Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

[uaafanblog]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

OK...for the past nine years, all I've read here is "Penn State doesn't have real hockey," "when is Penn State going to have real hockey," blah, blah.....

So now we are going to have "real" hockey (their words, not mine) in Happy Valley and 18 months away from the first faceoff of the modern era of Penn State varsity hockey and the school is being blamed for the demise of college hockey.

I'm personally happy that Penn State added hockey and that the BTHC looks to be a reality in the next couple of days.

The hegemony of the Big Ten schools in the WCHA has been quite tiresome for quite some time. Minnesota and Wisconsin have essentially dictated the path of the conference and had the ice tilted in their favor before any teams even hit the ice. They have kept my school and it's primary rival separate while cashing in and getting to to fully experience their own rivalries. That problem may still take some time to resolve itself but it wouldn't have had a chance with Minnesota and Wisconsin in the league.

College sports in general aren't an egalitarian entity so anytime the artificially unleveled playing field is leveled somewhat ... it's a good thing. Let the 4 of the Big 10 schools beat up on one another and walk all over the other two. I don't know that Penn State will become any more relevant in hockey than Ohio State. Perhaps the dirty FRACKING money will be enough. We'll see.

What I do know is that the recruiting field amongst the remaining members of the WCHA will become slightly more even. Big 10 schools are going to continue to get more than their even share of elite recruits. Penn State's addition probably means slightly fewer of those guys (a couple a year) won't go to DU or UND. And that's good for the rest of the WCHA teams.

For too long in the past we've seen Michigan, Michigan St., Minnesota and Wisconsin in the NCAA's. That won't happen nearly as often when they're finally competing against other programs with the same grotesquely huge athletic department budgets.

Yay for D-II schools in D-I hockey. Finally, some small amount of pressure from being under the thumbs of these huge schools will be alleviated. It's about time.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

I'm personally happy that Penn State added hockey and that the BTHC looks to be a reality in the next couple of days.

Your conference will guarantee your program less money in the future as revenue is lost due to lower attendance at the Final Five and lower gate receipts from the first round series that will be in smaller venues than Kohl and Mariucci.

The hegemony of the Big Ten schools in the WCHA has been quite tiresome for quite some time. Minnesota and Wisconsin have essentially dictated the path of the conference and had the ice tilted in their favor before any teams even hit the ice.

Please elaborate. If you're talking about the Final Five site location (Milwaukee and St. Paul), this has been argued to death over the years, and the obvious conclusion is St. Paul provides the highest profits for the league - which translates to significant money for its members - which is the point of selecting a site in the first place. If you want to go truly neutral and make everybody fly or drive a long way to attend this event, you're going to kill its profitability and push the lesser programs closer to the brink that rely on this funding stream. If you're referencing something else, you'll have to specify because I can't decipher what you're alluding to here.

They have kept my school and it's primary rival separate while cashing in and getting to to fully experience their own rivalries. That problem may still take some time to resolve itself but it wouldn't have had a chance with Minnesota and Wisconsin in the league.

It's funny that you are basically calling them selfish while at the same time advocating a point that is itself selfish (what about me? what about MY school's rivalry?). You spout off as if MN and UW are the only members in the league that can cast a vote. It's not like the UN security council - they don't have veto power. If the league wanted to add UAF instead of UNO or Bemidji when it entered its expansion phase, the other eight members could have voted in favor and ratified it over UW and MN's objections. Call it a hunch, but I'm guessing that many other programs would also be opposed to that addition due to the increased travel costs.

Penn State's addition probably means slightly fewer of those guys (a couple a year) won't go to DU or UND. And that's good for the rest of the WCHA teams.

It's premature to say who Penn State will be battling with for recruits as that depends on who the coach is and where the focus turns for players. My off the cuff guess is the program will be fighting it out with mainly CCHA/ECACHL/HE schools due to their geographic location.

For too long in the past we've seen Michigan, Michigan St., Minnesota and Wisconsin in the NCAA's. That won't happen nearly as often when they're finally competing against other programs with the same grotesquely huge athletic department budgets.

Keep the following in mind: instead of 28 conference games split equally at home and on the road, the BTHC schools will have just 20 of those games. The remainder will be non conference, and most of those will be at home if previous schedules mean anything (all six of MN's non conference games were at home this past season). Remember, money talks. The MN's of the world can offer significant financial enticement to schools to play in Minneapolis rather than bothering with any sort of equitable arrangement.

Finally, some small amount of pressure from being under the thumbs of these huge schools will be alleviated. It's about time.

It won't be alleviated. If anything, I suspect the small programs' dependence on the bigger schools will become even clearer (when a number of programs fold). I hope I'm wrong on this, but I doubt it.

 

[Hockeybuckeye]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

You know I really think things should be left alone and Penn State should be added to an existing conference. Just got back today from the CCHA Finals at the Joe in Detroit and it's an event I enjoy throughly even when my team isn't there. I hear the Big Ten is considering having their playoffs in Chicago and I will just not go. For me college hockey at the Joe is as much fun as the Frozen 4.

 

[Tipsy McStagger]

You know I really think things should be left alone and Penn State should be added to an existing conference. Just got back today from the CCHA Finals at the Joe in Detroit and it's an event I enjoy throughly even when my team isn't there. I hear the Big Ten is considering having their playoffs in Chicago and I will just not go. For me college hockey at the Joe is as much fun as the Frozen 4.

I watched the miami/notre dame game Friday and there was 1,000 people there at the most. I doubt the big ten is going to have it there if that is the embarassing attendance the two michigan schools currently draw.

 

[Tipsy McStagger]

I'm personally happy that Penn State added hockey and that the BTHC looks to be a reality in the next couple of days.

The hegemony of the Big Ten schools in the WCHA has been quite tiresome for quite some time. Minnesota and Wisconsin have essentially dictated the path of the conference and had the ice tilted in their favor before any teams even hit the ice. They have kept my school and it's primary rival separate while cashing in and getting to to fully experience their own rivalries. That problem may still take some time to resolve itself but it wouldn't have had a chance with Minnesota and Wisconsin in the league.

College sports in general aren't an egalitarian entity so anytime the artificially unleveled playing field is leveled somewhat ... it's a good thing. Let the 4 of the Big 10 schools beat up on one another and walk all over the other two. I don't know that Penn State will become any more relevant in hockey than Ohio State. Perhaps the dirty FRACKING money will be enough. We'll see.

What I do know is that the recruiting field amongst the remaining members of the WCHA will become slightly more even. Big 10 schools are going to continue to get more than their even share of elite recruits. Penn State's addition probably means slightly fewer of those guys (a couple a year) won't go to DU or UND. And that's good for the rest of the WCHA teams.

For too long in the past we've seen Michigan, Michigan St., Minnesota and Wisconsin in the NCAA's. That won't happen nearly as often when they're finally competing against other programs with the same grotesquely huge athletic department budgets.

Yay for D-II schools in D-I hockey. Finally, some small amount of pressure from being under the thumbs of these huge schools will be alleviated. It's about time.

You are delusional. Let's compare this to football. When Texas was considering leaving the Big XII, they went back to the other members and got a better deal. They could do this because they bring so much money into the conference. The smaller schools know they would be worse off without Texas. Its no different in this situation.
Why do you think losing the revenue of minnesota and wisconsin is a good thing? Your program just lost money.

 

[NMU8405]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

I watched the miami/notre dame game Friday and there was 1,000 people there at the most. I doubt the big ten is going to have it there if that is the embarassing attendance the two michigan schools currently draw.

The game started at 4:30...and both fan bases are outside Michigan. Its not a secret that the Joe isnt a big draw if State or Michigan are not there. Its just the way fans are down there.

But hey, its still fun for the ones who go.

 

[Gurtholfin]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

The game started at 4:30...and both fan bases are outside Michigan. Its not a secret that the Joe isnt a big draw if State or Michigan are not there. Its just the way fans are down there.

But hey, its still fun for the ones who go.

I've seen many games over the years including championship games with Michigan involved and it still looked sparsely attended.

Pales in comparison to the X which almost always looks jammed.

 

[The Rube]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

I've seen many games over the years including championship games with Michigan involved and it still looked sparsely attended.

Pales in comparison to the X which almost always looks jammed.

Until this year. The title game didn't even sell out (16K). Total attendance for the weekend was 57K+. The average over the last 7-8 years is around 71K.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Until this year. The title game didn't even sell out (16K). Total attendance for the weekend was 57K+. The average over the last 7-8 years is around 71K.

Brent, that isn't a fair comparison, there were only 4 tickets this year...last year there were 5 tickets. 57k is pretty **** impressive considering...57k/4 is greater than 71k/5

 

[The Rube]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Brent, that isn't a fair comparison, there were only 4 tickets this year...last year there were 5 tickets. 57k is pretty **** impressive considering...57k/4 is greater than 71k/5

Almington, con, and I were talking about that. There were still 5 games, though, and all games meant something (compared to the 3rd place game that doesn't exist anymore, thank Parise). I'm just saying that this weekend was a sign of things to come. I highly doubt that once the BTHC forms, that the F5 will even bring 57K anymore to the X, given the number of MN fans that go no matter if MN is in it or not.

I think both sides of the debate merit discussion, and time will tell.

Edit: It's still impressive, but it's not the monster tournament draw it once was, when you could easily have close to 40K after the Thu game/Fri afternoon game.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Yeah, sorry for wanting an NCAA hockey program.

You should be. You're team coupled with the red menace has destroyed everything I hold dear about college hockey. PSU hockey can wither and die for all I care. Better you guys than any of the other teams in Division 1.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Looks like the BTHC has scored three more points with this announcement. Final score: BTHC 7, College Hockey 6. It's over folks.

 

[The Rube]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

You should be. You're team coupled with the red menace has destroyed everything I hold dear about college hockey. PSU hockey can wither and die for all I care. Better you guys than any of the other teams in Division 1.

While I love college hockey expansion, this will be subtraction by addition, thanks to the BTHC. If PSU simply joined up with another conference, or culled some teams from the bigger conferences to make a new conference, then fine by me. This? Unacceptable.

 

[bigmrg74]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

You know I really think things should be left alone and Penn State should be added to an existing conference. Just got back today from the CCHA Finals at the Joe in Detroit and it's an event I enjoy throughly even when my team isn't there. I hear the Big Ten is considering having their playoffs in Chicago and I will just not go. For me college hockey at the Joe is as much fun as the Frozen 4.

That, or just have the Ohio schools break off with PSU and form their own league. That solves a lot of problems and gives room for a few more schools to add in the future.

The game started at 4:30...and both fan bases are outside Michigan. Its not a secret that the Joe isnt a big draw if State or Michigan are not there. Its just the way fans are down there.

But hey, its still fun for the ones who go.

Yep.

Until this year. The title game didn't even sell out (16K). Total attendance for the weekend was 57K+. The average over the last 7-8 years is around 71K.

Funny what happens when Minnesota doesn't make it to the F5 for a couple of years. The bandwagon fans start jumping off.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Almington, con, and I were talking about that. There were still 5 games, though, and all games meant something (compared to the 3rd place game that doesn't exist anymore, thank Parise). I'm just saying that this weekend was a sign of things to come. I highly doubt that once the BTHC forms, that the F5 will even bring 57K anymore to the X, given the number of MN fans that go no matter if MN is in it or not.

I think both sides of the debate merit discussion, and time will tell.

Edit: It's still impressive, but it's not the monster tournament draw it once was, when you could easily have close to 40K after the Thu game/Fri afternoon game.

Well like I said, I would think the WCHA needs to reevaluate pricing of the upperdeck. If they charged the $25 for all of the upper deck I bet attendance would have been higher. The fact that upper deck is the same price at front row on the glass is pretty absurd.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

While I love college hockey expansion, this will be subtraction by addition, thanks to the BTHC. If PSU simply joined up with another conference, or culled some teams from the bigger conferences to make a new conference, then fine by me. This? Unacceptable.

Yep. I'd have zero issues with PSU if they didn't bring the BTHC on us.

 

[The Rube]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Well like I said, I would think the WCHA needs to reevaluate pricing of the upperdeck. If they charged the $25 for all of the upper deck I bet attendance would have been higher. The fact that upper deck is the same price at front row on the glass is pretty absurd.

I swear that the UD was about $20/game (so $40 for Thu), compared to around $45/game for LD ($90). Honestly, I didn't look at the price of my tickets, since I really didn't care.

 

[Hockeybuckeye]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

I watched the miami/notre dame game Friday and there was 1,000 people there at the most. I doubt the big ten is going to have it there if that is the embarassing attendance the two michigan schools currently draw.

I think the reason for the Chicago playoffs is the hope to get numbers by making it easier for the Minnesota and Wisconsin fan base to attend and screw all the others!

 

[The Rube]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Funny what happens when Minnesota doesn't make it to the F5 for a couple of years. The bandwagon fans start jumping off.

WI wasn't there either, and they also draw well. I don't take DU into account, since they are there all the time anyway. Obviously UAA relied on the people who were there who wanted a team to cheer for, and I dunno if CC even has any fans.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Funny what happens when Minnesota doesn't make it to the F5 for a couple of years. The bandwagon fans start jumping off.

He's being silly, trying to compare apples to oranges. Final Five thursday was quite possibly the worst possible matchup they could have had, you get a minnesota school in that game or nodak and its much better...