2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

[Craig P.]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

I would argue that increased enforcement of toughened DUI laws, compared to 30 years ago, has played a much bigger role in the reduction of fatalities. The days of telling the cop you're 5 minutes from home, and he says he'll follow you the rest of the way, are over.

Funny you should mention this. In a discussion regarding the NTSB recommendation on another site, someone said that traffic fatalities increased after the BAC limit was lowered from 0.10 to 0.08, and it was surmised that it was because officers who previously patrolled for obviously-impaired drivers were sidetracked to roadblocks/checkpoints, which certainly raises questions about the real value of changing the BAC limit again.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

Funny you should mention this. In a discussion regarding the NTSB recommendation on another site, someone said that traffic fatalities increased after the BAC limit was lowered from 0.10 to 0.08, and it was surmised that it was because officers who previously patrolled for obviously-impaired drivers were sidetracked to roadblocks/checkpoints, which certainly raises questions about the real value of changing the BAC limit again.

It's no different from all the bogus claims that were made and eventually proved false when speed limits were raised across the country.

 

[unofan]

Funny you should mention this. In a discussion regarding the NTSB recommendation on another site, someone said that traffic fatalities increased after the BAC limit was lowered from 0.10 to 0.08, and it was surmised that it was because officers who previously patrolled for obviously-impaired drivers were sidetracked to roadblocks/checkpoints, which certainly raises questions about the real value of changing the BAC limit again.

The biggest thing with drunk drivers isn't the middle aged soccer mom driving home with a .076 bac, it's the perpetual drunks going around repeatedly with .20 bac.

I'd be more than willing to reduce the penalty for a first time offender who is barely over the limit in exchange for increasing the penalties for repeat offenders or those who are way past the limit.

 

[Rover]

Of the three at issue, it's the most realistic shot of being the biggest one. Targeting journalists is never going to end well, no matter the motive or the legitimacy.

The irs scandal is going to end up as a case of overzealous staffers, potentially with some mid level management approval.

Benghazi will remain the witch hunt that it's been for the last 5 months.

And all of it will add up to nothing, while GOP Reps and their accolytes in the media (and several USCHO posters) will look like fools once again.

Benghazi just came crashing down as Issa clearly bit off more than he could chew when he suggested Pickering and Mullen's work was flawed and they didn't want to testify. Not only did they call the idiot's bluff, they insisted on a public hearing while Issa wants a private meeting to answer questios and then a public hearing to be scheduled "TBD". Gimme a break. bigblue's sackless answer pretty much sums up the right nowadays. Blatant stupidity and then no will to stand behind their words.

Regarding the AP, again what's the scandal? That somebody was leaking classifed info on national security matters and the govt tried to find out who? Gee whiz, that's never happened before, right? The only reason this will have legs in the media is because they're the target. The problem is the media is about as popular with the public as used car salesmen and meter maids. Besides, wasn't this all legally obtained?

The IRS problem while having nothing to do with Obama is a place where he needs to fire people. While these so called charity groups do need more scrutiny, its gotta be even handed so whoever decided otherwise needs to go and quickly. Take a few days to find out who's actually responsible and call it a day.

What amuses me to no end though is the knuckledragger theory that countless baseless investigations actually help the GOP's electability. All it reminds the general electorate of is that you just can't trust Republicans with power because as soon as they're in they start 1) baseless and costly investigations, 2) Tax cuts for big campaign contributors, and 3) Talibanesque social policies. Been that way for 30 years, and won't change anytime soon.

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

The biggest thing with drunk drivers isn't the middle aged soccer mom driving home with a .076 bac, it's the perpetual drunks going around repeatedly with .20 bac.

I'd be more than willing to reduce the penalty for a first time offender who is barely over the limit in exchange for increasing the penalties for repeat offenders or those who are way past the limit.

Exactly this. I don't think that people that are between .05 and .08 are a huge danger on the road. Tougher pentalties on repeat offenders, and better enforcement of other dangerous driving habits (texting, careless driving, etc.) would go much further to make the roads safer than getting people with a .07 off the road.

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

And all of it will add up to nothing, while GOP Reps and their accolytes in the media (and several USCHO posters) will look like fools once again.

Benghazi just came crashing down as Issa clearly bit off more than he could chew when he suggested Pickering and Mullen's work was flawed and they didn't want to testify. Not only did they call the idiot's bluff, they insisted on a public hearing while Issa wants a private meeting to answer questios and then a public hearing to be scheduled "TBD". Gimme a break. bigblue's sackless answer pretty much sums up the right nowadays. Blatant stupidity and then no will to stand behind their words.

Regarding the AP, again what's the scandal? That somebody was leaking classifed info on national security matters and the govt tried to find out who? Gee whiz, that's never happened before, right? The only reason this will have legs in the media is because they're the target. The problem is the media is about as popular with the public as used car salesmen and meter maids. Besides, wasn't this all legally obtained?

The IRS problem while having nothing to do with Obama is a place where he needs to fire people. While these so called charity groups do need more scrutiny, its gotta be even handed so whoever decided otherwise needs to go and quickly. Take a few days to find out who's actually responsible and call it a day.

What amuses me to no end though is the knuckledragger theory that countless baseless investigations actually help the GOP's electability. All it reminds the general electorate of is that you just can't trust Republicans with power because as soon as they're in they start 1) baseless and costly investigations, 2) Tax cuts for big campaign contributors, and 3) Talibanesque social policies. Been that way for 30 years, and won't change anytime soon.

More pointless BS drivel. Someone let me know if this fool has anything substantial to say, I'm done reading these posts.

 

[Priceless]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

This is going to be great. All the right-wing trolls/conspiracy theorists are going to put everyone else on ignore and just have a conversation among themselves, but everyone will get to see it. This could be more fun that most shows in prime time!

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

Exactly this. I don't think that people that are between .05 and .08 are a huge danger on the road. Tougher pentalties on repeat offenders, and better enforcement of other dangerous driving habits (texting, careless driving, etc.) would go much further to make the roads safer than getting people with a .07 off the road.

How about instead of trying to attack the stuff you can't see, attack the stuff you can? Things like lane merges, room for disabled vehicles, time involved in passing where there is a prima facie speed limit, things like that.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

This is going to be great. All the right-wing trolls/conspiracy theorists are going to put everyone else on ignore and just have a conversation among themselves, but everyone will get to see it. This could be more fun that most shows in prime time!

Try typing something other than "You stupid knuckledragger!" every other post and instead bring in some actual information that can be discussed, and we might actually have a discussion. Until you can do that, there's no reason to respond to anything.

 

[Priceless]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

Try typing something other than "You stupid knuckledragger!" every other post and instead bring in some actual information that can be discussed, and we might actually have a discussion. Until you can do that, there's no reason to respond to anything.

I thought you were ignoring me. May as well, because it's been days, maybe even weeks, since I've called anyone a knuckledragger.

 

[geezer]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

I take it you guys have been following the news? Word is that the "One We've Been Waiting For"'s world is about to come crashing down through a variety of illegal activities coming to light in recent days. Good clean fun, I love to see terrible people get what's coming and it will sell a lot of papers over this summer. I like how Slate put it this morning, the corruption in the Obama White House will do more damage to liberal causes than the Republican party could do in 100 years. But sadly, they (Repubs) will still be the ones to benefit from it whether or not the "Savior of Humankind" ever gets actual prison time, or gets pardoned. btw, you know what happens to cute girls like Barry in the big house? I wouldn't wish that on anyone, even if they are a sleazy corrupt criminal liar.

Meaning, of course, Mr. federal agent, in the most respectful possible way. Mr President, sir. Nothing to audit here...

 

[Rover]

Try typing something other than "You stupid knuckledragger!" every other post and instead bring in some actual information that can be discussed, and we might actually have a discussion. Until you can do that, there's no reason to respond to anything.

Ahhh...classic tactic of the right. Make an accusation, and when its proven wrong, run away. Geesh, Ronald Reagan must be rolling over in his grave right now at the cowardly tendancies of his ideological offspring.

But, for the slow of mind, I'll repeat some simple questions regarding Benghazi:

1) What's the crime?
2) What's the coverup since the Speaker of the House and his deputies saw the e-mails months ago and the ABC report has been proven to be fraudulent.
3) Why does the Republican congressman who launched this congressional investigation want the authors of the original investigation to testify in private instead of a public hearing?

I've been asking this for days. Funny how the same people who were so hot to trot on impeachment articles are no where to be found on this subject...


EDIT: On point article here...

http://theweek.com/article/index/244214/who-burned-abc-news-on-the-benghazi-emails

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

Try typing something other than "You stupid knuckledragger!" every other post and instead bring in some actual information that can be discussed, and we might actually have a discussion. Until you can do that, there's no reason to respond to anything.

If the shoe fits.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

Ahhh...classic tactic of the right. Make an accusation, and when its proven wrong, run away. Geesh, Ronald Reagan must be rolling over in his grave right now at the cowardly tendancies of his ideological offspring.

But, for the slow of mind, I'll repeat some simple questions regarding Benghazi:

1) What's the crime?
2) What's the coverup since the Speaker of the House and his deputies saw the e-mails months ago and the ABC report has been proven to be fraudulent.
3) Why does the Republican congressman who launched this congressional investigation want the authors of the original investigation to testify in private instead of a public hearing?

I've been asking this for days. Funny how the same people who were so hot to trot on impeachment articles are no where to be found on this subject...


EDIT: On point article here...

http://theweek.com/article/index/244214/who-burned-abc-news-on-the-benghazi-emails

So us being outraged over what has been determined to be a fraudulent report from a "reputable" news source means we are cowardly running away? ok got it...

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

I take it you guys have been following the news? Word is that the "One We've Been Waiting For"'s world is about to come crashing down through a variety of illegal activities coming to light in recent days. Good clean fun, I love to see terrible people get what's coming and it will sell a lot of papers over this summer. I like how Slate put it this morning, the corruption in the Obama White House will do more damage to liberal causes than the Republican party could do in 100 years. But sadly, they (Repubs) will still be the ones to benefit from it whether or not the "Savior of Humankind" ever gets actual prison time, or gets pardoned. btw, you know what happens to cute girls like Barry in the big house? I wouldn't wish that on anyone, even if they are a sleazy corrupt criminal liar.

Meaning, of course, Mr. federal agent, in the most respectful possible way. Mr President, sir. Nothing to audit here...

Only one problem: The "One We've Been Waiting For" has to be convicted by a group of people that currently support the "One We've Been Waiting For". One thing we learned during the Clinton administration is, with the right people in office, you can get away with anything. Not to mention, the most that can be done is removal from office. The "cute girl" cannot be placed into the slammer for this.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

So us being outraged over what has been determined to be a fraudulent report from a "reputable" news source means we are cowardly running away? ok got it...

Supposedly it's been disproved because the government denied it and the propaganda machine repeated the denial, thereby making it fact.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

The problem with Benghazi actually started the day Osama bin Ladin was killed.

For some strange reason, BHO decided that OBL's death was also the end of al Qaida. That struck me at the time as bizarre "reasoning" and it has looked ever more bizarre since.

OBL's death likely would inspire a fanatical dedication to vengeance, which would make al Qaida even more dangerous, causing us to increase our defenses against retaliation.


However, since BHO apparently has to filter everything through a political prism, he tossed caution and common sense aside and decided he wanted his narrative to be true, facts be dammed.


I don't see the Benghazi coverup as a "crime." it is merely despicable but not illegal: "we have to keep a lid on the story until after the election is over because the truth of what actually happened conflicts with our preferred narrative, and so the facts must be obscured to keep the preferred narrative intact."


That is a very dangerous thing for the Commander in Chief to do, deliberately lie to himself. Like I said, not illegal; just putting our security at risk for no discernable reason whatsoever as far as I can tell. Why even put forth that nonsensical narrative in the first place? Jeff Foxworthy could ask 100 fifth graders whether killing the symbolic leader of a terrorist organization would (a) cause his followers to abandon their cause, or (b) inflame his followers with an aggrieved sense of vengeance, and 100 of them would have answered (b). Why then would The Smartest Man on the Planet choose (a)??

So naturally we weren't prepared for anything on the anniversary of OBL's biggest success....self-delusion is not a criminal act but it is a reckless, immature, and irresponsible one. Not worth impeachment. Just serious disappointment.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

The problem with Benghazi actually started the day Osama bin Ladin was killed.

For some strange reason, BHO decided that OBL's death was also the end of al Qaida. That struck me at the time as bizarre "reasoning" and it has looked ever more bizarre since.

OBL's death likely would inspire a fanatical dedication to vengeance, which would make al Qaida even more dangerous, causing us to increase our defenses against retaliation.


However, since BHO apparently has to filter everything through a political prism, he tossed caution and common sense aside and decided he wanted his narrative to be true, facts be dammed.


I don't see the Benghazi coverup as a "crime." it is merely despicable but not illegal: "we have to keep a lid on the story until after the election is over because the truth of what actually happened conflicts with our preferred narrative, and so the facts must be obscured to keep the preferred narrative intact."


That is a very dangerous thing for the Commander in Chief to do, deliberately lie to himself. Like I said, not illegal; just putting our security at risk for no discernable reason whatsoever as far as I can tell. Why even put forth that nonsensical narrative in the first place? Jeff Foxworthy could ask 100 fifth graders whether killing the symbolic leader of a terrorist organization would (a) cause his followers to abandon their cause, or (b) inflame his followers with an aggrieved sense of vengeance, and 100 of them would have answered (b). Why then would The Smartest Man on the Planet choose (a)??

So naturally we weren't prepared for anything on the anniversary of OBL's biggest success....self-delusion is not a criminal act but it is a reckless, immature, and irresponsible one. Not worth impeachment. Just serious disappointment.

What security was put at risk?

How much are you people willing to spend? Cause it's a black hole for cash and it is NEVER GOING AWAY.

 

[Rover]

The problem with Benghazi actually started the day Osama bin Ladin was killed.

For some strange reason, BHO decided that OBL's death was also the end of al Qaida. That struck me at the time as bizarre "reasoning" and it has looked ever more bizarre since.

OBL's death likely would inspire a fanatical dedication to vengeance, which would make al Qaida even more dangerous, causing us to increase our defenses against retaliation.


However, since BHO apparently has to filter everything through a political prism, he tossed caution and common sense aside and decided he wanted his narrative to be true, facts be dammed.


I don't see the Benghazi coverup as a "crime." it is merely despicable but not illegal: "we have to keep a lid on the story until after the election is over because the truth of what actually happened conflicts with our preferred narrative, and so the facts must be obscured to keep the preferred narrative intact."


That is a very dangerous thing for the Commander in Chief to do, deliberately lie to himself. Like I said, not illegal; just putting our security at risk for no discernable reason whatsoever as far as I can tell. Why even put forth that nonsensical narrative in the first place? Jeff Foxworthy could ask 100 fifth graders whether killing the symbolic leader of a terrorist organization would (a) cause his followers to abandon their cause, or (b) inflame his followers with an aggrieved sense of vengeance, and 100 of them would have answered (b). Why then would The Smartest Man on the Planet choose (a)??

So naturally we weren't prepared for anything on the anniversary of OBL's biggest success....self-delusion is not a criminal act but it is a reckless, immature, and irresponsible one. Not worth impeachment. Just serious disappointment.

The only problem with your narrative is that if Obama is the most self serving politician ever then there's no reason for him to do what you're accusing him of.

Think about it for a minute. The political damage to Obama's Presidency was the death of 4 Americans including the Ambassador. That's what will change people's votes. Whether Al Quada, Al Shebab, Al Barbeque, etc did it or not doesn't add to or take away from the act itself, which was the attack and deaths. What would Obama possibly gain by claiming it was spontaneous vs planned? It probably would have been more politically expedient to pin this on AQ and use the rally round the flag tactic especially against foreign policy virgins Romney and Ryan.

So, to sum up, there was nothing to gain politically for Obama to change any talking points. The fact that an attack and deaths happened were the overriding issue with the electorate, not a memo weeks afterwards.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2nd Term - Part 3 - Echo Chambers, Chorales, and Wingnuts, Oh My!

Maybe folks should spend some time looking at how many embassy attacks there were under the Bush Administration. Then maybe they can rationally decide how stupid this whole ordeal is and we can move on. Seriously, color me shocked that someone died in Libya. I'm sure if I wanted to travel there the State Department would let me know immediately that I'd be placing my life in my own hands by setting one foot into that place.

All the whole thing is is an anti-Hillary brigade. O'Reilly should be ashamed of himself for even thinking Benghazi is a scandal. Especially since he's the only one on the right that's smart enough to figure out that none of the other things are scandals either.