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The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

Everything that the NCHC wanted to be, and, is, can summed up thusly.

UMD, who is 3rd in Pairwise, and 6th in the polls, opens their NCHC tourney on the road against a DU team that is ranked behind them in the polls and in Pairwise as well.

I wonder what precedence there is for a situation like this or similar to it in any other conference, ever?
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

I believe the conference tourney seeds are based on the conference standings and has nothing to do with the national polls or PWR ranking. Duluth is 5th in points and DU is 4th in the conference standings. Duluth goes to Denver.
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

Samaman said:
I believe the conference tourney seeds are based on the conference standings and has nothing to do with the national polls or PWR ranking. Duluth is 5th in points and DU is 4th in the conference standings. Duluth goes to Denver.
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Correct, it's based on conference standings.
 
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Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

Red Cows said:
Everything that the NCHC wanted to be, and, is, can summed up thusly.

UMD, who is 3rd in Pairwise, and 6th in the polls, opens their NCHC tourney on the road against a DU team that is ranked behind them in the polls and in Pairwise as well.

I wonder what precedence there is for a situation like this or similar to it in any other conference, ever?
Click to expand...
Yeah, that's a pretty interesting situation, and a testament to the strength of the league, top to bottom. That said, all the bragging about the number of teams who make the tournament, the number of teams at the top of the PWR, or even the fact that the third "strongest" team in the country (according to the PWR) is only the 5th best in the conference, goes for naught without a strong showing in the NCAAs.
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

Red Cows said:
Everything that the NCHC wanted to be, and, is, can summed up thusly.

UMD, who is 3rd in Pairwise, and 6th in the polls, opens their NCHC tourney on the road against a DU team that is ranked behind them in the polls and in Pairwise as well.

I wonder what precedence there is for a situation like this or similar to it in any other conference, ever?
Click to expand...

Highly doubt it. If anything there was a similar situation in the old WCHA. But Pretty dang cool!
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

Biddco said:
Highly doubt it. If anything there was a similar situation in the old WCHA. But Pretty dang cool!
Click to expand...

Closest I can think of is....I think in 09-10 Vermont made the tournament and finished 8th in Hockey East. Going by memory, so it may not be correct.

Edit. Yep. Confirmed. 8th in Hockey East, 4th seed in St. Paul as an at-large.
 
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Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

I don't remember what the seeds were, exactly, but in 02-03, SCSU lost to UMD at UMD in the first round and earned a tournament bid, while UMD did not. St. Cloud was something like 13th or 14th in the PWR that year though, not 3rd.
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

HumRsky said:
I don't remember what the seeds were, exactly, but in 02-03, SCSU lost to UMD at UMD in the first round and earned a tournament bid, while UMD did not. St. Cloud was something like 13th or 14th in the PWR that year though, not 3rd.
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And it should be noted that St. Cloud, as the 6 seed in the WCHA, went TO Duluth, the 5 seed. Its not like SCSU finished ahead of UMD and got upset.

Also two years ago SCSU won a share of the Macnaughton Cup, finishing tied with Minnesota atop the WCHA, and yet nearly missed the NCAAs.
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

All Conference and All Rookie teams announced

First-Team All-Conference
*Trevor Moore, So., F, Denver – 26 points (8 first-place votes)
$Jonny Brodzinski, Jr., F, SCSU – 25 (7)
Mark MacMillan, Sr., F, UND – 22 (6)
^Joey LaLeggia, Sr., D, Denver – 42 (14) (unanimous)
*%Jaccob Slavin, So., D, CC – 21 (5)
$Zane McIntyre, Jr., G, UND – 32 (10)

Second-Team All-Conference
Danton Heinen, Fr., F, Denver – 22 (5)
^Austin Czarnik, Sr., F, Miami – 21 (4)
Drake Caggiula, Jr., F, UND – 17 (4)
Andy Welinski, Jr., D, UMD – 20 (4)
%Jordan Schmaltz, Jr., D, UND – 19 (5)
Ryan Massa, Sr., G, Omaha – 19 (4)

Honorable Mention All-Conference
Austin Ortega, So., F, Omaha – 16 (4)
Dominic Toninato, So., F, UMD – 14 (4)
*Jake Guentzel, So., F, Omaha – 8 (2)
Matthew Caito, Jr., D, Miami – 10 (3)
$Andrew Prochno, Sr., D, SCSU – 4 (0)
*Charlie Lindgren, So., G, SCSU - 6 (1)

All-Rookie Team
Danton Heinen, F, Denver – 42 (14) (unanimous)
Patrick Russell, F, SCSU – 35 (11)
Nick Schmaltz, F, UND – 30 (9)
Louie Belpedio, D, Miami – 40 (13)
Luc Snuggerud, D, Omaha – 22 (6)
Kasimir Kaskisuo, G, UMD – 38 (12)

^ 2013-14 NCHC First-Team All-Conference
% 2013-14 NCHC Second-Team All-Conference
$ 2013-14 NCHC Honorable Mention All-Conference
* 2013-14 NCHC All-Rookie Team

link to article http://www.nchchockey.com/news_article/show/489451?referrer_id=878553
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

bigblue_dl said:
Closest I can think of is....I think in 09-10 Vermont made the tournament and finished 8th in Hockey East. Going by memory, so it may not be correct.

Edit. Yep. Confirmed. 8th in Hockey East, 4th seed in St. Paul as an at-large.
Click to expand...

I believe last year Notre Dame was 7th in HE and Vermont was 8th in HE and both made it to the NCAA Tournament.
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

SCSU Euro said:
All Conference and All Rookie teams announced

First-Team All-Conference
*Trevor Moore, So., F, Denver – 26 points (8 first-place votes)
$Jonny Brodzinski, Jr., F, SCSU – 25 (7)
Mark MacMillan, Sr., F, UND – 22 (6)
^Joey LaLeggia, Sr., D, Denver – 42 (14) (unanimous)
*%Jaccob Slavin, So., D, CC – 21 (5)
$Zane McIntyre, Jr., G, UND – 32 (10)

Second-Team All-Conference
Danton Heinen, Fr., F, Denver – 22 (5)
^Austin Czarnik, Sr., F, Miami – 21 (4)
Drake Caggiula, Jr., F, UND – 17 (4)
Andy Welinski, Jr., D, UMD – 20 (4)
%Jordan Schmaltz, Jr., D, UND – 19 (5)
Ryan Massa, Sr., G, Omaha – 19 (4)

Honorable Mention All-Conference
Austin Ortega, So., F, Omaha – 16 (4)
Dominic Toninato, So., F, UMD – 14 (4)
*Jake Guentzel, So., F, Omaha – 8 (2)
Matthew Caito, Jr., D, Miami – 10 (3)
$Andrew Prochno, Sr., D, SCSU – 4 (0)
*Charlie Lindgren, So., G, SCSU - 6 (1)

All-Rookie Team
Danton Heinen, F, Denver – 42 (14) (unanimous)
Patrick Russell, F, SCSU – 35 (11)
Nick Schmaltz, F, UND – 30 (9)
Louie Belpedio, D, Miami – 40 (13)
Luc Snuggerud, D, Omaha – 22 (6)
Kasimir Kaskisuo, G, UMD – 38 (12)

^ 2013-14 NCHC First-Team All-Conference
% 2013-14 NCHC Second-Team All-Conference
$ 2013-14 NCHC Honorable Mention All-Conference
* 2013-14 NCHC All-Rookie Team

link to article http://www.nchchockey.com/news_article/show/489451?referrer_id=878553
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*waits for UNO fans to mention how Ortega was robbed*
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

SCSU Euro said:
And it should be noted that St. Cloud, as the 6 seed in the WCHA, went TO Duluth, the 5 seed. Its not like SCSU finished ahead of UMD and got upset.

Also two years ago SCSU won a share of the Macnaughton Cup, finishing tied with Minnesota atop the WCHA, and yet nearly missed the NCAAs.
Click to expand...

If you sweep us this weekend, we are almost certainly still making the NCAA tournament.

Strangely, and, I am almost ashamed to admit it, if that happened, my guess is that would get SCSU in, too, probably, and I would be O.K. with that, particularly if it somehow made UNO end up in either South Bend or Fargo.

I think an NCHC team is winning the title. The funniest by far, would be if SCSU sweeps us and we still both get in and then either WMU or CC plays in and 7 NCHC teams go instead of 6. Followed by one of those 3 "bottom" teams winning the NCAA championship.

If the 6th, 7th, or 8th place team in our conference could win the title, that would be some kind of street cred. I dunno if CC is up to the task but I am certain SCSU is capable of it and, maybe, WMU, as well.

If any sort of scenario like this actually plays out, every school in college hockey is going to hate all of us even more than they already do for "defecting".
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

Red Cows said:
Twitterverse took care of this for me in spades. But, this sure as hell goes a lot farther than just "Ortega".

Read my comment here:

http://www.uscho.com/2015/03/11/north-dakota-leads-nchc-all-conference-team-selections/
Click to expand...
Ortega had a very good year, and I don't think there would have been a big outcry if he had been named to either 1st or 2nd team.

But we used to have this debate all the time in the old WCHA, and the same holds true here.

First, we are only talking about NCHC play for these awards, not what you may have done the entire year.
Second, I'm not really sure pre-season expectations play much of a role in the voting, except for coach of the year, where it plays a huge role. I think Dean Blais is the most likely candidate to win that award, probably closely followed by Hak and Blasi.

Third, the question I always ask is who does Ortega replace? There were probably a dozen deserving forwards. If you look at the voting points, he was only one point out of being named to the second team, and the voting was all pretty close.

Moore was the league's leading scorer. Brodzinski had the same points as Ortega, but more goals. MacMillan had more goals, and 3 less points, but played 2 full, and a couple partial less league games than Ortega due to injuries. Heinen had more points. Czarnik had more points. Caggiula had more goals, but one less point.

Usually the way these break down are strictly on points/goals.

As for the game winning goals, it's a very nice accomplishment for him, but I don't think it's really put on a pedestal as a great feat, or even thought of that much, simply because of how the stat is kept. As others have pointed out, scoring the 2nd goal in a 6-1 win isn't necessarily a great accomplishment, and in fact, may not have even been the most important goal in that game.
 
SJHovey said:
Ortega had a very good year, and I don't think there would have been a big outcry if he had been named to either 1st or 2nd team.

But we used to have this debate all the time in the old WCHA, and the same holds true here.

First, we are only talking about NCHC play for these awards, not what you may have done the entire year.
Second, I'm not really sure pre-season expectations play much of a role in the voting, except for coach of the year, where it plays a huge role. I think Dean Blais is the most likely candidate to win that award, probably closely followed by Hak and Blasi.

Third, the question I always ask is who does Ortega replace? There were probably a dozen deserving forwards. If you look at the voting points, he was only one point out of being named to the second team, and the voting was all pretty close.

Moore was the league's leading scorer. Brodzinski had the same points as Ortega, but more goals. MacMillan had more goals, and 3 less points, but played 2 full, and a couple partial less league games than Ortega due to injuries. Heinen had more points. Czarnik had more points. Caggiula had more goals, but one less point.

Usually the way these break down are strictly on points/goals.

As for the game winning goals, it's a very nice accomplishment for him, but I don't think it's really put on a pedestal as a great feat, or even thought of that much, simply because of how the stat is kept. As others have pointed out, scoring the 2nd goal in a 6-1 win isn't necessarily a great accomplishment, and in fact, may not have even been the most important goal in that game.
Click to expand...


This post should be screenshot and put up on Twitter where all the whiny uno fans could see it. Well done sir.
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

SJHovey said:
Ortega had a very good year, and I don't think there would have been a big outcry if he had been named to either 1st or 2nd team.

But we used to have this debate all the time in the old WCHA, and the same holds true here.

First, we are only talking about NCHC play for these awards, not what you may have done the entire year.
Second, I'm not really sure pre-season expectations play much of a role in the voting, except for coach of the year, where it plays a huge role. I think Dean Blais is the most likely candidate to win that award, probably closely followed by Hak and Blasi.

Third, the question I always ask is who does Ortega replace? There were probably a dozen deserving forwards. If you look at the voting points, he was only one point out of being named to the second team, and the voting was all pretty close.

Moore was the league's leading scorer. Brodzinski had the same points as Ortega, but more goals. MacMillan had more goals, and 3 less points, but played 2 full, and a couple partial less league games than Ortega due to injuries. Heinen had more points. Czarnik had more points. Caggiula had more goals, but one less point.

Usually the way these break down are strictly on points/goals.

As for the game winning goals, it's a very nice accomplishment for him, but I don't think it's really put on a pedestal as a great feat, or even thought of that much, simply because of how the stat is kept. As others have pointed out, scoring the 2nd goal in a 6-1 win isn't necessarily a great accomplishment, and in fact, may not have even been the most important goal in that game.
Click to expand...

You are spot on!!!
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

HumRsky said:
That's what I meant by "lost to UMD at UMD"
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My bad, missed the @

As for Ortega, its not robbery when he is tied with 3 other guys for 6th in conference scoring among forwards. At that point its up to judgment, and I can't argue with any of the 6 guys picked ahead of him. Heck, I would have put Barber ahead of him too. Where's the outcry for him? Or Benik? Tied for 2nd in conference points among forwards, and neither even made honorable mention. When the numbers are that close, you can make an argument for really anyone. Moore and LaLeggia were the only two slam dunks on the 1st team.
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

To add to my earlier comments.

Ortega finished 7th in the voting for forwards.

Ortega was in a two-way tie for 7th in goal scoring, in league games, with half the forwards ahead of him having played fewer games.
He was in an 8 way tie for 18th in assists in league play.
He was in a four way tie for 7th in overall scoring in the league.

Unfortunately, the team captains and coaches probably don't have the time or the inclination to dig much deeper than those numbers. The problem in today's game is there simply isn't enough scoring for a group of players to really separate themselves from the rest of the pack.

I think that he did deserve some credit for his game winning goals, even though I don't think it's much of a stat. I know he had a couple of game winners in OT, including one against UND, and had some others in the third period.

I also sometimes wonder to what extent a player's personality plays any role in the voting. If you get a guy who is a bit of an agitator or talker on the ice, does he rub people the wrong way and does that impact votes for him? Not saying that's the case with Ortega, but I do know that before the first series between UNO and UND this year he talked a little smack. Who knows.
 
Re: The NCHC Year Two: Haters Please Form A Queue to the Right

I don't understand why this is even being debated. Ortega hot sauce is absolutely terrible and there is no way it deserves to be All Conference.
 
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