UNH Wildcats 2021/2022 - Return of the Champions of October?

[HockeyRef]

I wasn't disparaging the guy at all, just responding to Whalers post. He was kind of like a slower version of Sato now that I think about it.

Oh I know you weren't! Just making a point about how we could use players like him...scoring 12 18 points a season...along with the big guns who score 40! Now...18 points a season seems like a dream come true right about now..ho hum.

 

[NCAA watcher]

With so many players underperforming, it highlights the role one big player (Crookshank) plays in lifting "B" guys like Ward/Pierson/Engaras. With him they are "B+" players. Without him, the "B" guys are, well, "B-/C+" forwards. Not great when they are first liners.

 

[HockeyRef]

With so many players underperforming, it highlights the role one big player (Crookshank) plays in lifting "B" guys like Ward/Pierson/Engaras. With him they are "B+" players. Without him, the "B" guys are, well, "B-/C+" forwards. Not great when they are first liners.

As we saw with TyK elevating the games of players like Grasso and to a lesser extent Salvaggio...So if you are using the term under performing...do you think these forwards could be better than they are playing? (Sounds redundant I know)...And if that's the case...why?

 

[Dan]

I was ‘negative’ when I questioned Souza early - but if youre recruiting guys who can’t score at the lower levels they’re not going to start in college. This was the only outcome...

Rogers, at least as a SR, was more like Devlin, the guy you have to hang your hat on now because there are no Hemingways. He was so much more talented than a Sato, but was a standard UNH 4th liner in the day. He had a huge goal at the garden - back when UNH used to mix in a garden trip...

it’s so sad what the team has been reduced to, trailing Mercyhurst as we speak...

—

Maybe I just post more, the secret to UNH success...

 

[HockeyRef]

2 goals whodathunk it...and some puck luck. Let's see where this goes.

 

[HockeyRef]

Well I like how this is going! Welcome back Ryan Verrier... 4 goals oh my!!!

 

[Scott]

Cippellone makes it 6-1!! WHO are these players wearing the UNH jerseys tonight, and WHERE have they been all season???

EDIT - Gagne apparently credited with the sixth goal.

 

[Scott]

58th out of 59 NCAA teams in goals per game. Thank god for St.Thomas (and carrying out to the third decimal), the new Division 1 team. With that, it is amazing that we've won 7 games. [TABLE="width: 303"]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: white"]50.Union[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]17[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]33[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.941176[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: white"]51.Wisconsin[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]20[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]38[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.9[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: white"]52.Niagara[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]16[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]30[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.875[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl64, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]53.Yale[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]12[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]22[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.833333[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl64, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]54.Maine[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]17[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]30[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.764706[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: white"]55.Alaska[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]16[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]28[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.75[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl66, bgcolor: white"]56.Brown[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]12[/TD]
[TD="class: xl67, bgcolor: white"]21[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.75[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: xl64, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]57.Vermont[/TD]
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[TD="align: right"]1.705882[/TD]
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[TR]
[TD="class: xl64, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]58.New Hampshire[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]18[/TD]
[TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: #edf6ea"]28[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.555556[/TD]
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[TR]
[TD="class: xl68, bgcolor: white"]59.St. Thomas[/TD]
[TD="class: xl69, bgcolor: white"]20[/TD]
[TD="class: xl69, bgcolor: white"]31[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]1.55[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

According to my math, after tonight's 7-1 blowout win over Mercyhurst, we overtake Yale and are right behind Niagara at 1.84 GPM. Woot. Woot.

 

[Darius]

Mercyhurst is 57th in scoring defense allowing 3.89 GPG. Still, I’ll take it.

 

[HockeyRef]

Today the 'Cats let down their hair if you will and once they got on track just let it rip. Yeah I know who they were playing etc but after they tied it up the goals came. Let's hope this can carry over into next weekend. I mean..it had to feel good to light the lamp more than once!

Engaras had quite the game with 3 points and Verrier was a difference maker out there. Pierson was Pierson and Devlin continued to show he's a legit top line kid. Nice to see Eric Esposito have a great night as well.

A much better day for the Cats and that is the game they need to bring. Of course it remains to be seen but at least for today it was just what was needed to close out this most interesting year...

Happy New Year !

 

[Chuck Murray]

Rogers, at least as a SR, was more like Devlin, the guy you have to hang your hat on now because there are no Hemingways. He was so much more talented than a Sato, but was a standard UNH 4th liner in the day. He had a huge goal at the garden - back when UNH used to mix in a garden trip...

Nailed it. Rogers' moment in the sun came in the '99 HE Final vs. BC, a game where UNH fell behind 4-1 after one period, scored two quick goals in the second period (Shipulski IIRC?) to trim the deficit to 4-3, before Rogers scored late in the third period on what I think was a wraparound with about 5 minutes left to force the game to OT. That was a landmark game that pitted the up-and-coming BC program (which had lost the '98 FF Final in OT to Michigan) and a UNH program that was in the midst of their apex years, and would lose in the '99 FF Final in OT to UMaine. BC won that '99 HEA Final 5-4, I forget if it was Farkas or Bellefeuille who scored after a lopsided first few OT minutes? USCHO was understandably hopping before and after. Those were the days, my friend ...

But yeah, Johnny Rogers was basically a reliable 4th line/3rd line center on a checking line, great skater, and someone who would pop up with a goal here and there - something we could say about most of the guys on today's UNH roster. It wasn't that long ago that we used to give Coach Borek lots of grief for over-recruiting mid-range prospects by the bushel, now his recruiting "exploits" would be heralded as a level or two above what MS7 and his guys are churning out.

------------

I didn't watch or listen to today's game, but I did catch most of last night's disaster against the hosts. Of all things, I was irked by MS7 seemingly allowing UNH to get worked by the officials from start to finish. And it's hard to tell if he's bothered too much. Say what you will about his predecessor, but if Coach Umile thought he was getting worked by the officials, he'd be apoplectic (sp?), and make it abundantly clear he would be in the officials' ears for the rest of the night if they didn't get things straightened out. And more often than not, Chris Serino would be doubling up on the messaging. We didn't see too much of that in the latter part of Umile's career ... which is kind of a shame, 'cuz way too often it looks like MS7 is way too deferential to the officials, and sometimes it comes across as if he doesn't give a toss.

Granted, it's a small point on a program with much bigger issues. But all of this stuff matters, and the messaging that comes across to me collectively from the whole MS7 experience to date is that he brings as much passion to the job as a twenty year public works supervisor just grinding away and keeping his head down until it's time to collect his pension.

If you want to recruit better players, you gotta show the world you're a better coach than being a JAG with a head coaching job at a lower level Hockey East program. At some point, there has to be transformation. Just showing up to get trucked by a low level ECAC program in their home holiday tourney isn't good enough. This is becoming "Groundhog Day" UNH style.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Final add-on point, and not necessarily to exhume the discussion of a few weeks ago on a "New Riverstone" or whatever ... but the main objection to the proposed event was seemingly that playing against low-level competition wouldn't be helpful for the UNH national profile, and yeah, I get it. So what did we get treated to this week(end)? A game against Dartmouth for the unofficial D-1 championship of the State of NH ... and a second game being a blowout against a D-1 imposter.

So it's all fine and dandy if we go all the way across the state to play in front of no (zero, zip, nada) fans in the Upper Valley, but talk about doing the same thing at a neutral site in a big-league rink with four programs' worth of NH hockey fans in a new and potentially dynamic growth opportunity event, and it's "nah, it'll never work, D-3 opponents suck, blah blah". 'Cuz blowing out Mercyhurst keeps UNH's "national profile" intact, but a similar win against St. A's or SNHU is, like, fatal?!?

Help me out here, guys (and gals). What's the difference? What am I missing?

Isn't there at least a "rising tide raises all ships" argument to be had for helping out non-Dartmouth NH hockey programs? Especially if someday Hockey East doesn't exist, and other competitive possibilities need to be created. Or (more likely) if the Ivies do like the Big Ten did, and leave the ECAC to do their own thing? Wonder if the non-Ivy ECAC schools discussed that last season when the Ivies basically blew up their season? Wouldn't it be nice if instead of just being a passenger on the BC/BU gravy train (take a bow, Blue Skies, that's meant for you), the new AD wants to be a transformational sort (see Gavitt, Dave), and programs like UNH, UMaine, UVM (and other current D-3's) end up in a reconfigured non-Ivy ECAC?

Anyway, just food for thought. Wishing all on here a very happy & healthy New Year in 2022!!!

 

[Carmine Scarpaglia]

I forget if it was Farkas or Bellefeuille who scored after a lopsided first few OT minutes? USCHO was understandably hopping before and after. Those were the days, my friend ...

It was Bellefeuille. Brave/risky pinch by Orpik on the left point to keep the puck in the zone.

Those indeed were the days! Happy New Year!

 

[Dan]

Nailed it. Rogers' moment in the sun came in the '99 HE Final vs. BC, a game where UNH fell behind 4-1 after one period, scored two quick goals in the second period (Shipulski IIRC?) to trim the deficit to 4-3, before Rogers scored late in the third period on what I think was a wraparound with about 5 minutes left to force the game to OT.

David Busch scored first followed by a Jason Shipulski breakaway off of a face off - then Rogers scored out of the far corner on a "shovel shot" according to the play-by-play announcer. I have quite a collection of UNH highlight clips on an old computer I cannot turn on. I've been meaning to recover the hard drive for years and share them...

It was great to have that kind of depth, but relying on those three to carry an offense would have been a problem.

As to your next post, the difference is Mercyhurst is DI, while SNHU and STA are DII/III. 7-1 would likely be 14-1, while a potential loss would be equally more embarrassing.

 

[Chuck Murray]

As to your next post, the difference is Mercyhurst is DI, while SNHU and STA are DII/III. 7-1 would likely be 14-1, while a potential loss would be equally more embarrassing.

Mercyhurst is D-1 in name only, we all know that. Isn't losing to Dartmouth embarrassing enough?

All in all, my point is, this Ledyard thing was no really different to UNH than my "NH Riverstone".

Sometimes you need to take a step backwards to take two steps forward, no?

I suspect we're all a little irked while awaiting the arrival of the new UNH AD ...

 

[HockeyRef]

Chuck rather than re post your post, in regard to Souza not being tough enough with the officials, I thought he had plenty to say to them in the Dartmouth game. I do agree UNH was getting pushed around A LOT in that game. And in my short Umile tenure, I'd agree he would let them definitely know his displeasure on calls etc. I wasn't too happy with the officiating (and I'm not a hockeyref haha) in the Dartmouth game, just saying.

Anyway! Question: if we HAD played BC, what do you think the score would have been? I'm thinking 4-1 BC...

 

[Chuck Murray]

Chuck rather than re post your post, in regard to Souza not being tough enough with the officials, I thought he had plenty to say to them in the Dartmouth game. I do agree UNH was getting pushed around A LOT in that game. And in my short Umile tenure, I'd agree he would let them definitely know his displeasure on calls etc. I wasn't too happy with the officiating (and I'm not a hockeyref haha) in the Dartmouth game, just saying.

Keep in mind, your experience with Umile was as an older man, in some ways resigned to the stagnation of his program, and knowing he wasn't likely to ever get a do-over for the '99 and '03 Finals losses. I vividly remember sitting pretty close to the UNH bench on the occasion of his last visit to the HEA Tourney in Boston, and he seemed wistful at times, possibly realizing that there might not be too many trips back to these big games left ahead of him in his already-fading career. This was a guy who literally missed out on the '97 trip to the Fleet Center due to cardiac issues while he was still only in his 40's. Granted, it likely had more to do with poor lifestyle choices than a hot-running temper, but the younger Umile ran super hot.

As a fan, at the time, it was nice knowing your team's coach gave a crap, and was pushing to make sure his guys got a fair shake in a Boston-centric league. And say what you will, but Umile won a lot more games than he ever lost, won more than his legendary predecessor, and was at the helm for most of UNH's landmark games, with Coach Holt a distant second. So he built up some program credibility in the league and its officials; Souza seems to act as if these things are beyond his control?

So in a game where it already felt there was some "home cooking" involved, we saw the officials let the hosts off the hook on a potential major penalty (apparently all 4 officials and the video missed it?) at a crucial juncture, and then awarded the hosts with a decisive penalty shot (against a woozy UNH goalie), then swallow their whistles for the duration. UNH probably would have struggled for a second goal anyway, but the point I took out of it all is that MS7 has no currency with the refs. As a result, sometimes it feels like current-day UNH is the Washington Generals of Hockey East.

Anyway! Question: if we HAD played BC, what do you think the score would have been? I'm thinking 4-1 BC...

We'll never know, 'Ref - it would have been nice to find out. BC was always the marquee team at the event, but the hosts got themselves into the finals, which was probably the tourney's goal for the week(end). Personally, I'd think long and hard about returning to any event where my program was treated as a stepping stone for an (inferior) host team's advancement. Solution? Find another event(s) and/or create your own event. You guys know where I stand on that ...

 

[Felger]

Mercyhurst is D-1 in name only, we all know that. Isn't losing to Dartmouth embarrassing enough?

All in all, my point is, this Ledyard thing was no really different to UNH than my "NH Riverstone".

Sometimes you need to take a step backwards to take two steps forward, no?

I suspect we're all a little irked while awaiting the arrival of the new UNH AD ...

I know I can't wait to see games like this on the ice:

https://unhwildcats.com/news/2021/1...eene-state-92-54-at-home-on-monday-night.aspx

 

[After the Whistle]

Chuck, once again you have exaggerated the information to make your own facts. I realize that if you say it you feel it must be true. You know the old adage, say it 3 times and it becomes fact.
yes it is easy to believe that BC would be the marquee team in most tournaments. But Dartmouth didn’t use us as the stepping stone so that they could be in the finals. They would have chosen to play MH in the first game if that were true. And why would you not go back if you really want to encourage in state rivalry? I do agree that MS does not often go toe to toe with the officials. However he was appropriately strong last night.
And yes Ref there was a time that DU was as crazy as you can get with the HE officials. He would literally scream at them and almost need to be held back from going on the ice. It was fun to watch but as Chuck pointed out, he appeared to bring on a heart event that really slowed him down. Age may have played a role but I believe he got lots of feedback to bring it down several notches. Chuck says 1995ish but I would have said it was later in his career, say early 200Os. I ll let someone with Stronger memory cells clarify that as it really doesn’t matter.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Chuck, once again you have exaggerated the information to make your own facts. I realize that if you say it you feel it must be true. You know the old adage, say it 3 times and it becomes fact.

Learned that trick from the old-time BC posters back in the day. ;-) No, seriously, you were right in the first place, saying simply that I believe it to be true. IF 3 other folks go with it, then that's WAY better. Right now, it appears I'm stuck at 1, so I'll keep pitching. Anyway ...

yes it is easy to believe that BC would be the marquee team in most tournaments. But Dartmouth didn't use us as the stepping stone so that they could be in the finals. They would have chosen to play MH in the first game if that were true.

But that would have resulted in HEA rivals UNH and BC playing an extra (avoidable) game against a league rival that wasn't the tourney final. Why would that be a compelling opening round match-up for either UNH or BC? So in all likelihood, the hosts had a realistic choice of facing either BC or UNH in the opening round. To no one's surprise, they opted for UNH.

And why would you not go back if you really want to encourage in state rivalry? I do agree that MS does not often go toe to toe with the officials. However he was appropriately strong last night.

Of course I want to encourage an in-state rivalry. The '79 ECAC final between the two schools was Dartmouth's all-time high water mark, and also marked the first of what has become only three (3) post-season tourney wins for UNH. The 50th year anniversary of that game is just over 7 years away. Do you think either Dartmouth, UNH or WMUR will mark the occasion? Ideally, there could be a "New Riverstone" maybe a few years into its new existence around to facilitate honoring the 50th??

I'm relieved MS7 was "appropriately strong" last night in the midst of a 7-1 blowout of a D-2 school. ;-)

Mercyhurst College | NCAA.com

And yes Ref there was a time that DU was as crazy as you can get with the HE officials. He would literally scream at them and almost need to be held back from going on the ice. It was fun to watch but as Chuck pointed out, he appeared to bring on a heart event that really slowed him down. Age may have played a role but I believe he got lots of feedback to bring it down several notches. Chuck says 1995ish but I would have said it was later in his career, say early 200Os. I ll let someone with Stronger memory cells clarify that as it really doesn't matter.

Nope, actually it was 1997. It was the night after UNH had advanced to Boston with a win over UMass Amherst, and Coach Umile ended up missing a 4-0 semifinal win over BC (that is NOT a misprint) and the 4-2 tourney final loss to BU afterward. I believe he was back on the bench for the Round of 12 loss (3-2) to Colorado College (bonus points if you can name CC's AD at the time) that ended the season. It was around this time the "Umile can't win the big ones" began to pick up steam.

Umile Suffers Heart Attack - College Hockey | USCHO.com

1997 Hockey East Men's Ice Hockey Tournament - Wikipedia

1997 NCAA Division I Men's Ice Hockey Tournament - Wikipedia

Ironically, it was after the heart attack when Umile entered the prime "apex" seasons for the program, with 4 FF trips out of the next 6 seasons, including the back-to-back HEA titles at the end of that period. His explosions on the bench toned down in volume and severity, reflecting ATW's recollection. Those six years convinced a few of us that the "can't win the big ones" thing was overstated, but once Coaches Serino (Merrimack after '98) and McCloskey (UNH Women after '02) moved on, the slippage began, slowly but steadily.

Maybe 'Watcher, C-H-C or one of our alums-in-absentia can chime in on this ... but it seems that even if you believe Umile should have retired sooner, the pivotal point seems to have circa 2014, when if Umile had retired, he'd have saved himself the tarnishing of his reputation of his last few unsuccessful seasons (repeating Coach Holt's error, and then some), and been able to turn over the program in much more decent shape to an experienced successor. His assistants at the time were Borek and Jim Tortorella, and while I was never a huge Borek fan - perhaps recalling what he did/didn't do at post-Jackson glory years Lake State - I always thought highly of Tortorella. He had run a successful D-3 program at Colby, seemed to interact and instruct his UNH guys well during his tenure, had the name recognition (albeit mostly from his more famous brother), and mysteriously left UNH after a successful 2014 season. He's resurfaced as an assistant at Harvard these last few seasons. Here's an article on Tortorella's departure, which names a lot of familiar names in the mix to replace him:

Associate head coach Jim Tortorella out at UNH - SB Nation College Hockey (sbncollegehockey.com)

Sorry for the long and winding road today, folks. Hopefully 2022 marks a turnaround of fortunes for UNH Hockey, we'll see who gets appointed as the new AD, and wait for the dominoes to fall ...