was likely? Again, turned out she didn't...and Harss allowed 9 goals in both those games and UMD split the series with OSU and were lucky to get the one win in OT.
I know nothing about Steck and can't say if your overall conclusion is right or wrong. But aren't you picking and choosing a little in building your case? Harss did have the key performance against Minnesota, with a GAA and Save % more impressive than what Steck turned in earlier. If you're going to second-guess the decision of who started against OSU, one should also concede that a different course of action versus Minnesota may not have turned out as well and UMD could have wound up w/o the WCHA title.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

I don't think another goalie is going to be added next season . . . if you were looking at the committments thread and saw a goalie listed (Potvin) for UMD that is an error . . . she is actually going to UND.

As to the rest about Steck . . . I think if she had not gotten injured so early in the season we'd have seen more competition for the "starting" role. However, Harss took the job by the throat and has done exceptional. Coach Miller's comfortable with her and I think that's really what it comes down to . . . You can bet that in the pressure of the playoffs the coach is not about to change what worked so well all season. And, I also wouldn't rule out a Steck start if UMD wins the first game against UND this weekend.

I think Steck's had a few tough breaks here in Duluth . . . but the other thing we don't know is how she practices . . . I mean I'm sure she gives it 100% or more, but Coach Miller sees her a lot more than we do.

Unless I misunderstood the first part of your post, I was referring to Coach Miller's having recruited someone last spring or summer (whether that was Harss or someone else) to start with the team at the beginning of the season that has just ended. I was doing so in direct response to the comment that DIGDOGS had made.

I agree with your comment about the practices...the point that I was making was that when given the opportunity to play this year what more can we fans of the game do other than to check the stats in an attempt to be as objective as possible in hopefully arriving at some sort of informed conclusion. They would indicate that she has been playing extremely well.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

Unless I misunderstood the first part of your post, I was referring to Coach Miller's having recruited someone last spring or summer (whether that was Harss or someone else) to start with the team at the beginning of the season that has just ended. I was doing so in direct response to the comment that DIGDOGS had made.

Apparently I misunderstood . . . hmmm, UMD had to recruit another goalie regardless of "starter" or not. Ellison and Meyer were set to graduate and Santa was not only planning on surgery, but would be centralizing with Team Sweden. I imagine Miller had her sights set on Raty, but she chose the Gophers. At the end of the season Steck was the only goalie remaining on the roster! I'm sure Miller believed that Steck would and could do the job but the team still needed someone else. Then, Steck got injured again and well . . . .

And as a fan, I simply try to support the players that are out there . . . I don't put too much effort into understanding why. There's just so much more to it than we fans are privy to.
 
Last edited:
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

I know nothing about Steck and can't say if your overall conclusion is right or wrong. But aren't you picking and choosing a little in building your case? Harss did have the key performance against Minnesota, with a GAA and Save % more impressive than what Steck turned in earlier. If you're going to second-guess the decision of who started against OSU, one should also concede that a different course of action versus Minnesota may not have turned out as well and UMD could have wound up w/o the WCHA title.

I don't think that it was cherry picking information. I didn't say that Harss didn't play well vs. UM...but back up a bit to look at the bigger picture as it unfolded chronologically in order to compare the two with what information was available after Steck had had those two starts and played extremely well. After being able to compare the two after splitting two series and having one play better than the other was it not a reasonable question to ask whether one would have thought that she would start at least one of the UM games? After all, why did Miller play her if not to test her. And if she, or any other player in that situation, doesn't perform well then, sure, let her sit. But when she plays almost as well as is possible, stats wise, what is your next logical step?...let her sit?...for the next 6 games until the season is over?...even when the other goalie is obviously struggling?...after almost dropping a series to OSU? Again, we're just asking "what is reasonable, what is logical, what would seem to make sense in this or any situation, given the facts"? (Not wanting to broaden the scope of this conversation lest the focus is lost, I will ask you a question about UM...last season, sans Raty, if Grogan had struggled in a series do you think Frost would have hesitated in playing Lura in the next series, or vice versa?)

If we take your smaller sampling of the UM series where Harss played well, can we conclude that it was logical to play her vs.OSU?...of course we can.
But that is something that is closer to being definable as cherry picking information since it ignores the entire process and how this has unfolded chronologically, from the beginning. After the way that Harss struggled in the OSU series do you not think it would have been reasonable to ask whether Steck was going to start in one if not both BSU games given the way that she played in the two starts that she was given a couple of weeks earlier?

Your last sentence, while I understand your point, is just hypothesizing. That cuts both ways. Taking your lead, we can also concede that a different course of action in the OSU series may have turned out better and that UMD might have won the championship outright, instead of sharing it with UM.

Again, the discussions on this end, as mentioned previously, have not been centered on hypothesizing but rather around what would seem to make sense, logically, in each situation given the facts available...but meaning the facts of the entire situation as it has chronologically unfolded from the beginning. How else can one attempt to be completely objective?

By the way, everyone's input has been appreciated. We're all fans of the game.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

Now how about getting back to the fact that we are co-champs!! and 1st see in the WCHA!! We have some huge games ahead.....lets go ladies!!!;)
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

Your last sentence, while I understand your point, is just hypothesizing.
That's true. And a bunch of people on here will tell you that when I put myself in the position of defending Coach Miller, it is unfamiliar territory for me.;) But what she did makes sense to me. By her own admission, she had kind of written off the conference race at one point, so she was a little quicker to experiment with the goalie position. But that first game of the Minnesota series went a long way toward changing UMD's chances in the WCHA, and thereafter, I think she tried to do what she thought gave her team the best chance to win that day. Harss and Steck may have started out roughly the same, but after one has played a lot while the other played sparingly, Harss is just more battle-tested. It wasn't that long ago that coaches had a few games where the outcome was less in doubt and they could afford to start a goalie who may be green or have some rust. It's a lot harder to find those games on the schedule now.
 
Re: Bulldogs 09-10 Season

Now how about getting back to the fact that we are co-champs!! and 1st see in the WCHA!! We have some huge games ahead.....lets go ladies!!!;)

Well, okay. You axed for it....

4385164296_cd33841ae2.jpg


I didn't get much in the way of pictures, but if you're thoroughly bored and didn't get down to the Heritage and want to see more, here you go:
WCHA trophy presentation at Heritage

It wasn't much of a ceremony being a weekday afternoon and fans only having one day's notice, but whatever. The ladies suited up and had a good time with it. Wong and Wilson were goofing around skating like figure skaters in full hockey gear which was hilarious. Steck was pushing Larocque around on her knees like they were curling or something. So they were all in a good mood and why not? It's only their fourth regular season title. Now it's on to the playoffs this weekend!
 
Last edited:
Back
Top