Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

[Osorojo]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

Many Wisconsin hockey players that leave early to play professional hockey return to Madison to earn degrees. This summer Derek Stepan and Ryan McDonagh from the New York Rangers will be working towards their degrees.

Are you an idiot all the time or just when you invade our threads?

Who is "our?"

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

<iframe width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/qileP4bAzek" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

If NoDak doesn't get an exception on grounds of being a traditional rival, or on the same basis that we can play FSU in the "interlocking" B1G-ACC bouncyball showdown, then I think that pretty much says everything we've ever needed to know about the way Alvarez and company view hockey.

And osorojo's a nimrod. What's new?

rights on EODS

 

[icebadger]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

If NoDak doesn't get an exception on grounds of being a traditional rival, or on the same basis that we can play FSU in the "interlocking" B1G-ACC bouncyball showdown, then I think that pretty much says everything we've ever needed to know about the way Alvarez and company view hockey.

And osorojo's a nimrod. What's new?

I agree with what you're saying here, but to be clear the FSU matchups may have been "okay" for two reasons: FSU's nickname is "approved" by the states' tribe(s); secondly, I believe ESPN sets the matchups so we are not scheduling FSU per se. All we need is the BTHC to set up a WCHA-BTHC Challenge and schedule accordingly. That...or bring back 'Flickertails'.

 

[Chuck Schwartz]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

If NoDak doesn't get an exception on grounds of being a traditional rival, or on the same basis that we can play FSU in the "interlocking" B1G-ACC bouncyball showdown, then I think that pretty much says everything we've ever needed to know about the way Alvarez and company view hockey.

And osorojo's a nimrod. What's new?

Wisconsin goes off, "the list." Like icebadger mentioned, FSU is exempt because the tribe has endorsed the use of the name.

Additionally, this part of the policy, "unless the schedule is controlled by outside entities (e.g., the Big Ten Conference) or is the result of other contractual agreements"....means that because the Big Ten schedules the Big Ten/ACC Challenge they can play FSU in that.

No where in the policy (updated in 2007) does it state anything about traditional rivals. Todd Milewski told me that there was originally language in the policy for traditional rivals so that Wisconsin could keep playing Marquette. Marquette updated their name in 1994. As far as I can tell, the traditional rivals clause is no longer in the policy.

 

[Almington]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

Additionally, this part of the policy, "unless the schedule is controlled by outside entities (e.g., the Big Ten Conference) or is the result of other contractual agreements"....means that because the Big Ten schedules the Big Ten/ACC Challenge they can play FSU in that.

So, technically, as long as it is part of an agreement with the WCHA to play all the teams, UW would still be able to play UND.

 

[Chuck Schwartz]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

So, technically, as long as it is part of an agreement with the WCHA to play all the teams, UW would still be able to play UND.

Yeah, that makes sense to me.

 

[Timothy A]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

So with Pavs and Heater out of the race for the cup, UW has no more former players (who did or did not graduate )fighting for the cup, correct?

 

[Almington]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

Yeah, that makes sense to me.

So, when UW refuses to play UND even if the games are scheduled though an agreement with the WCHA, I'm just gonna stop giving any money to the University at all.

 

[Chuck Schwartz]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

So, when UW refuses to play UND even if the games are scheduled though an agreement with the WCHA, I'm just gonna stop giving any money to the University at all.

Looking at it a little deeper I'm not 100% sure a WCHA/Big Ten scheduling agreement would fit in necessarily.

The Athletic Department discourages participation of teams in pre-season events or tournaments during the regular season in which schools on the NCAA list are also participating, unless the schedule is controlled by outside entities (e.g., the Big Ten Conference) or is the result of other contractual agreements.

That is the language in the policy in question. It fits the qualifications for the ACC/Big Ten Challenge but I'm not sure it would fit a WCHA/Big Ten scheduling agreement.

 

[Almington]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

Looking at it a little deeper I'm not 100% sure a WCHA/Big Ten scheduling agreement would fit in necessarily.



That is the language in the policy in question. It fits the qualifications for the ACC/Big Ten Challenge but I'm not sure it would fit a WCHA/Big Ten scheduling agreement.

One UW's loss will be another UW's gain.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

That is the language in the policy in question. It fits the qualifications for the ACC/Big Ten Challenge but I'm not sure it would fit a WCHA/Big Ten scheduling agreement.

I'm not so sure that I follow your logic that the ACC/B1G Challenge is different from a WCHA/B1G interlocking scheudle. Both would be agreements between two conferences to play non-conference games against each other, and the only major difference is that one of them has a gigantic television contract associated with it and gets talked about on SportsCenter.

The extra money of the ACC/B1G might very well be the real difference maker here (in a wink-wink, nudge-nudge kind of way), but if UW's going by the text of that poilicy, I just don't see the difference.

 

[Chuck Schwartz]

I'm not so sure that I follow your logic that the ACC/B1G Challenge is different from a WCHA/B1G interlocking scheudle. Both would be agreements between two conferences to play non-conference games against each other, and the only major difference is that one of them has a gigantic television contract associated with it and gets talked about on SportsCenter.

The extra money of the ACC/B1G might very well be the real difference maker here (in a wink-wink, nudge-nudge kind of way), but if UW's going by the text of that poilicy, I just don't see the difference.

The key word for me in the policy is tournament. An interlocking schedule isn't really a tournament. Although for that matter the ACC Big Ten challenge isn't really a tourney either. Hey loophole its good enough for me I'm just not sure it is for the people that make those decisions.

 

[Almington]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

The key word for me in the policy is tournament. An interlocking schedule isn't really a tournament. Although for that matter the ACC Big Ten challenge isn't really a tourney either. Hey loophole its good enough for me I'm just not sure it is for the people that make those decisions.

To me the major question is if the scheduling controlled by outside entities (e.g., the Big Ten Conference) if it is an agreement between UMN/UW and the WCHA.

 

[badgerhawk]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

The Athletic Department discourages participation of teams in pre-season events or tournaments during the regular season in which schools on the NCAA list are also participating, unless the schedule is controlled by outside entities (e.g., the Big Ten Conference) or is the result of other contractual agreements.

That is the language in the policy in question. It fits the qualifications for the ACC/Big Ten Challenge but I'm not sure it would fit a WCHA/Big Ten scheduling agreement.

"Discourages" is the key word, if this is the way it is written. it does not say prohibits. (loophole?) If the money is right, game on.

 

[Chuck Schwartz]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

Boring time off the offseason...used this piece for B5Q...any thoughts on my line projections?

Michael Mersch (L)-Craig Smith (R)-Derek Lee (R)

The Badgers return their number one center in Craig Smith who has had an outstanding off season so far representing the United States at the IIHF Men's World Championships. If I had to fill out my pre-season All-WCHA team Smith would be on my first team. Derek Lee stepped up his play the second half of last season and could be in for a huge season if paired with Smith. Michael Mersch is a big winger who has 15 goal potential this season.

Brad Navin (L)-Mark Zengerle (R)-Tyler Barnes (R)

Wisconsin head coach Mike Eaves loves to be strong down the middle and that's what I've done here in moving Zengerle back to his natural position at center. Zengerle is the best distributor on the roster and I've paired him up with two kids in Tyler Barnes who rooms with Zengerle and incoming freshman Brad Navin. Both Barnes and Navin have a history of being able to put the puck in the net and this could be a dynamic second unit.

Jason Clark (L)-Joseph LaBate (L)-Keegan Meuer (R)

Things start to get a little more interesting at this point of the projections. Joeseph LaBate is a big centerman who comes to Madison straight out of the Academy of Holy Angles high school program. Eaves started to rely more and more on Meuer as the season went on and with it being his third year in the Badger program (redshirt sophomore) he should be able to handle this type of assignment. Jason Clark is an exciting prospect to me who didn't see much ice last season. Clark has offensive upside but isn't cut out for fourth line duties. Playing in a scoring role should give Clark an opportunity to prove he was worthy of his third round NHL draft selection.

Ryan Little (L)-Jefferson Dahl (R)-Gavin Hartzog (R)

Next season the Badgers will have incredible depth in forwards. Little, Dahl, and Hartzog all saw action last season for the Badgers and Little and Dahl played big minutes as the season went on. All three players could play on a higher line and it's a big advantage for the Badgers that they have the type of depth where they can play these three in this role. Dahl will see minutes on the penalty kill and could potentially play on the second line if Eaves decides to keep Zengerle at wing. Little put up 10 points last season which was a nice surprise in his first year at forward after spending his first two years at Wisconsin playing D. Hartzog was a project much like John Mitchell but has some nice tools and could develop into a goal scoring option as his career evolves.

Matt Paape (L)/Sean Little (R)/Brendan Woods (L)/Tyler Lapic (L)

I expect all four forwards that I have listed above to get opportunities to see time this season. Paape and Little have played fourth line roles in the past and could easily see time there this season. Lapic and Woods have more potential to put the puck in the net but both are big forwards who can be used in checking roles.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Justin Schultz (R)-Frankie Simonelli (R)

I've moved Schultz from the right side to the left to pair him with Frankie Simonelli. I think Simonelli is ready for this type of responsibility and Schultz is obviously a pre-season Hobey Baker candidate. I like the idea of moving Schultz who is right handed to the left to allow him to get his shot off from the middle. This pairing could put up some big offensive numbers and also play against the oppositions top lines.

Jake McCabe (L)-John Ramage (R)

Sure, Jake McCabe should be a senior in high school next season but his play speaks for itself and he will be ready to jump right into the lineup for the Badgers. Pairing him up with veteran John Ramage gives the Badgers a shut down pairing that can play big time minutes if need be.

Eric Springer (L)-Joe Faust (R)

I'm a huge fan of the things that Joe Faust brings to the table and it's time for him to be an every night player for the Badgers. Springer is a veteran and will be in his fourth season of action for the Badgers. Not many teams in the WCHA can trot out a third d-pairing as good as this and it will be a huge advantage for the Badgers next season. With three solid pairings coach Butters won't have to play Schultz 35 minutes a night like he did last season.

Patrick Daly (L)-Chase Drake (L)

It remains to be seen how Patrick Daly will adjust to the WCHA coming straight out of Benilde-St. Maragrets high school in the twin cities. Wisconsin's top six is pretty much already in order but Daly with a strong camp could see an opportunity to prove his worth early in the season. At this point it doesn't seem as if Drake is ready to see much action for the Badgers and I've heard that they are possibly looking to bring in another defenseman for depth on the back end.

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

Boring time off the offseason...used this piece for B5Q...any thoughts on my line projections?

Michael Mersch (L)-Craig Smith (R)-Derek Lee (R)

The Badgers return their number one center in Craig Smith who has had an outstanding off season so far representing the United States at the IIHF Men's World Championships. If I had to fill out my pre-season All-WCHA team Smith would be on my first team. Derek Lee stepped up his play the second half of last season and could be in for a huge season if paired with Smith. Michael Mersch is a big winger who has 15 goal potential this season.

Brad Navin (L)-Mark Zengerle (R)-Tyler Barnes (R)

Wisconsin head coach Mike Eaves loves to be strong down the middle and that's what I've done here in moving Zengerle back to his natural position at center. Zengerle is the best distributor on the roster and I've paired him up with two kids in Tyler Barnes who rooms with Zengerle and incoming freshman Brad Navin. Both Barnes and Navin have a history of being able to put the puck in the net and this could be a dynamic second unit.

Jason Clark (L)-Joseph LaBate (L)-Keegan Meuer (R)

Things start to get a little more interesting at this point of the projections. Joeseph LaBate is a big centerman who comes to Madison straight out of the Academy of Holy Angles high school program. Eaves started to rely more and more on Meuer as the season went on and with it being his third year in the Badger program (redshirt sophomore) he should be able to handle this type of assignment. Jason Clark is an exciting prospect to me who didn't see much ice last season. Clark has offensive upside but isn't cut out for fourth line duties. Playing in a scoring role should give Clark an opportunity to prove he was worthy of his third round NHL draft selection.

Ryan Little (L)-Jefferson Dahl (R)-Gavin Hartzog (R)

Next season the Badgers will have incredible depth in forwards. Little, Dahl, and Hartzog all saw action last season for the Badgers and Little and Dahl played big minutes as the season went on. All three players could play on a higher line and it's a big advantage for the Badgers that they have the type of depth where they can play these three in this role. Dahl will see minutes on the penalty kill and could potentially play on the second line if Eaves decides to keep Zengerle at wing. Little put up 10 points last season which was a nice surprise in his first year at forward after spending his first two years at Wisconsin playing D. Hartzog was a project much like John Mitchell but has some nice tools and could develop into a goal scoring option as his career evolves.

Matt Paape (L)/Sean Little (R)/Brendan Woods (L)/Tyler Lapic (L)

I expect all four forwards that I have listed above to get opportunities to see time this season. Paape and Little have played fourth line roles in the past and could easily see time there this season. Lapic and Woods have more potential to put the puck in the net but both are big forwards who can be used in checking roles.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Justin Schultz (R)-Frankie Simonelli (R)

I've moved Schultz from the right side to the left to pair him with Frankie Simonelli. I think Simonelli is ready for this type of responsibility and Schultz is obviously a pre-season Hobey Baker candidate. I like the idea of moving Schultz who is right handed to the left to allow him to get his shot off from the middle. This pairing could put up some big offensive numbers and also play against the oppositions top lines.

Jake McCabe (L)-John Ramage (R)

Sure, Jake McCabe should be a senior in high school next season but his play speaks for itself and he will be ready to jump right into the lineup for the Badgers. Pairing him up with veteran John Ramage gives the Badgers a shut down pairing that can play big time minutes if need be.

Eric Springer (L)-Joe Faust (R)

I'm a huge fan of the things that Joe Faust brings to the table and it's time for him to be an every night player for the Badgers. Springer is a veteran and will be in his fourth season of action for the Badgers. Not many teams in the WCHA can trot out a third d-pairing as good as this and it will be a huge advantage for the Badgers next season. With three solid pairings coach Butters won't have to play Schultz 35 minutes a night like he did last season.

Patrick Daly (L)-Chase Drake (L)

It remains to be seen how Patrick Daly will adjust to the WCHA coming straight out of Benilde-St. Maragrets high school in the twin cities. Wisconsin's top six is pretty much already in order but Daly with a strong camp could see an opportunity to prove his worth early in the season. At this point it doesn't seem as if Drake is ready to see much action for the Badgers and I've heard that they are possibly looking to bring in another defenseman for depth on the back end.

you feel strongly enough about Meuer to put him on the 3rd line?

I think that's where everything is up in the air in terms of the final 4 forward spots. I'd be surprsied if Woods isn't an every day guy but then again I haven't seen him play.

also - I think Daly will surpass Springer fairly quickly.

The first 2 lines as shown would be lethal.

Jason Clark on line 3. I hope he gets that opp. I agree he can and should contribute more than in a grinder role.

 

[Rich]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

Next season the Badgers will have incredible depth in forwards.

Chuck, could you expand on this? Looking at the returning players, depth at forward is one of the few areas of weakness I see for the Badgers. Then again, I'm just looking at stats. I don't recall any of the 3rd/4th line players from last year since I don't really follow the Badgers. Just for one comparison - the combined returning point totals for your third and fourth liners are 4 and 16 respectively, while CC (just picking the team I follow) returns 44 points on the third line that I'm projecting (Eveland, Winkler, Skalbeck) and 28 points on the returning 4th line (Krushelnyski, Civitarese, Collett). I'm not trying to pick a fight here - but looking at the numbers it seems as though you need to hope for a dramatic increase in production to count forward depth as even average for the Badgers next year, much less a strength.

 

[Chuck Schwartz]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

you feel strongly enough about Meuer to put him on the 3rd line?

I think that's where everything is up in the air in terms of the final 4 forward spots. I'd be surprsied if Woods isn't an every day guy but then again I haven't seen him play.

also - I think Daly will surpass Springer fairly quickly.

The first 2 lines as shown would be lethal.

Jason Clark on line 3. I hope he gets that opp. I agree he can and should contribute more than in a grinder role.

I think Hartzog could be in Meuer's spot as well. I don't see Daly passing Springer that easily. Springer will be a senior and Daly is coming out of high school and it wasn't as if he was a can't miss kid coming out of high school either. He's not Gardiner.

 

[Chuck Schwartz]

Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Vol. XVIII - Belief in a Better Tomorrow

Chuck, could you expand on this? Looking at the returning players, depth at forward is one of the few areas of weakness I see for the Badgers. Then again, I'm just looking at stats. I don't recall any of the 3rd/4th line players from last year since I don't really follow the Badgers. Just for one comparison - the combined returning point totals for your third and fourth liners are 4 and 16 respectively, while CC (just picking the team I follow) returns 44 points on the third line that I'm projecting (Eveland, Winkler, Skalbeck) and 28 points on the returning 4th line (Krushelnyski, Civitarese, Collett). I'm not trying to pick a fight here - but looking at the numbers it seems as though you need to hope for a dramatic increase in production to count forward depth as even average for the Badgers next year, much less a strength.

I meant in terms of experienced players on like our fourth line. Hartzog saw plenty of time last year, Dahl shouldn't be a fourth line center and Ryan Little put up 10 points last season. And I could see any of the 4 extra's I have listed sticking in the lineup every night.

Another example is a guy like Jason Clark who was a third round draft pick who barely touched the ice this season but should be a contributor this season.