2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

[Tundra]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Not disagreeing with you, per se, I just think they won't be able to resist the urge to attack the incumbent on this issue and will find a way that works with voters without dragging Romney full into it.

I always assume the lowest common denominator in campaigns and am rarely disappointed. ;-)

Hey you're right. I'm watching Cspan and Romney is attacking Obama care directly. using the state's right argument (constitutional) and the one fits all argument about why it's different than the MA health care.

I wouldn't mind seeing a follow up questions on states rights on war on drugs (Marijuana decriminalization, medical use), abortion, marriage, drinking age, school ed, etc... vs federal laws-mandate.

I think I could get to like Romney if he follows the constitutional argument ala Ron Paul and let state decide most of these issues.

 

[joecct]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Hey you're right. I'm watching Cspan and Romney is attacking Obama care directly. using the state's right argument (constitutional) and the one fits all argument about why it's different than the MA health care.

I wouldn't mind seeing a follow up questions on states rights on war on drugs (Marijuana decriminalization, medical use), abortion, marriage, drinking age, school ed, etc... vs federal laws-mandate.

I think I could get to like Romney if he follows the constitutional argument ala Ron Paul and let state decide most of these issues.

Great idea and I agree with you.

However, playing Devil's Advocate here, if you have State X with a generous Public Health Insurance plan and State Y next door with a minimal / none plan, would there be a movement of low income population to State X, thereby driving the costs up the wazoo for State X without the corresponding increase in the tax base?

Meanwhile State Y loses people on public assistance, thereby saving state money??

 

[Tundra]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Prove it.

Well you would think there is a simple mathematical formula showing the optimal taxrate but what we got is Laffer curve instead. So anywhere below 70% tax rate is optimal.
And I believe some economist mentioned that the fica tax holiday of (3%) added about .5% to 1% of GDP. so if we lowered taxes by 10% across the board = 1.5% to 3% GDP growth.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Well you would think there is a simple mathematical formula showing the optimal taxrate but what we got is Laffer curve instead. So anywhere below 70% tax rate is optimal.
And I believe some economist mentioned that the fica tax holiday of (3%) added about .5% to 1% of GDP. so if we lowered taxes by 10% across the board = 1.5% to 3% GDP growth.

Fail. Try again.

 

[Tundra]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Great idea and I agree with you.

However, playing Devil's Advocate here, if you have State X with a generous Public Health Insurance plan and State Y next door with a minimal / none plan, would there be a movement of low income population to State X, thereby driving the costs up the wazoo for State X without the corresponding increase in the tax base?

Meanwhile State Y loses people on public assistance, thereby saving state money??

Yeah you'll have this problem and arguments with any state vs federal laws (state hopping for abortion, drinking age, health care etc...). I would like to see how Romney handles this question. Ron Paul is basic constitutional state-federal rights argument.

 

[Handyman]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Well you would think there is a simple mathematical formula showing the optimal taxrate but what we got is Laffer curve instead. So anywhere below 70% tax rate is optimal.
And I believe some economist mentioned that the fica tax holiday of (3%) added about .5% to 1% of GDP. so if we lowered taxes by 10% across the board = 1.5% to 3% GDP growth.

The Laffer Curve...seriously what year are you living in?

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Romney found his pot of gold to balance the budget. It's amazing how much waste there is out there, just amazing.

 

[aparch]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

CBC seems to do okay as a public broadcaster who has commercials. Maybe PBS needs to put a bid in for the next NHL contract?

 

[Tundra]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

The Laffer Curve...seriously what year are you living in?

It's an old idea from the 14th century and maybe even prior to that.
0% and 100% tax = no tax collection
I think it needs to add economic drag and other variables when measuring the velocity and the curve. T = Mc^2 *1/2D/t

 

[Priceless]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

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[Handyman]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

It's an old idea from the 14th century and maybe even prior to that.
0% and 100% tax = no tax collection
I think it needs to add economic drag and other variables when measuring the velocity and the curve. T = Mc^2 *1/2D/t

Dude, if you brought Reagan back to life even HE wouldn't support the Laffer Curve...

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

It's an old idea from the 14th century and maybe even prior to that.
0% and 100% tax = no tax collection
I think it needs to add economic drag and other variables when measuring the velocity and the curve. T = Mc^2 *1/2D/t

Sure. It all trickles down. We get it.

 

[Kepler]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Dude, if you brought Reagan back to life even HE wouldn't support the Laffer Curve...

Speaking of His Royal Highness, one guy at least was under-impressed by the actual man, rather than the myth.

 

[MountieBoyOz]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

CBC seems to do okay as a public broadcaster who has commercials. Maybe PBS needs to put a bid in for the next NHL contract?

They are already doing a better job covering the league than ESPN.

 

[Rover]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

I agree that Romney's probably better off leaving the health care issue alone, mostly because it shows his propensity for taking both sides of every issue. Bottom line is, does he believe its okay to require people to have health insurance or not? Saying its okay to force people in one place to but not in other places is ridiculous.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

I agree that Romney's probably better off leaving the health care issue alone, mostly because it shows his propensity for taking both sides of every issue. Bottom line is, does he believe its okay to require people to have health insurance or not? Saying its okay to force people in one place to but not in other places is ridiculous.

Really? Then the Republican Party is ridiculous cause that's the same argument they make on abortion, gay marriage, gay rights, Handguns, etc. etc. etc.

 

[MountieBoyOz]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Really? Then the Republican Party is ridiculous cause that's the same argument they make on abortion, gay marriage, gay rights, Handguns, etc. etc. etc.

Maybe their heads will explode like in the movie "Scanners" if you use too much logic.

 

[Tundra]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

I agree that Romney's probably better off leaving the health care issue alone, mostly because it shows his propensity for taking both sides of every issue. Bottom line is, does he believe its okay to require people to have health insurance or not? Saying its okay to force people in one place to but not in other places is ridiculous.

Well I think he is taking the constitutional state's right line from Paul, not sure how far he wants to take it. I remember Bush 2 administration and automakers fighting the higher auto standard of California in the name of uniformity and federal rights.

I knew Charlie Rose was somewhat biased but it was comical watching the show after the caucus, only 1 out of 6 guest mentioned Paul 1st night at all and both guest and Charlie pointedly didn't mention Ron Paul's name once during last night. it was funny. Looks like most (48%) young voters (<30years) voted for Ron Paul in Iowa. So he has merged Tea party with OWS.

And it's clear even President Obama (Bush II clone 3rd term) believes lower taxes = job creation.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/jobs_act.pdf

The American Jobs Act President Obama’s Plan to Create Jobs Now
1. TAX CUTS TO HELP AMERICA’S SMALL BUSINESSES HIRE AND GROW
• Cutting the payroll tax cut in half for 98 percent of businesses:

 

[Kepler]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Well I think he is taking the constitutional state's right line from Paul, not sure how far he wants to take it. I remember Bush 2 administration and automakers fighting the higher auto standard of California in the name of uniformity and federal rights.

They also went after medical marijuana, right to die, and gun control state legislation.

It's only states' rights when they agree with it.

Romney's argument on health care is internally consistent but the problem is his own rhetoric, driven by his attempt to appeal to the far right, is sloppy: "the Evil Ones believe that government rather than you should direct your choices."

By that test, he's a hypocrite. But if he hews finely to the states' rights argument, he's taking the wind out of the "I Hates Me Teh Gubbmint" sails.

So he's kinda screwed.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

It's only states' rights when they agree with it.

Correct. That's why they are the hypocrisy party.