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2024-25: D3whky

Having watched that game, it wasn't as lopsided as the shot score would indicate. Many of the shots, and the only goal came on a 5-on-3, then 5-on-4 power play in the middle of the second period. Hamilton plays the same kind of aggressive fore-checking defense that Middlebury does (and no wonder). And Utica never figured out how to get through it. The Pioneers first game back from break is against Williams, which should prove to be an interesting match up as well.

Every time I watch most NESCAC teams, it really is quite jarring to see the structure of their defense and how effective it is. It seems like 90% of the game is stuck on the boards, and they’re totally fine with that. It’s extremely low-event hockey with not much pace, but it works a lot of the time.
 
Endicott welcomed Norwich to Raymond J. Borque Arena for a non-conference matchup of RV teams. Casey Moritz (Trophy Club, TX) stopped all 24 shots to record her third shutout of the season as the Gulls cruised to a 4-0 win. The line of Sam Fantasia (Billerica, MA), Cammie Ahern (Oswego, NY), and Lily Anderson (St. Paul, MN) accounted for 3 of the 4 goals with Fantasia recording the hat trick - marking back to back hat tricks for the Gulls (Maggie Lynch (Quincy, MA) had the Hattie against Johnson & Wales on Saturday). Ahern and Anderson had three apples each, the second three-apple game of the season for Anderson. The Gulls return to action January 3rd when Middlebury makes the long trip to Beverly for a rematch of their Cardinal-Panther Classic game last month, which Middlebury won 4-1.
 
Side note:

is this the most parity and wide open D3 women’s hockey has ever been?

Seems like almost anyone can beat anybody in the top 15-20 and that has never been the case since D3 started having a championship in 2001-02.

In short, yes, this is the most parity I can ever recall at the D3 level. Some of the other "old timers" chime in if you disagree, but I think it speaks to how far the women's game has come in the past couple of decades and how much talent is currently being developed in this country. It's pretty awesome!
 
This is the most parity there's been in the west among each other and western teams vs the east. I do think what we're seeing in the east is the NESCAC is currently at a level above the other east teams. A sub .500 NESCAC team just beat the leader of the UCHC who is ranked #9 nationwide. And Midd outskated both Endicott and Plattsburgh two of the top teams in their conference.
 
This is the most parity there's been in the west among each other and western teams vs the east. I do think what we're seeing in the east is the NESCAC is currently at a level above the other east teams. A sub .500 NESCAC team just beat the leader of the UCHC who is ranked #9 nationwide. And Midd outskated both Endicott and Plattsburgh two of the top teams in their conference.

That has been the case for the last 4-5 years no doubt. It's not even close which conference has the most top to bottom depth.

The NESCAC should and most likely will get at least 2 teams into the NCAA tournament and probably even three is likely.

Bowdoin has even had a resurgence this year after quite a few down years. Bowdoin back when the NCAA started first sponsoring a championship was right there in the mix making it to the frozen four the first two years. Iron sharpens iron for sure with that league.
 
The very best of the NESCAC played even at best with Gustavus and River Falls the last few years. Guess depth within a conference doesn't translate into National Championships with any consistency. Hamline the 4th best team in the MIAC last year beat up on Bowdoin and Williams, granted both were at the bottom last year so not much of an accomplishment. Adrian beat Trinity this year, and put a beat down on Hamilton in the playoffs last year. While Adrian's a very good team if they were the MIAC this year or last they'd be far from a guaranteed conference championship.

The MIAC has just as much parity in the top 4-5 teams with GAC coming back down to earth. When that happens in the West however it translates to only one conference winner going on. I'd put my money on Augsburg against any NESCAC team this year in a one game series, they have good depth, great talent, and look set for a good run. They still have a few faults however, and that's how I view NESCAC teams. If one doesn't clearly stand out head and shoulders above can't say anyone in the West should be shaking in their skates.

Back to the MIAC, Gustavus is down a little but still has a solid team and will be there when it counts. St Mary's and Hamline both have the players and goaltending that can get it done, but not with week to week consistency. In the end the champ still has to get past UWRF team that will continue to gel and improve as the season goes on. Any West team would have rather traveled to play a NESCAC team last year in the playoffs, so your boasting is comical. Adrian was smiling for a round, I know that.

The NESCAC is a very good conference, but one championship in 12 years is all you have. That hardly merits an annual 2-3 teams in the playoffs every year, but guess they have to fill those remaining empty spots in the East.
 
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From the Midwest perspective, it seems like the NESCAC teams have a baked in head start every season in the Pairwise simply based on their conference affiliation. The only head to head (I think) you have this season between MIAC and NESCAC teams is Amherst thumping St. Olaf in the Codfish Bowl. Amherst is a top program, but who have they beaten this season to warrant being the top team in the Pairwise? At least Middlebury has quality wins against Plattsburgh and Endicott (yes, I said that...The Gulls dismantled a good Norwich team Tuesday night - I was there and it was as one-sided as the score would indicate)....but are either one of those teams far enough ahead of the top Midwest teams to pull an entire conference up with them?

Granted there is still plenty of time for the Pairwise to sort itself out (Arcadia at #5?) but at midseason having Colby and Bowdoin making up 2 of the top 4 teams means UWRF, UWEC, Augsburg, Hamline, and St. Mary's all nail biting....and as someone who has seen his share of games both East and West I'll tell you that any of those 5 teams in flyover country would - at the very least - be the equal of anyone on the East Coast.

There's no easy answer, the system is flawed and proximity makes it hard to get a true and fair ranking of the teams in question. I was going to say "I wonder why the NCAA makes it so difficult" but that is a stupid question....seemingly all the NCAA does is make things difficult. Would it be that hard to field an 8 team West bracket and an 8 team East bracket (and I understand the NCAA's ratios of active programs to post-season berths, but all of the math in this discussion seems flawed)?

Eight West teams would be easy...and most (if not all) of them could compete with the equivalent East Coast teams. If NESCAC gets more than two teams in - all of these 6 teams warrant a spot too.

1. UWRF
2. Augsburg
3. UWEC
4. Gustavus
5. Hamline
6. Adrian

Any two of the next four would compete with the lower tier teams that come out of the East....

7. St. Mary's - Not consistent but plenty of talent
8. Concordia, WI - a stretch, but skated with UWSP
9. St. Norberts - Took Plattsburgh to overtime before getting handled by Endicott (maybe everyone should pay more attention to the Gulls?)
10. UWSP - They tied UWRF already this season and are trekking to Riverside Ave to take on Augsburg tonight

Fun conversation.....
 
From the Midwest perspective, it seems like the NESCAC teams have a baked in head start every season in the Pairwise simply based on their conference affiliation.

There's no easy answer, the system is flawed and proximity makes it hard to get a true and fair ranking of the teams in question. I was going to say "I wonder why the NCAA makes it so difficult" but that is a stupid question....seemingly all the NCAA does is make things difficult. Would it be that hard to field an 8 team West bracket and an 8 team East bracket (and I understand the NCAA's ratios of active programs to post-season berths, but all of the math in this discussion seems flawed)?

Eight West teams would be easy...and most (if not all) of them could compete with the equivalent East Coast teams. If NESCAC gets more than two teams in - all of these 6 teams warrant a spot too.

This is the issue. The MIAC has proven itself to be damn near as good as/if not better than the NESCAC. And gets zero credit. NESCAC beats the shit out of horrendous programs that make up anywhere from half to nearly all of the UCHC/NEHC/CNE/MASCAC/MAC, and bottom of the SUNYAC. They earn that gaudy record. However the MIAC doesn’t play these teams (usually none at all).

I will say the NCHA has a problem with some of the teams in the bottom half of that league. They’re very bad, like most non-NESCAC East teams. But in the MIAC/WIAC, there’s only ONE Northland. That’s it. ANYONE can beat ANYONE. No one is an embarrassing program. But the MIAC/WIAC get none of the respect. In theory, they should be littering the Top 10-15.

But I know how the math works, and they’re not going to get this chance. It’s like the MLB pre-interleague and only 4 teams crossover and trying to seed the thing with math. It’s so so dumb and only fucks the west. I guarantee you if roles were reversed, the MIAC schools are winning +90% of their games against the non-NESCAC East leagues.
 
This is the issue. The MIAC has proven itself to be damn near as good as/if not better than the NESCAC. And gets zero credit. NESCAC beats the **** out of horrendous programs that make up anywhere from half to nearly all of the UCHC/NEHC/CNE/MASCAC/MAC, and bottom of the SUNYAC. They earn that gaudy record. However the MIAC doesn’t play these teams (usually none at all).

I will say the NCHA has a problem with some of the teams in the bottom half of that league. They’re very bad, like most non-NESCAC East teams. But in the MIAC/WIAC, there’s only ONE Northland. That’s it. ANYONE can beat ANYONE. No one is an embarrassing program. But the MIAC/WIAC get none of the respect. In theory, they should be littering the Top 10-15.

But I know how the math works, and they’re not going to get this chance. It’s like the MLB pre-interleague and only 4 teams crossover and trying to seed the thing with math. It’s so so dumb and only ****s the west. I guarantee you if roles were reversed, the MIAC schools are winning +90% of their games against the non-NESCAC East leagues.

In regards to the 8 East- 8 west bracket boiled down to a East v west championship.. I don’t hate it. But I can guarantee you one thing, west schools wouldn’t have it. They want that East blood on their hands.

Going to WIAC, MIAC, and occasional NCHA games, I can not tell you enough how much people b**** about this. coaches, players, parents want to beat the East teams on the big stage. They want the crossover in the worst way possible, and don’t get it. Listen to that GAC postgame interview after winning the natty, the whole team seemed to rally around winning one finally for the west. These coaches teach their girls history, and they’ve been getting the horrendously short end of the stick for over 20 years, and it’s not their fault in the slightest.

The bottom line is, this has GOT to change. It’s a NESCAC invitational at its current state. But again, to do this by math when there’s no crossover is just disgusting. How long is this charade going to go on?
 
I do agree it's a huge issue. Perfect example of the math being extremely flawed. UWSP drops 4 spots in the RPI from yesterday, for.... losing on the road to #6 Augsburg. When I see many east teams play a strong opponent at the top of the RPI, the losing team doesn't drop at all many times, and sometimes their ranking goes up even, for playing a quality team. It just seems like the west is playing with much harder rules.
 
I do agree it's a huge issue. Perfect example of the math being extremely flawed. UWSP drops 4 spots in the RPI from yesterday, for.... losing on the road to #6 Augsburg. When I see many east teams play a strong opponent at the top of the RPI, the losing team doesn't drop at all many times, and sometimes their ranking goes up even, for playing a quality team. It just seems like the west is playing with much harder rules.

Any body else wonder why UWSP schedules Augsburg on the road and then goes to SNC the next day 21 hours later. That's 4 plus hours on the bus to Minneapolis, play a game, 4 plus hours back to Stevens Point and then get up and take a bus an hour plus to Green Bay for another game. Wonder what coach was thinking when she agreed to that schedule?
 
The very best of the NESCAC played even at best with Gustavus and River Falls the last few years. Guess depth within a conference doesn't translate into National Championships with any consistency. Hamline the 4th best team in the MIAC last year beat up on Bowdoin and Williams, granted both were at the bottom last year so not much of an accomplishment. Adrian beat Trinity this year, and put a beat down on Hamilton in the playoffs last year. While Adrian's a very good team if they were the MIAC this year or last they'd be far from a guaranteed conference championship.

The MIAC has just as much parity in the top 4-5 teams with GAC coming back down to earth. When that happens in the West however it translates to only one conference winner going on. I'd put my money on Augsburg against any NESCAC team this year in a one game series, they have good depth, great talent, and look set for a good run. They still have a few faults however, and that's how I view NESCAC teams. If one doesn't clearly stand out head and shoulders above can't say anyone in the West should be shaking in their skates.

Back to the MIAC, Gustavus is down a little but still has a solid team and will be there when it counts. St Mary's and Hamline both have the players and goaltending that can get it done, but not with week to week consistency. In the end the champ still has to get past UWRF team that will continue to gel and improve as the season goes on. Any West team would have rather traveled to play a NESCAC team last year in the playoffs, so your boasting is comical. Adrian was smiling for a round, I know that.

The NESCAC is a very good conference, but one championship in 12 years is all you have. That hardly merits an annual 2-3 teams in the playoffs every year, but guess they have to fill those remaining empty spots in the East.

I said the NESCAC was the best top to bottom conference. I never said it had the top team.

Plattsburgh (biggest one here winning 4 straight titles), Elmira, Norwich, Adrian, UWRF and Gustavus have traditionally been the top best of the best over the last 10-15 years. Most years Middlebury can run with this group and then Amherst occasionally get in the mix too.

No one is denying that Gustavus, Adrian, UWRF, Hamline etc. have had good teams in the past. They certainly have. The reality is more teams exist in the East which means more conferences and more bids to the tournament. That’s just how it works at every level of every NCAA sport.

More teams also can lead to the larger gaps between the top and bottom teams so you see some wonky scores when mid to high level teams play the very bottom ones.
 
Eau Claire gets a late empty-netter to beat the Auggies 4-2 at Hobbs. This comes after a massive, extended 5 on 3 penalty kill with the Auggies down 1 late. Really even game, and quite possibly the most physically grueling game I’ve seen at this level. Countless massive, and I’ll say it, dirty checks throughout this one. If you’ve watched these teams, it’s probably no shock to see these squads playing extremely rough.
 
Eau Claire gets a late empty-netter to beat the Auggies 4-2 at Hobbs. This comes after a massive, extended 5 on 3 penalty kill with the Auggies down 1 late. Really even game, and quite possibly the most physically grueling game I’ve seen at this level. Countless massive, and I’ll say it, dirty checks throughout this one. If you’ve watched these teams, it’s probably no shock to see these squads playing extremely rough.

It’s going to be incredibly interesting to see how both sets of pollsters vote on the current top 5 in the west:

-Augsburg has tied UWRF, split with GAC, Lost to UWEC

-Adrian has split with UWRF

-GAC has split with UWRF, split with Augsburg and lost to UWEC

-UWEC has beaten Augsburg and GAC, and lost to UWRF

-UWRF has beaten UWEC, split with GAC and Adrian, and tied Augsburg
 
I do agree it's a huge issue. Perfect example of the math being extremely flawed. UWSP drops 4 spots in the RPI from yesterday, for.... losing on the road to #6 Augsburg. When I see many east teams play a strong opponent at the top of the RPI, the losing team doesn't drop at all many times, and sometimes their ranking goes up even, for playing a quality team. It just seems like the west is playing with much harder rules.

Anotha one.. Augsburg falls to a top team in Eau Claire ON THE ROAD. Drops from 8 in the RPI to f***ing 15. What are we doing here, how is this (or whatever the NPI is) selecting the damn field?
 
MSOE with perhaps their best result of their debut season so far: skating to a 0-0 tie with #4 Adrian after getting bit by the Bulldogs for 8 goals yesterday in a 8-0 loss. The Raiders had lost 4 straight coming into today's rematch but their winless streak grows to 10 games. They are 0-8-2 in that span with the other tie coming against Trine on 11/23. Their last win was their third game of the year when they won the home leg of a home-and-home against Lawrence.

The Bulldogs did take the tiebreaker points in the shootout. On paper, it's not their worst result; but I would consider it worse than their 4-2 loss against UWRF or getting upended in their season opener in OT against Canton. Their next game is a non-conference game against 1-8-1 Chatham on the road in Pittsburgh on 1/10.
 
It’s going to be incredibly interesting to see how both sets of pollsters vote on the current top 5 in the west:

-Augsburg has tied UWRF, split with GAC, Lost to UWEC

-Adrian has split with UWRF

-GAC has split with UWRF, split with Augsburg and lost to UWEC

-UWEC has beaten Augsburg and GAC, and lost to UWRF

-UWRF has beaten UWEC, split with GAC and Adrian, and tied Augsburg

Well the pundits have voted:

DIII Hockey News has

RF at 3, Gustavus at 4, Adrian at 5, UWEC at 8, Augsburg at 9.

Full rankings:

1. Midd
2. Amherst
3. UWRF
4. GAC
5. Adrian
6. Oswego
7. Plattsburgh
8. UWEC
9. Augsburg
10. Cortland
11. Naz
12. Utica
13. Hamline
14. Bowdoin
15. Elmira
 
I did this last year and god some flak for doing so, but I have fun doing it, so what the heck. Keep in mind the unbalanced schedules, but here's my take on mid-season All-Americans.

First Team East
F: Erika Goleniak- Elmira
F: Mack Hull- Oswego
F: Leah Rubinshteyn- Williams
D: Quinn Dawson- Williams
D: Sabrina Kim- Middlebury
G: Natalie Stott- Amherst

First Team West
F: Courtney Ben- Adrian
F: Megan Goodreau- UW-River Falls
F: Lily Mortenson- Gustavus
D: MaKenna Aure- UW-River Falls
D: Maya Roy- Adrian
G: Ashley Ommen- St. Norbert

Second Team East
F: Grayson Goolgasian- Curry
F: Mia Hlasnick- Cortland
F: Karahkwenhawe White- Arcadia
D: Kayla Persinger- Cortland
D: Allie Zack- Nazareth
G: Lexi Levy- Oswego

Second Team West
F: Brooke Gibson- Concordia (WI)
F: Riley Johnson- Adrian
F: Bailey Olson- UW-River Falls
D: Celia Midtbo- Saint Mary's
D: Kathryn Truban- Adrian
G: Kayla Simonson- Augsburg
 
The NPI has been officially published, which is the sole selection criteria of the NCAA, not used in any pairwise calculation. Just, the NPI rankings themselves. Western folks are not going to like this, but it appears "worse" than PW. Granted, it is early.

https://www.uscho.com/rankings/npi/d-iii-women/

1. Amherst
2. Midd
3. Bowdoin
4. Oz
5. Colby
6. Cortland
7. Platty
8. Arcadia
9. UWEC
10. Endicott
11. UWRF
12. Naz
13. Adrian
14. Augsburg
15. GAC
 
At the risk of upsetting people further, this is what the field would look like if the season ended today, using the standings page of the official website for each conference for the autobids (except the NESCAC whose Standings page is blank?): [TABLE="border: 0, cellpadding: 0, cellspacing: 0"]
[TR]
[TD="width: 64"]Bid[/TD]
[TD="width: 64"]Team[/TD]
[TD="width: 64"]NPI Rnk[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Pool C[/TD]
[TD]Amherst[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]NESCAC[/TD]
[TD]Middlebury[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]2[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Pool C[/TD]
[TD]Bowdoin[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]3[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SUNYAC[/TD]
[TD]Oswego[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]4[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Pool C[/TD]
[TD]Colby[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Pool C[/TD]
[TD]Cortland[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]6[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]MAC[/TD]
[TD]Arcadia[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]8[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]CNE[/TD]
[TD]Endicott[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]10[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]UCHC[/TD]
[TD]Nazareth[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]12[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]MIAC[/TD]
[TD]Augsburg[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]14[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]NCHA[/TD]
[TD]SNC[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]17[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]NEHC[/TD]
[TD]Elmira[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]29[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
I was able to use a standard 12-team seeded bracket with only one geographic adjustment which is swapping SNC and Arcadia and came up with this:

1st Round
Nazareth at Endicott
Elmira at Colby
SNC at Augsburg
Arcadia at Cortland

QF:
End/Naz at Amherst
Colby/Elm at Oswego
SNC/Augs at Middlebury
Cort/Arc at Bowdoin

This bracket will change because:

1) The NESCAC teams have to beat each other up some more. I think they've had 2 or 3 conference weekends at most.
2) I think Adrian will jump SNC
3) I think the SUNYAC is wide open still. Plattsburgh has a chance to jump back in both the SUNYAC and possibly the Pool C discussion as early as at the end of their first two weeks back in Jan depending on how the East/West and the 2 games hosting Oz go. All of their games against the other top 4 (Oz, Cortland, and Canton) are 2 game series at home.
4) More games played out west should boost UWRF, UWEC, and the MIAC winner and runner-up.
 
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