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BU 2021-22: Albie's Great Adventure

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ericredaxe said:
So if true that they are bringing Albie back in again, that kind of goes with what my gut feeling was on what BU might be thinking. I do like the coaching staff moves he made last year and they have improved a little bit each year (albeit baby steps) - add to that a weird COVID year where BU was probably the most restrictive school of those who actually played...plus likely some hesitancy of having just gotten burned by Quinn jumping to the NHL and not wanting to go through that again in 3 or 4 years, I can see why they would stick with him for another year.

I'm surprised that you guys would give up your season tickets over one more year. The team was exciting to watch for a good stretch this year and the games are still fun. (If you are giving up season tickets because its a pain in the *** to get into the city with traffic and the concession food sucks etc I can 100% understand that)

If you do give them up, what would it take to bring you back? Lets say Albie does indeed stay and they have a season that more of less mirrors this years record, but they don't lose the Sacred Heart and Maine games and finish 12th in the PWR would that do it? That plus make the Garden or win an NCAA game? Win Hockey East?

Lets keep the faith and see what happens.

Now - roster - what will next year look like?

Schedule - other than they mentioned Notre Dame, who do we know of for OOC games? Does the unbalanced Hockey East schedule stay the same every year? Or do the teams we play 3x vs 2x rotate each year?

Edit: One other question - are all coaches (hockey and other sports) under specified contract lengths? Or are some just simply hired by a university the same as any other employee and could decide to leave / be terminated etc at any time?
Click to expand...

Who said that was true ? Because some guy posted it ? I don’t see that happening nor do I see them offering a one year contract … maybe there is a push to bring back quinny and let pando mentor under him
 
ColinWilsonFan said:
Who said that was true ? Because some guy posted it ? I don’t see that happening nor do I see them offering a one year contract … maybe there is a push to bring back quinny and let pando mentor under him
Click to expand...

No idea if it is true or not. Just going on what others posted which is why i started my post with "If true".

Either way it is interesting to follow.
 
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ColinWilsonFan said:
Who said that was true ? Because some guy posted it ? I don’t see that happening nor do I see them offering a one year contract … maybe there is a push to bring back quinny and let pando mentor under him
Click to expand...
So I'm just some guy, despite using my actual name. By the way, I didn't say it was true, but it was what I heard from a trusted source.

Sean
 
BU should absolutely be wiling to go outside the alumni group when looking for a new coach, unless there is a clear candidate that wants the job. Names that are not interested (presumably) like Mike Sullivan and John Hynes are ones I would just hand the job to if they wanted it. I know they haven't coached in college (at least as a HC) but they were 4 year players at BU and know what it is all about. Next would be Quinn, who I would welcome back, though we should remember that many people (including myself) were questioning his actual coaching ability at times. Remember the "all he had to do was open the door for Eichel every third shift" comments?

After those three, then I think if someone like Lang is available and interested, by all means lets give him strong consideration. Let's not require a BU degree...
 
Sean Pickett said:
It's already been three "one more years."
Click to expand...

I think this perfectly sums up why a one-year extension is a horrible idea.

None of the following are true:
  • A program-changing recruit is coming next year (eg: Eichel, Makar)
  • Injury(ies) the previous season significantly impacted the team's record, especially if they impacted playoff games and that player(s) will return next year
  • There is a noticeable upward trajectory in overall recruiting over the past 3-4 seasons
  • There is a noticeably upward trajectory in overall team performance over the past 3-4 seasons
  • This past season's roster had fatal-flaw goaltending issues that will be rectified next year with recruits or transfers
If any of the above conditions were true, you could make the case that "one more chance" could yield success. Since they're all false, the administration should consider two questions:
  • What's the evidence that "one more chance" with Albie means he'll finally get it right and the team will succeed?
  • What would be the definition of "success" for 22-23 under Albie?
The 22-23 roster will not be markedly better - what's their realistic ceiling? Does anyone believe we'll be sitting here a year from now getting ready for a semifinal HE game as the favored team with our at-large 2 seed firmly locked up and an outside chance at a 1? Absolutely not.

That realistic* ceiling is:
  • Making HE semis
  • ~18/19-win regular season
  • Low 3/High 4-seed in the NCAA that almost certainly ends in an SCSU-like blowout
Is that success? It should not be at BU. If that's the case, bringing Albie back for one year is kicking the can down the road and prolonging his inevitable separation next offseason while continuing to damage the brand and the relationship with the fanbase.

They must move on now.




*I'm defining realistic as what's in the middle 80% of the spectrum of probable outcomes. I'm intentionally ignoring the outside 10% chances on either end of the spectrum that result in a complete meltdown or they magically make a NC run.
 
brassbonanza said:
I think this perfectly sums up why a one-year extension is a horrible idea.

None of the following are true:
  • A program-changing recruit is coming next year (eg: Eichel, Makar)
  • Injury(ies) the previous season significantly impacted the team's record, especially if they impacted playoff games and that player(s) will return next year
  • There is a noticeable upward trajectory in overall recruiting over the past 3-4 seasons
  • There is a noticeably upward trajectory in overall team performance over the past 3-4 seasons
  • This past season's roster had fatal-flaw goaltending issues that will be rectified next year with recruits or transfers
If any of the above conditions were true, you could make the case that "one more chance" could yield success. Since they're all false, the administration should consider two questions:
  • What's the evidence that "one more chance" with Albie means he'll finally get it right and the team will succeed?
  • What would be the definition of "success" for 22-23 under Albie?
The 22-23 roster will not be markedly better - what's their realistic ceiling? Does anyone believe we'll be sitting here a year from now getting ready for a semifinal HE game as the favored team with our at-large 2 seed firmly locked up and an outside chance at a 1? Absolutely not.

That realistic* ceiling is:
  • Making HE semis
  • ~18/19-win regular season
  • Low 3/High 4-seed in the NCAA that almost certainly ends in an SCSU-like blowout
Is that success? It should not be at BU. If that's the case, bringing Albie back for one year is kicking the can down the road and prolonging his inevitable separation next offseason while continuing to damage the brand and the relationship with the fanbase.

They must move on now.




*I'm defining realistic as what's in the middle 80% of the spectrum of probable outcomes. I'm intentionally ignoring the outside 10% chances on either end of the spectrum that result in a complete meltdown or they magically make a NC run.
Click to expand...

You have many valid points but the college hockey scene changes so rapidly now with players signing and the transfer portal that team can make drastic improvements or drastic declines pretty fast. Michigan is going to lose about 12-14 players at the end of the season and will be bringing in 13 freshman/signees and that doesn't include transfers. BU should be veteran laden with the goaltending to win a national title. What they do need is to find some more consistent scorers and more players with heart. The core is there. They also need a new coach in my opinion that will get the most of the talent - a tall task I know. There isnt a team in Hockey East that will be far and away the best next season so anything is possible if they make some improvements.
 
ColinWilsonFan said:
maybe there is a push to bring back quinny and let pando mentor under him
Click to expand...
That would neatly explain why BU might want to give Coach O'Connell one more year. Maybe BU approached Coach Quinn about returning and he said he was interested, but not until his contract with the Rangers runs out next year so he gets every dollar out of it. If you want to go "deep state" maybe BU won't tell Coach O'Connell he's just an interim head coach until the triumphant return of Coach Quinn.

Or maybe Drew Marrochello is just having a hard time admitting that hiring Coach O'Connell was a mistake. I certainly had a hard time admitting that I backed the wrong candidate and it wasn't my decision.

Sean
 
Sean Pickett said:
That would neatly explain why BU might want to give Coach O'Connell one more year. Maybe BU approached Coach Quinn about returning and he said he was interested, but not until his contract with the Rangers runs out next year so he gets every dollar out of it.
Click to expand...

I was actually thinking if this might be a reason - that whoever they wanted (didn't even think of Quinn) wouldn't be available till the 23-24 season and BU didn't want to pay to get whoever out of a contract, blah blah blah. Or something like that.
 
defkit said:
BU should absolutely be wiling to go outside the alumni group when looking for a new coach, unless there is a clear candidate that wants the job. Names that are not interested (presumably) like Mike Sullivan and John Hynes are ones I would just hand the job to if they wanted it. I know they haven't coached in college (at least as a HC) but they were 4 year players at BU and know what it is all about. Next would be Quinn, who I would welcome back, though we should remember that many people (including myself) were questioning his actual coaching ability at times. Remember the "all he had to do was open the door for Eichel every third shift" comments?

After those three, then I think if someone like Lang is available and interested, by all means lets give him strong consideration. Let's not require a BU degree...
Click to expand...

Partly playing devils advocate and partly asking seriously - Is Lang widely considered one of the great up and coming coaches? I haven't really done much research until now...
  • I see he has won Atlantic Hockey Coach of the year a couple of times which is a good honor.
  • His overall record at AIC is 102-85-17 (not a significantly higher win percentage than what Albie has done and against a lower level of competition)
  • His record in that time against teams not in Atlantic Hockey is 6-31-1. (And two of those wins were against LIU. They did have an impressive win in the first round of the NCAA's a couple of years ago)
On paper at least, that isn't screaming to me "we better move now or we are going to lose this guy" (and who knows if he even wants to leave his Alma Mater) - If they do bring Albie back for a year and it does not work out, I'd be equally comfortable tossing the keys to Pando (if he wants it) or one of the other Alums who have been mentioned in the past. Did Joe Sacco ever complete his degree?
 
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ericredaxe said:
Partly playing devils advocate and partly asking seriously - Is Lang widely considered one of the great up and coming coaches? I haven't really done much research until now...
  • I see he has won Atlantic Hockey Coach of the year a couple of times which is a good honor.
  • His overall record at AIC is 102-85-17 (not a significantly higher win percentage than what Albie has done and against a lower level of competition)
  • His record in that time against teams not in Atlantic Hockey is 6-31-1. (And two of those wins were against LIU. They did have an impressive win in the first round of the NCAA's a couple of years ago)
On paper at least, that isn't screaming to me "we better move now or we are going to lose this guy" (and who knows if he even wants to leave his Alma Mater) - If they do bring Albie back for a year and it does not work out, I'd be equally comfortable tossing the keys to Pando (if he wants it) or one of the other Alums who have been mentioned in the past. Did Joe Sacco ever complete his degree?
Click to expand...

My primary concern with Lang is he's never coached, at any level, at a big time program like BU. That means he hasn't dealt with all the peripheral things involved with being the HC there. The hangers-on involved with players and recruits as well as the people surrounding the program - donors, season ticket holders, administrators, etc. It can be a lot and you need to be able prioritize, delegate, and still run your team.
 
mookie1995 said:
At what point do we stop being a big time program? How long exactly are them coattails?
Click to expand...

I would ask, where is Lang supposed to go to get that next chance? Should he be looking to become an associate head coach at a bigger program? I just see a guy who has worked miracles at AIC.
 
ericredaxe said:
Partly playing devils advocate and partly asking seriously - Is Lang widely considered one of the great up and coming coaches? I haven't really done much research until now...
  • I see he has won Atlantic Hockey Coach of the year a couple of times which is a good honor.
  • His overall record at AIC is 102-85-17 (not a significantly higher win percentage than what Albie has done and against a lower level of competition)
  • His record in that time against teams not in Atlantic Hockey is 6-31-1. (And two of those wins were against LIU. They did have an impressive win in the first round of the NCAA's a couple of years ago)
On paper at least, that isn't screaming to me "we better move now or we are going to lose this guy" (and who knows if he even wants to leave his Alma Mater) - If they do bring Albie back for a year and it does not work out, I'd be equally comfortable tossing the keys to Pando (if he wants it) or one of the other Alums who have been mentioned in the past. Did Joe Sacco ever complete his degree?
Click to expand...
Regarding overall records:

[TABLE="width: 439"]
[TR]
[TD]Career[/TD]
[TD="class: xl69"] [/TD]
[TD]GC[/TD]
[TD]W[/TD]
[TD]L[/TD]
[TD]T[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65"]Pct.[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65"]W%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: #ffffcc"]Eric Lang[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68, bgcolor: #ffffcc"]AIC[/TD]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]205[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]103[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]85[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]17[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]0.544[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]0.502[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: #ffffcc"]Albie O'Connell[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68, bgcolor: #ffffcc"]BU[/TD]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]123[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]58[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]49[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]16[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]0.537[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: #ffffcc, align: right"]0.472[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


Not only is Eric Lang's record better, his Win% is above 0.500, meaning he's won over half his games and he has three 20 win seasons to Coach O'Connell's zero. Furthermore, comparing their records head-to-head overlooks where each program was when they took over. Coach O'Connell took over a program with a 0.638 winning percentage since WWII, had just won the Hockey East tournament and had been to 4 straight NCAA tournaments. Coach Lang took over a program with a 0.354 winning percentage since WWII and had just completed their 22nd consecutive losing season (only two of which could even see the underside of 0.500).

Just because: Coach O'Connell is a not so impressive 10-15-2 against teams not in Hockey East (and two of those wins were against Brown)

As for not wanting to leave his Alma Mater that didn't stop Mel Pearson, Greg Carvel and Bob Motzko from leaving their Alma Maters for bigger programs (and more money).

In the past there have been those here who have complained about how BU teams under Coach O'Connell haven't been able to win games in which they have led. Over the past 4 seasons AIC has the 7th best record with the lead and 7th best win%, while BU has the 32nd best record and the 39th best win%. When blowing a lead (i.e., they were tied up or lost the lead) AIC has the 4th best record while BU has the 37th best record.

[TABLE="width: 655"]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl65"] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl70"] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, colspan: 4"] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, colspan: 4"] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, colspan: 3"]Win Pct.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl65"] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl70"] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, colspan: 4"]Record with Lead[/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, colspan: 4"]Blown Lead Record[/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl70, colspan: 3"]with Lead[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl67"]Team[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70"]League[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]W[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]L[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]T[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]Pct.[/TD]
[TD="class: xl69"] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]W[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]L[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]T[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]Pct.[/TD]
[TD="class: xl69"] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]W[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]BL[/TD]
[TD="class: xl68"]Pct.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl65"]AIC[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70"]AHA[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]80[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]15[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]3[/TD]
[TD="class: xl66, align: right"]0.832[/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]33[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]15[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]3[/TD]
[TD="class: xl66, align: right"]0.676[/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]80[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]18[/TD]
[TD="class: xl66, align: right"]0.816[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl65"]Boston University[/TD]
[TD="class: xl70"]HEA[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]58[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]18[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]13[/TD]
[TD="class: xl66, align: right"]0.725[/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]16[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]18[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]13[/TD]
[TD="class: xl66, align: right"]0.479[/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]58[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, align: right"]31[/TD]
[TD="class: xl66, align: right"]0.652[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


So Coach Lang's teams have done better with the lead and when they've blown a lead they've done better in retaking the lead and winning the game.

Also Coach Lang is just the fourth DI head coach since WWII to win 4 consecutive regular season titles, joining Coaches Parker (5, 2 shared), Hastings (5), and Berenson in that select group.

I also don't believe that BU can "toss the keys" to another coach without head coaching experience and who will have to learn on the job.

brassbonanza said:
My primary concern with Lang is he's never coached, at any level, at a big time program like BU. That means he hasn't dealt with all the peripheral things involved with being the HC there. The hangers-on involved with players and recruits as well as the people surrounding the program - donors, season ticket holders, administrators, etc. It can be a lot and you need to be able prioritize, delegate, and still run your team.
Click to expand...
So you're saying there's none of that at "small time programs" like AIC? Or are you saying that he wouldn't be able to handle it? Norm Bazin took over at UML and did fine.

Personally, I want a head coach who can coach from the bench and Eric Lang has proven that he can.

Sean
 
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Sean Pickett said:
So you're saying there's none of that at "small time programs" like AIC? Or are you saying that he wouldn't be able to handle it? Norm Bazin took over at UML and did fine.

Personally, I want a head coach who can coach from the bench and Eric Lang has proven that he can.

Sean
Click to expand...

First, I never said he wouldn't be able to - only that it was a concern. Lang's coaching career is entirely in the AHA and D2 at AIC, Manhattanville, and Army. He has never coached a game at any level in HE, ECAC, WCHA, CCHA, NCHC, USA Hockey, or the NHL. Jumping from that to BU is a huge step. Never said Lang couldn't, only that it's a point of concern.

Norm had 11 seasons of assistant experience at Lowell and CC. Similarly, Carvel and Leaman both had assistant and HC experience in HE, ECAC, or the NHL.

And yes, I am saying that there's nothing similar to what I described above at AIC as there would be at BU. Again, it's a concern not an exclusion.
 
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