Big Ten Conference Tournament

[kdilks]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

The underlined proves you know not of what you talk about. Visit the F5 this year. I'll gladly discuss this, and show you why you are wrong. I will even share a beer with you. And parameters matter, because of money, money, money. The X puts in the best bid, provides the most ticket sales, and is a quality building. There is no argument against this, period. Facts are facts.

soh: I'd agree with that.

If the F5 isn't predominantly Gopher fans, then what guarantee is there that the X will still provide the most ticket sales? No more Sioux fans travelling to see the big lights of an actual city. No more local UMD/SCSU/MSU fans. Most teams in the WCHA have a fair amount of local talent from the Twin Cities area which I'm sure draws in some people, and that will no longer be the case in the BTHC.

 

[Stauber1]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

I've been around hockey a long time and around OSU's program since it's beginning in '63, just not on the forums. In first round draw Michigan practically always gets Grand Rapids when Grand Rapids is hosting with rare exception and not at Yost. Back me up here Go Blue boys.

Yikes.
When the NCAA Tournament moved from a series format to a regional format, the regionals were often held at the home rinks of member institutions. Yost was a frequent recipient of regionals.

It's only been the last couple of years that the NCAA has said it will no longer hold a regional at the home rink of a potential participant.


This thing makes the most sense in St. Paul. I'd be very happy with a rotation between Detroit and St. Paul, and maybe even trying it out in Chicago. But ultimately, if it's a choice between a rink that is half full and a rink that is nearly sold out, I think the choice is pretty clear.

 

[The Rube]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

If the F5 isn't predominantly Gopher fans, then what guarantee is there that the X will still provide the most ticket sales? No more Sioux fans travelling to see the big lights of an actual city. No more local UMD/SCSU/MSU fans. Most teams in the WCHA have a fair amount of local talent from the Twin Cities area which I'm sure draws in some people, and that will no longer be the case in the BTHC.

You know what a down year is for the F5 (meaning WI/MN are not in the tourney)? About 60K. Average year is 70K. The record is 90K or so.

If you're a college hockey fan in the metro area, you are against or for MN, not counting your specific team fandom. You'd still go to root against the Gophers. This is not tArrogance, this is the truth. Others can back me up on it. I won't claim that it will retain those numbers with the B1G Mistake. But I would bet that Detroit would be the only city that MAY come close to the same numbers as the X would put up in a B1G Mistake tourney at the X.

 

[kdilks]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

You know what a down year is for the F5 (meaning WI/MN are not in the tourney)? About 60K. Average year is 70K. The record is 90K or so.

If you're a college hockey fan in the metro area, you are against or for MN, not counting your specific team fandom. You'd still go to root against the Gophers. This is not tArrogance, this is the truth. Others can back me up on it. I won't claim that it will retain those numbers with the B1G Mistake. But I would bet that Detroit would be the only city that MAY come close to the same numbers as the X would put up in a B1G Mistake tourney at the X.

You're basically making my point. If the F5 still does well when MN/WI aren't there, that indicates that a significant amount of people are there for some reason that will not exist when it's the BTHC championship.

 

[Stauber1]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

You're basically making my point. If the F5 still does well when MN/WI aren't there, that indicates that a significant amount of people are there for some reason that will not exist when it's the BTHC championship.

I think you are underestimating the appetite for fantastic and intense hockey in the Twin Cities metro area.

 

[JDUBBS1280]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

I think you are underestimating the appetite for fantastic and intense hockey in the Twin Cities metro area.

Exactly, MN has a pretty solid hockey fanbase indeed. even the State HS Hockey tournament has surpassed Indiana Basketball and Texas football in attendance. There's no guarantee's, but a pretty sure bet.

 

[Biddco]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

#bigtenproblems

 

[johnnyredshoes]

I think you are underestimating the appetite for fantastic and intense hockey in the Twin Cities metro area.

To back that point up, depending on where the NCHC had their tournament in a given year, I'd be incline to attend the Big Ten Tournament, if the NCHC wasn't in reasonable driving distance. I'd be there not to cheer against the gophers, just to see some good hockey.

 

[Hockeybuckeye]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

Yikes.
When the NCAA Tournament moved from a series format to a regional format, the regionals were often held at the home rinks of member institutions. Yost was a frequent recipient of regionals.

It's only been the last couple of years that the NCAA has said it will no longer hold a regional at the home rink of a potential participant.


This thing makes the most sense in St. Paul. I'd be very happy with a rotation between Detroit and St. Paul, and maybe even trying it out in Chicago. But ultimately, if it's a choice between a rink that is half full and a rink that is nearly sold out, I think the choice is pretty clear.

I guess old age is the excuse I'll plead. I've become one of those types who's looking eveywhere for their glasses when they're on your head.

 

[JF_Gophers]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

Anything that screws over Michigan teams and their fans I am all for. Here's to the conference tourney never being in their state.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

....and it starts. Welcome back to the F5 argument.

It made a lot more sense for the old WCHA than it ever would for the BTHC.

The old WCHA had NoDak, UMD, SCSU, Mankato, etc to draw local fans if Minny or Sconnie couldn't make it. If Minny or Sconnie aren't doing well, the next closest schools in the BTHC aren't even in the right time zones.

 

[mnstate0fhockey]

It made a lot more sense for the old WCHA than it ever would for the BTHC.

The old WCHA had NoDak, UMD, SCSU, Mankato, etc to draw local fans if Minny or Sconnie couldn't make it. If Minny or Sconnie aren't doing well, the next closest schools in the BTHC aren't even in the right time zones.

But unlike the F5, under the current format, all six BTHC teams will make this tournament. I personally don't think attendance would be an issue. It almost certainly would be in Chicago, Indy, or any other neutral location.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

The argument here is the same as it was when the regionals were on campus sites: if you don't like it, put in a better bid. It's too ****ing funny that Michigan fans are b*tching about this when they were perfectly fine saying "go ahead and outbid us if you want it so bad" when the regionals were at Yost. The exact same argument applies now: you want it somewhere other than St. Paul, offer the B1G a bigger financial guarantee than can be offered by the X. All I can say is, good luck with that.

This will probably wind up much the same way as the F5 did: once upon a time, it rotated between St. Paul and Milwaukee. Then it became all St. Paul.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

I'm really torn by the tournament location.

It makes a whole lot of sense to have it in a permanent location. That way it can build over time and benefit all.

But should it be at locations that clearly favor a home flavor- St. Paul or Detroit? Eh. Or should we get a location that is more middle, but probably few would make a regular attempt to go to- Chicago or Indy?

I bet that the schools will get more a rotation- especially since all the schools have a pro team within reasonable markets- so I expect at least St. Paul, Detroit, Columbus, and Pittsburg. Which would naturally also result in a regional in Milwaukee.

What will be funny is if the home teams don't make it the years they are 'hosting'.

But I don't see a fair way where all of the AD's won't make a big stink other than that kind of rotation, regardless of ticket sales. This isn't the NCAA, it's the B1G. So BTN will have more impact than ticket sales. IMHO.

 

[streaker]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

I'm really torn by the tournament location.

It makes a whole lot of sense to have it in a permanent location. That way it can build over time and benefit all.

But should it be at locations that clearly favor a home flavor- St. Paul or Detroit? Eh. Or should we get a location that is more middle, but probably few would make a regular attempt to go to- Chicago or Indy?

I bet that the schools will get more a rotation- especially since all the schools have a pro team within reasonable markets- so I expect at least St. Paul, Detroit, Columbus, and Pittsburg. Which would naturally also result in a regional in Milwaukee.

What will be funny is if the home teams don't make it the years they are 'hosting'.

But I don't see a fair way where all of the AD's won't make a big stink other than that kind of rotation, regardless of ticket sales. This isn't the NCAA, it's the B1G. So BTN will have more impact than ticket sales. IMHO.

You also cannot compare the Big Ten football tournament location and the basketball location in this case. Both are in non-hockey cities- at least as far as the B1G Ten is concerned. The idea is to generate revenue, not necessarily be fair to the fanbases. Minneapolis provides that. Detroit has had the CCHA tourney experiment for a long time and doesn't work unless the Michigan or MSU is in the final four. That is not to say that FSU, LSSU, NMU and WMU wouldn't provide a solid traveling group of fans. Ohio always seems to have a contingent, as does Miami and Notre Dame. But realistically, you want to have a local base of fans committed to being at the event.

Side note on the swipes at Michigan for hosting regionals: they have had 3. Three. Trois. Tres. Can I make it any clearer? Gopher fans that don't see the irony in hosting every other year at the X and then pointing to that are... ignorant.

 

[GopherBigGuy911]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

To all those people who have a problem with the X and want a real neutral site - Lets go with the new Pinnacle Bank Arena in good ole Lincoln, Nebraska.... Seats 12,700 for hockey (hint hint as to where then next B1G hockey team will come from). It is set to open in 2013.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

Side note on the swipes at Michigan for hosting regionals: they have had 3. Three. Trois. Tres. Can I make it any clearer? Gopher fans that don't see the irony in hosting every other year at the X and then pointing to that are... ignorant.

Did you even bother reading what was said? No? Let me repeat it for you: the issue wasn't the number of regionals Michigan hosted at Yost - it was the fact that Michigan fans defended it on the grounds of other sites having the opportunity to outbid them and that they failed to do so. Now apparently the shoe is on the other foot, and some Michigan fans are upset about it. Well, again - if the argument about competitive bidding held water in 2002 and 2003 and whatever other year Yost had it, then it certainly holds water for St. Paul hosting the B1G (side point: the X isn't Minnesota's home rink, so let's stop pretending that it is despite its geographic proximity).

 

[streaker]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

Did you even bother reading what was said? No? Let me repeat it for you: the issue wasn't the number of regionals Michigan hosted at Yost - it was the fact that Michigan fans defended it on the grounds of other sites having the opportunity to outbid them and that they failed to do so. Now apparently the shoe is on the other foot, and some Michigan fans are upset about it. Well, again - if the argument about competitive bidding held water in 2002 and 2003 and whatever other year Yost had it, then it certainly holds water for St. Paul hosting the B1G (side point: the X isn't Minnesota's home rink, so let's stop pretending that it is despite its geographic proximity).

I read it and interpreted it fine- at least your argument. My post was targeted at Hammy, really.

Now that there is a minimum capacity requirement, it is a non-argument. Michigan *can't* bid at Yost because it was legislated out of the bidding process. It's not the same as hosting at JLA, although it would be the closest venue. Compuware arena would also serve as an adequate venue, except it is a OHL venue. So, it is either Grand Rapids or bust, since Detroit is not a "favored" venue, either. Hardly the same advantage to Michigan as the X is to Minnesota.

 

[state of hockey]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

Guess what? Minnesota has lost games at the X. *GASP*

Crazy, right?

 

[streaker]

Re: Big Ten Conference Tournament

Guess what? Minnesota has lost games at the X. *GASP*

Crazy, right?

That's weak. Host teams have lost tourney games. Big deal. If you had a choice of playing in front of 500 of your fans or 15000 of your fans, what would you choose?