Utica College 2010-11

[UCBadger]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Actually, the NCAA truncates those calculations, they don't round. We are fortunate to be at 11. They actually do it the other way they take and multiply 11 by 6.5 and come up with 71.5 teams required for an 11 team field, and rounded down to get 71. We are at the bare minimum for an eleven team field. If one more program goes belly up, we're back to 10. To get to 12 we need 12*6.5 = 78 teams.

Let the words of NUProf be engraved in stone, all can read, all can know!

I thought we were at the minimum, but did not know how we got there. Thanks for the clarification. Hopefully I will remember.

 

[CARDS_rule_the_Burgh]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Hopefully I will remember.

That seems to be my problem with this Math stuff...

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Small correction, because otherwise we might have two Pool B's last year. The ratio used for determining the number of Pool B slots is the "access ratio" which is the number of Pool A slots divided by the number of Pool A teams. That number is going to come out more like 1:8. That was important because before LVC dropped out of the NCAA, the MASCAC + West totaled 13 teams. In either case, with only the ECAC W, there will be no B next year.

The above is enlightening,thank you.

But what the process says to me is:why is it so arcane,and so arbitrary?

My take is that D-3 hockey is such an obscure undertaking that nobody squawks about the (absurd) selection deal.

Imagine that working in D-1 hockey,let alone a $ sport like D-1 football...D-3 hockey flies well below the radar,apparently.

 

[NUProf]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

The above is enlightening,thank you.

But what the process says to me is:why is it so arcane,and so arbitrary?

My take is that D-3 hockey is such an obscure undertaking that nobody squawks about the (absurd) selection deal.

Imagine that working in D-1 hockey,let alone a $ sport like D-1 football...D-3 hockey flies well below the radar,apparently.

It is the selection process that is used by all D-3 team sports. In the eyes of the powers-that-be, all sports are created equally and all team sports (except for a couple of hybrid sports in golf and tennis) have the same selection rules and criteria. In football and basketball there are provisions limiting the size of the field in case the 1:6.5 ratio took the field beyond manageable size.

It's a one-size-fits all plan, and individual sports aren't permitted exceptions to the grand plan

 

[sshablak]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

I called the NCAA selection commitee. They said "We use the Mushroom theory", Feed you fecies and keep you in the dark" !!

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

It is the selection process that is used by all D-3 team sports. In the eyes of the powers-that-be, all sports are created equally and all team sports (except for a couple of hybrid sports in golf and tennis) have the same selection rules and criteria. In football and basketball there are provisions limiting the size of the field in case the 1:6.5 ratio took the field beyond manageable size.

It's a one-size-fits all plan, and individual sports aren't permitted exceptions to the grand plan

One has to wonder why (A.)This 6.5 figure is a sacred cow,and (B.)Why D-3 doesn't tailor the post-season to the sport in question,as does D-1...

Just another NCAA-related head-scratcher,I suppose.

 

[Birdwatcher]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

One has to wonder why (A.)This 6.5 figure is a sacred cow,and (B.)Why D-3 doesn't tailor the post-season to the sport in question,as does D-1...

Just another NCAA-related head-scratcher,I suppose.

You have to remember the NCAA answer to all D3 sports. D3 colleges are to put Academics first, sports well, somewhere down the foodchain!

 

[jconnor]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

You have to remember the NCAA answer to all D3 sports. D3 colleges are to put Academics first, sports well, somewhere down the foodchain!

Isn't it a shame that High Schools can't do the same?

 

[NUProf]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

One has to wonder why (A.)This 6.5 figure is a sacred cow,and (B.)Why D-3 doesn't tailor the post-season to the sport in question,as does D-1...

Just another NCAA-related head-scratcher,I suppose.

As we say frequently around here - it is what it is -

As long as you aren't in the ECAC W or MASCAC (this year) there is a solution - just win your conference tournament. As a fan of a team that has little shot at a Pool C slot, I know that the only way the defending national champs are going to get a shot at defending the title is to first win the ECAC E. For the ECAC W it is more complicated.

The 6.5 figure is mainly due to the fact that the NCAA allocates about 3% of its revenue to D3 sports (Except for the extra money they spent on the moebius logo. and the 3D tag line.) and if they cut the ratio down to 6:1 it would cost more money.

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

You have to remember the NCAA answer to all D3 sports. D3 colleges are to put Academics first, sports well, somewhere down the foodchain!

An "academics-first" approach certainly does not preclude D-3 from running the national post-seasons in an equitable and logical manner.Ironically,the current system kinds makes D-3 look rigid and,well,dumb.

 

[NUProf]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

An "academics-first" approach certainly does not preclude D-3 from running the national post-seasons in an equitable and logical manner.Ironically,the current system kinds makes D-3 look rigid and,well,dumb.

I agree, but most of the issue is money - wait until you see how the tournament gets bracketed. First round and quarterfinal matches cannot be scheduled between teams that are more than 500 miles apart - the NCAA is obligated to provide expenses for all teams, and distance greater than 500 miles require air transportation, so they bend the brackets to make sure there are no flights in the preliminary round. You'd think they would seed the teams 1-11 and give byes to the top 5 teams, wouldn't you? They don't.

As far as the NCAA is concerned D-3 is an afterthought, despite the fact that it is the largest division encompassing more schools and more athletes than DI - which gets all the money.

 

[smbenny]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Utica - this could be my first trip to the Aud (Feb. 19th)! Let's hope they have a sizeable crowd that night, which they likely will!

 

[PrezdeJohnson09]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Utica - this could be my first trip to the Aud (Feb. 19th)! Let's hope they have a sizeable crowd that night, which they likely will!

You haven't been yet??...You've missed out.

The Aud is the best barn left in D-III. I bet they will have close if not more than 4,000 there that night. Atmosphere should be sick.

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

I agree, but most of the issue is money - wait until you see how the tournament gets bracketed. First round and quarterfinal matches cannot be scheduled between teams that are more than 500 miles apart - the NCAA is obligated to provide expenses for all teams, and distance greater than 500 miles require air transportation, so they bend the brackets to make sure there are no flights in the preliminary round. You'd think they would seed the teams 1-11 and give byes to the top 5 teams, wouldn't you? They don't.

As far as the NCAA is concerned D-3 is an afterthought, despite the fact that it is the largest division encompassing more schools and more athletes than DI - which gets all the money.

Well,I've learned a lot about how the clanking little machine works...Thanks!

Funny,I always thought that the D-1 process of seeding and siting was cynical,but I like this situation even less.Just goes to show ya that even "high-minded" institutions are in thrall to the bottom-line,if only by proxy.(One would think that maybe a few trickle-down bucks from the NCAA might be available to make something like the D-3 post-season make sense...They take in like $3 bazillion on March Madness alone.)

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Utica - this could be my first trip to the Aud (Feb. 19th)! Let's hope they have a sizeable crowd that night, which they likely will!

I agree with Prez:the crowd will be near,or at,capacity,providing the weather doesn't suck too vigorously...(We hate Elmira!)Might be a really big game in terms of home-ice for the playoffs,too,which would add to the intensity.

I haven't been to many D-3 venues;maybe 7 in the SUNYAC,Williams,The Cooler in Hobart (which is simply putrid),and The Domes (which I really enjoyed)...But The Aud puts many D-1 venues to shame,never mind the D-3 comparisons.

Sure,there is a goodly percentage of "fans" who attend UC games just to BS with their buddies,guzzle Saranac,and walk around during live action while obstructing everyone else's view...But there also exists a hard-core nucleus of rabid Utica fans who really know the game.

It's a fun thing to do during the winter in this frozen wasteland...Make the trip,and see for yourself!

 

[NUProf]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Well,I've learned a lot about how the clanking little machine works...Thanks!

Funny,I always thought that the D-1 process of seeding and siting was cynical,but I like this situation even less.Just goes to show ya that even "high-minded" institutions are in thrall to the bottom-line,if only by proxy.(One would think that maybe a few trickle-down bucks from the NCAA might be available to make something like the D-3 post-season make sense...They take in like $3 bazillion on March Madness alone.)

You'd think they could spread that money around better than they do, as it supposed to be an organization for all college athletics, but control has been ceded to the big guys with the crumbs left for D-3. (Actually D-2 isn't treated much better, and their latest legislation makes moving from D-2 to D-1 almost impossible, and they want to stop any more play-ups.)

The sad part is that D-3 hockey is still a great experience, and in the hot beds there is as much (or more) fan interest and enthusiasm as there is for some of the low end D1 programs. You would think they would want to nurture that, but instead we get the moebius logo

 

[sshablak]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Absolutely huge weekend..PIOS in great shape for controlling their own destiny. With their current PWR(third East) looks like an NCAA berth with at least two of three wins in their last three. Of course a sweep and their in. Looks like a home playoff game(s) also in the ECACW. Elmira next weekend will be sold out...this is phenominal. What do you think ?

 

[Pioneerfan11]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Absolutely huge weekend..PIOS in great shape for controlling their own destiny. With their current PWR(third East) looks like an NCAA berth with at least two of three wins in their last three. Of course a sweep and their in. Looks like a home playoff game(s) also in the ECACW. Elmira next weekend will be sold out...this is phenominal. What do you think ?

A sweep this weekend puts them in great position for an NCAA bid, but of course, we are getting ahead of ourselves. Without a win over Elmira next weekend AND in the ECAC-W tournament, I just can't see Elmira being passed for the Pool B bid. After that, everything is dependent on the conference tournaments (Oswego and St. Norbert not winning their respective tourneys would not help Utica's cause). I think Hamline only taking one point against St. John's last week probably takes them out of consideration for a Pool C bid should they not win the MIAC.

I'll be interested to see where Utica and Castleton end up in the NCAA rankings next week if they both sweep the weekend (a difficult challenge for both squads). Alex Todd's team would have a win % that is very tough to ignore and a strength of schedule bump after playing Norwich again (remember - Utica "loses" two wins over Franklin Pierce).

There are people that know a heck of a lot more than I do about the subject. Too many games left to accurately predict, but I agree that it will be an exciting few weeks. Let's go UC!

 

[NUProf]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

Absolutely huge weekend..PIOS in great shape for controlling their own destiny. With their current PWR(third East) looks like an NCAA berth with at least two of three wins in their last three. Of course a sweep and their in. Looks like a home playoff game(s) also in the ECACW. Elmira next weekend will be sold out...this is phenominal. What do you think ?

That list is not sorted except by winning percentage. Because of the fact that we don't know what weights the committee attaches to the components, we cannot know what the PWR is for DIII - unlike the way it works in DI. That's why they call it the PWC instead of the PWR. You can look to see what the comparisons look like like, but there is a crucial piece of information that is missing.

I sorry that I have to keep telling people who are used to DI selection procedures how screwed up the DIII procedures are. They are particularly important for the AQ-less ECAC West.

 

[jconnor]

Re: Utica College 2010-11

As long as the weather looks good, we'll be at the Aud.