UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

[E.J. Smith]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

And of course these are all conjectures and many great players end up at schools with lesser facilities than ours so there's that..

True, it's always good to keep in mind every kid is different. Values different things, puts more emphasis on those things he does value, connects, or doesn't, with the coaches, campus, facilities, etc. But there is a reason, always, as to why they went where they went. It would be interesting to pick a specific great player as you've mentioned and figure out why he went where he did.

Somewhat related, I didn't read Tommy Olcyzk's story without a bit of concern. So basically he went to Penn State, and hung out at the rink, with the hockey team. That seems a little bit sad to me. He went to that huge school, with all it offers in terms of activities, facilities, and in particular a giant, interesting student body, and it seems he took advantage of none of that, or very little. As a parent, would you really want your kid spending the vast majority of his time in college with the same 15 - 20 people? In the hockey rink? I get that D1 athletics is more like a job and that team bonding is good but ferkristsakes get out of that at least just a little and see the bigger world of the school around you.

 

[NCAA watcher]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

True, it's always good to keep in mind every kid is different. Values different things, puts more emphasis on those things he does value, connects, or doesn't, with the coaches, campus, facilities, etc. But there is a reason, always, as to why they went where they went. It would be interesting to pick a specific great player as you've mentioned and figure out why he went where he did.

When it came to choosing a college in 2014, with offers from just about every major East Coast program, Tage opted for a budding program in Storrs.

"I didn't really like the city feel of Boston," said Thompson, who spent last season with the United States National Team Development Program in Ann Arbor, Mich., and accelerated his studies to attend UConn a year earlier than initially planned. "Even Yale had just a really busy feel to it. I came here and it had that nice, laid-back feel. That's why it was either here or Maine for me. It didn't seem as busy, kind of remote and out of the way, but still with access to stuff not too far away."

Somewhat related, I didn't read Tommy Olcyzk's story without a bit of concern. So basically he went to Penn State, and hung out at the rink, with the hockey team. That seems a little bit sad to me. He went to that huge school, with all it offers in terms of activities, facilities, and in particular a giant, interesting student body, and it seems he took advantage of none of that, or very little. As a parent, would you really want your kid spending the vast majority of his time in college with the same 15 - 20 people? In the hockey rink? I get that D1 athletics is more like a job and that team bonding is good but ferkristsakes get out of that at least just a little and see the bigger world of the school around you.

+1 Totally agree that in the arms race to get the one and doners, the NCAA is/has rapidly lost sight of the fact that there is an excellent system for kids who want to become NHLers -- the CHL. Kids should go to college for an actual college experience, as much as they can.

 

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

True, it's always good to keep in mind every kid is different. Values different things, puts more emphasis on those things he does value, connects, or doesn't, with the coaches, campus, facilities, etc. But there is a reason, always, as to why they went where they went. It would be interesting to pick a specific great player as you've mentioned and figure out why he went where he did.

Somewhat related, I didn't read Tommy Olcyzk's story without a bit of concern. So basically he went to Penn State, and hung out at the rink, with the hockey team. That seems a little bit sad to me. He went to that huge school, with all it offers in terms of activities, facilities, and in particular a giant, interesting student body, and it seems he took advantage of none of that, or very little. As a parent, would you really want your kid spending the vast majority of his time in college with the same 15 - 20 people? In the hockey rink? I get that D1 athletics is more like a job and that team bonding is good but ferkristsakes get out of that at least just a little and see the bigger world of the school around you.

I'd have to say that it's a rare kid these days who avails themselves to a lot of different things; they hang close to what matters most (their phones lol). I always take note of the question that Mike (C-H-C) always asks in his interviews with in coming players 'why did you choose UNH' and facilities does come up, along with coaches. And it would be a no brainer not to expect the same answer for why a player didn't come to said school that it was 'facilities and coaches'. UNH certainly isn't Penn State size wise but it does offer a great array of things to do with its proximity to Boston, etc. Campus is beautiful, etc. But being a school teacher I know this is true that throwing money at something doesn't necessarily make it better....and that goes for hockey programs too!

In case you (or anyone) didn't know UNH is in the process of building a new gym facility along side the old Snively; my daughter who graduated 2 years ago is most upset haha it wasn't there for her. I am not aware of what our hockey team actually does have for amenities (if I can use that term)...they work out across the street at Lundholm am I correct for weight training days. I travel to just about all games in the New England area and I still love our Whitt above all others (except the Agganis, as you know ). I do know that the FOH group puts money into locker room upgrades that wouldn't happen without it. (along with a ton of others things this group does for the team) Sure a 'players lounge' would be cool but wonder if that's really the big draw for a recruit...I mean, the 'tron was a big step in the right direction Ha! Not trying to stir the 'tron pot and I doubt we missed out on some great players because of it...but you never know....

 

[E.J. Smith]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I'd have to say that it's a rare kid these days who avails themselves to a lot of different things; they hang close to what matters most (their phones lol).

Generally agreed and know what you're saying but my travels have taken me along the prep school route and for a different, and refreshing, perspective, spend some time in that world - on campus at Milton, Andover, Groton, Exeter, Loomis, etc. - and it's a different story that kind of renews your faith in things. I think in many ways it's a critical mass/cultural thing and a function of kids will give you what you expect, and ask, of them. If you're too busy, disengaged, distracted yourself, that's what you get back.

 

[e.cat]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Futher to E.J.'s point... When I was living in Burlington, I remember Martin St. Louis saying he chose UVM to help them win a National Championship. It wasn't the facilities or anything remotely close to that. He **** near did it when he got them to the FF where they lost to CC in a very close game.

UNH still looking for that guy!

PS. It was the 1996 FF and UVM lost to CC 4-3 in double OT! Michigan went on to beat CC for the title.

PSS. It didn't hurt having Tim Thomas in net for UVM either!

 

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

+1 Totally agree that in the arms race to get the one and doners, the NCAA is/has rapidly lost sight of the fact that there is an excellent system for kids who want to become NHLers -- the CHL. Kids should go to college for an actual college experience, as much as they can.

Had dinner the other night with a former UNH great from long ago. He is still involved in hockey and was remarking how the expectations of prospective college kids have changed over time. Back when he entered UNH there was little expectation that, after your college days, you would have a chance to play professionally. The be all, end all for kid like him was playing D1 hockey. During his four years at UNH things changed, particularly because the WHA had started. As we all know, things rapidly changed after that. Today he sees kids who have chosen hockey as their sport and, consequently, are under tremendous pressure to excel, gripping their sticks too tight is the phrase he used. In my time following UNH I have been lucky to make the acquaintance of several parents of players. Some harbor no illusions and just hope their kid gets the most out of the college experience both on and off the ice. And, of course, there are the others who are hyper focused and view any reduction of playing time, special teams time as a slight. No doubt this gets imparted to the player. I feel bad for these kids. The (hopefully) four years they spend in college will be their last time when they can really explore all the avenues available to them. To not take advantage of what is out there is truly a shame.

As for upgrades to the Whit, the programs wish list has been known since the concrete in the arena was barely dry. If a players lounge, a hockey specific weight room are to be built, it is going to have to come from a couple of individual donors, perhaps alums who had extensive and profitable NHL careers. I know that in the past a few of the players have stepped up and made fairly hefty donations. My guess is that they would have to do that again if the wish list is to be fulfilled.

 

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Generally agreed and know what you're saying but my travels have taken me along the prep school route and for a different, and refreshing, perspective, spend some time in that world - on campus at Milton, Andover, Groton, Exeter, Loomis, etc. - and it's a different story that kind of renews your faith in things. I think in many ways it's a critical mass/cultural thing and a function of kids will give you what you expect, and ask, of them. If you're too busy, disengaged, distracted yourself, that's what you get back.

You've been very fortunate then! Not that my high school is that much different; as there are tons of kids who do many great things; I do have faith in the high school kid and wouldn't teach any other level!!! Totally agree with your comment...it's right on. They do raise the bar if you raise it as well (those that want to, that is)...Prep school; a diff life. I umpire 2 sports and do see a different type of athlete at the Prep level. Not always better than the high school athlete, but different. I should qualify that I've been teaching for 36 years and it's a yearly renewal kind of thing. Decided that if I'm in it for the next 5-7 years...I have to 're-invent'...or suffer the consequences!

 

[NCAA watcher]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Its part of this ongoing discussion re: recruiting, there's been some off & on talk here on the UNH thread(s) re: factors that enter into the decision-making process for potential student-athletes and their parents, and whether the Whitt is sufficiently up to snuff with the amenities that matter. I haven't visited the off-ice areas of the Whitt in well over a decade, but we're told that currently there's no real player's lounge, no players-only weight room, the 'classroom' (for lack of a better term) for video review / game planning is small and cramped, etc. What once was state-of-the-art when the Whitt opened in 1995 is now dated and showing its age, the new Jumbotron aside. How much does this *really* matter?

I think we see with recruits moving to follow their assitants or head coaches, like Ryczek to Borek, and the Carvel to U.Mass, that facilities are a far down the list. The key is faith in the program and having someone believe in you. Here's Jordan Sandhu discussing why he chose Arizona State, which lacks a rink and even a conference.

“I decided to play at Arizona State because it is an up-and-coming program that is progressing at a fast pace and on the road to a successful future. The staff is very passionate about their hockey program and I look forward to being a part of that,” concluded Sandhu.

Maine's bellcow was Shawn Anderson, who committed in December 84 https://news.google.com/newspapers?...AIBAJ&sjid=aS4MAAAAIBAJ&pg=5529,2797556&hl=en

As soon as I began meeting the gusy (Maine) during my visit they accepted me as part of them" They didn't treat me as someone who might take on of their spots. There was a really good time during the visit." Anderson said he also wants to play in the best college league possible and he considers HE to be just that. "I also wanted to come to a program that is growing and to help it move up. If you go to a school that has just won a championship, there's no place to go but down."

or going back many years, Paul Kariya, who bypassed Harvard and BU, for ancient Alfond

"I really liked the people in the area, the coaches and the players and I feel Maine has the best hockey program in the nation," said Kariya. "I couldn't go wrong there."

 

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I think we see with recruits moving to follow their assitants or head coaches, like Ryczek to Borek, and the Carvel to U.Mass, that facilities are a far down the list. The key is faith in the program and having someone believe in you.

...

or going back many years, Paul Kariya, who bypassed Harvard and BU, for ancient Alfond

Let's leave retroactive financial aid out of this discussion, OK?

 

[Snively65]

Futher to E.J.'s point... When I was living in Burlington, I remember Martin St. Louis saying he chose UVM to help them win a National Championship. It wasn't the facilities or anything remotely close to that. He **** near did it when he got them to the FF where they lost to CC in a very close game.

UNH still looking for that guy!

PS. It was the 1996 FF and UVM lost to CC 4-3 in double OT! Michigan went on to beat CC for the title.

PSS. It didn't hurt having Tim Thomas in net for UVM either!

CC also went through UML to get to the FF in 1996 (back in the days of just two six-team regionals). Has any team fallen farther off the map than CC, UMO, and UNH? At least the former two each have two NCs.

 

[NCAA watcher]

CC also went through UML to get to the FF in 1996 (back in the days of just two six-team regionals). Has any team fallen farther off the map than CC, UMO, and UNH? At least the former two each have two NCs.

Did some mention Lake Suoerior, which fell from regular NCAA final four member from 88-96, but became a doormat within 3 years for some reason

 

[Felger]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Did some mention Lake Superior, which fell from regular NCAA final four member from 88-96, then fell off a cliff the next 5 years for some reason

Sarcasm (perhaps irony) duly noted.

 

[HockeyRef]

Sarcasm (perhaps irony) duly noted.

Ha! Even I got this one

 

[Snively65]

Did some mention Lake Suoerior, which fell from regular NCAA final four member from 88-96, but became a doormat within 3 years for some reason

So, we have the Big Four, unless some other worthy candidate can make a better claim.

 

[JB]

Did some mention Lake Suoerior, which fell from regular NCAA final four member from 88-96, but became a doormat within 3 years for some reason

Pick me, pick me... I think I have noted the reason...

 

[NCAA watcher]

Pick me, pick me... I think I have noted the reason...

The judges are looking for "new admission requirements" or "poor facilities" that preclude getting top recruits. "We'll never get recruits like Michigan or Michigan State, so there is no way we could be successful. Anyone who expected more is just being unrealistic."

 

[jeteye1717]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I would also like to see some evidence of being able to do the selling part. I was hopeful, based on Crookshank's friends and your comments about UNH returning to BC, that this might lead to a head-to-head win for Sandhu, or a similarly recruited kid. So far no luck.

But 'selling' to potential recruits involves face-to-face contact, does it not? (or at least long distance FaceTime) ... But how can we expect UNH to be able to afford sending its coaches to far flung locales when instead we're spending money on this:

http://www.twcc.com/articles/2016/04/29/u/university-paying-17-570-for-dining-hall-table-was-mistake

University: Paying $17,570 for Dining Hall Table Was a Mistake [click on link for photos]

DURHAM, N.H. (AP) — The University of New Hampshire now acknowledges that spending $17,000 on a custom-made chef's table with LED lights for the campus dining hall was a mistake. Initially, university officials thought the light-up table would allow the dining staff to interact with students and demonstrate healthy cooking techniques. But word soon got out about the $17,570 price tag on the 16-seat table, which was installed several weeks ago. The school newspaper wrote about it, and other media outlets picked up on it. The table costs nearly as much as in-state students pay annually for tuition and fees.

On Friday, UNH spokeswoman Erika Mantz told The Associated Press that having a chef's table was a good idea, but much less money should have been spent. The university plans to keep the table.

Sigh ... Double Sigh ... Is there NO ONE at UNH who could see that this was a preposterously Bad Idea :-( I mean, the optics alone should've sent up red flags right from the git go ... Oh well, if we run short of $$ for sticks, we can always carve out some custom shafts from this beauty in the Dining Hall ...

 

[bakchk20]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Futher to E.J.'s point... When I was living in Burlington, I remember Martin St. Louis saying he chose UVM to help them win a National Championship. It wasn't the facilities or anything remotely close to that. He **** near did it when he got them to the FF where they lost to CC in a very close game.

UNH still looking for that guy!

PS. It was the 1996 FF and UVM lost to CC 4-3 in double OT! Michigan went on to beat CC for the title.

PSS. It didn't hurt having Tim Thomas in net for UVM either!

Having his buddy and forever linemate Eric Perrin didn't hurt the cause either. I recall the proximity of UVM to Laval (read: families) played big in the 2fer migration to Burlington...

 

[e.cat]

Having his buddy and forever linemate Eric Perrin didn't hurt the cause either. I recall the proximity of UVM to Laval (read: families) played big in the 2fer migration to Burlington...

Yup. Those two were an inseparable package deal. The word was that St. Louis said if you want me then you've got to take Perrin too. They were linemates in youth hockey! Fun to watch them together, they had such great chemistry together.

Speaking of Laval, it was a blast taking my boys up to Montreal for tournaments. Obligatory UNH connection, I ran into former UNH player Peter Noonan up there for a tournament.
He had a team up there from Arlington, MA where he was from.

 

[Snively65]

Yup. Those two were an inseparable package deal. The word was that St. Louis said if you want me then you've got to take Perrin too. They were linemates in youth hockey! Fun to watch them together, they had such great chemistry.

Like Steve Saviano and Sean Collins from Reading, Mass., which was even closer to campus, no?