The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

This Israel-Palestine thing seems to be ramping up every day. Discuss.

Obush's fault.

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

Obush's fault.

At least Bush didn't create false expectations by trying to drum up peace talks that were doomed from the start to look good, unlike our current resident of the Oval Office.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

Obush's fault.

F that. I blame Lincoln. That ccksucker never did anything to try and solve the crisis.

 

[unofan]

At least Bush didn't create false expectations by trying to drum up peace talks that were doomed from the start to look good, unlike our current resident of the Oval Office.

Obama personally killed both the three Israeli teens and the Palestinian kid in the ensuing riots. Clearly history's greatest monster.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

At least Bush didn't create false expectations by trying to drum up peace talks that were doomed from the start to look good, unlike our current resident of the Oval Office.

Wait, are you serious? You think it was all a farce? You're absolutely nuts. A stable Middle East would be one of the best things to happen to the world economy since WWII. Cheap, plentiful oil. Divergence of resources from the war machine to technology, science, infrastructure, and all the touchy-feely things?

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

Wait, are you serious? You think it was all a farce? You're absolutely nuts. A stable Middle East would be one of the best things to happen to the world economy since WWII. Cheap, plentiful oil. Divergence of resources from the war machine to technology, science, infrastructure, and all the touchy-feely things?

Oh, come on! Of course everybody would love to have a stable, peaceful Middle East. That's not what I'm talking about. But you're worse off than before if you try to push talks when there's no impetus for such talks on either side of the bargaining table, and there's been precious little of that for a good while or realistic expectations of what both sides want out of the deal, particularly the Palestinian side. People get their hopes up, only to be inevitably dashed when talks fall apart.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

Oh, come on! Of course everybody would love to have a stable, peaceful Middle East. That's not what I'm talking about. But you're worse off than before if you try to push talks when there's no impetus for such talks on either side of the bargaining table, and there's been precious little of that for a good while or realistic expectations of what both sides want out of the deal, particularly the Palestinian side. People get their hopes up, only to be inevitably dashed when talks fall apart.

So we shouldn't even try? Because the talks could fail?

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

So we shouldn't even try? Because the talks could fail?

There's a thing called timing. Ignoring it can make a bad situation worse.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

There's a thing called timing. Ignoring it can make a bad situation worse.

Right, but at the same time, we shouldn't just pretend the situation isn't a powder keg ready to go off at the slightest touch at any time. This (the current effort) is a process that has been in the works since the middle of the 1990s in a conflict that has been going on since the, well, probably "0090s".

If you're not continually working at it, eventually someone will assassinate an archduke and we're all in trouble then.

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

Right, but at the same time, we shouldn't just pretend the situation isn't a powder keg ready to go off at the slightest touch

Yes, a slightest touch like poorly timed and thought out peace talks.

 

[Priceless]

Right, but at the same time, we shouldn't just pretend the situation isn't a powder keg ready to go off at the slightest touch at any time. This (the current effort) is a process that has been in the works since the middle of the 1990s in a conflict that has been going on since the, well, probably "0090s".

If you're not continually working at it, eventually someone will assassinate an archduke and we're all in trouble then.

The problem has existed since Isaac and Ishmael and won't end until one side is completely wiped out. Such a bother that all our oil was buried in the sand underneath them.

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

The problem has existed since Isaac and Ishmael and won't end until one side is completely wiped out. Such a bother that all our oil was buried in the sand underneath them.

Yup. Really, I don't expect peace talks will ever sort out the situation, as there are some pretty mutually exclusive demands on both sides that aren't likely to be given up. But I'm ok with trying talks if there in an opportune time.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

Yes, a slightest touch like poorly timed and thought out peace talks.

As some wild-eyed idealist liberal once said, "jaw, jaw is always better than war, war."

Ethnic war like Israel/Palestine pretty much always leads to genocide. That's why the Old Testament God seems so cray cray. Tribalism is an elimination game.

I suppose if the primary concern was simply to save lives, we could deport every person living between Aleppo and Mecca to Greenland, nuke the desert, and say "Neither of you can have it for the next 10,000 years. Fixed."

The oil running out won't hurt, though.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

If Obama had done nothing to try and bring peace he'd be crucified. If he saved a baby from a burning building he's fail if he didn't also put out the fire.

The list of legitimate criticisms for Obama is substantial and real, yet the draggers can't stop falling over themselves making up reasons to ***** thereby distracting the public from the real reasons to complain.

The boy hasn't cried wolf, he's devoured him.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

If Obama had done nothing to try and bring peace he'd be crucified. If he saved a baby from a burning building he's fail if he didn't also put out the fire.

The list of legitimate criticisms for Obama is substantial and real, yet the draggers can't stop falling over themselves making up reasons to ***** thereby distracting the public from the real reasons to complain.

The boy hasn't cried wolf, he's devoured him.

Yeah, but Obama wasn't even born here. Impeach!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (c. Sarah Palin)

 

[Handyman]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

The problem has existed since Isaac and Ishmael and won't end until one side is completely wiped out. Such a bother that all our oil was buried in the sand underneath them.

That is not true...in fact throughout history Muslims have treated Jews better than Christians/Catholics have.

This is a complicated issue but the biblical parts of it are overblown.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

This is a complicated issue but the biblical parts of it are overblown.

No kidding! The Bible was written well before Islam was even invented / discovered when the angel gabriel supposedly visited Muhammed in a dream in AD 610 (according to wikipedia).

 

[Kepler]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

That is not true...in fact throughout history Muslims have treated Jews better than Christians/Catholics have

While you are right, this doesn't really speak to what's unsolvable in the region. Religious wars are vicious and stupid but they can be ended -- the Spanish and Dutch haven't done much killing one one another the last 400 years. In tribalism, faith is just another proxy for "your great uncle killed my great uncle." A tiny part of the population is full-on nutbar and wants you to die if you aren't bowing to the correct invisible friend, but those guys exist everywhere from Tehran to Tupelo. The aspect that spreads the violence from the 700 Club psychos out to people with otherwise functioning brain cells is tribal identity.

And then once bombs start going off, it's a never-ending Sicilian vendetta cycle.

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

As some wild-eyed idealist liberal once said, "jaw, jaw is always better than war, war."

Ethnic war like Israel/Palestine pretty much always leads to genocide. That's why the Old Testament God seems so cray cray. Tribalism is an elimination game.

I suppose if the primary concern was simply to save lives, we could deport every person living between Aleppo and Mecca to Greenland, nuke the desert, and say "Neither of you can have it for the next 10,000 years. Fixed."

The oil running out won't hurt, though.

That's a false choice. It's not like people sit around and say, I will either talk to my enemy or fight him in a war, which should I do. Talking can help solve problems, or can exacerbate problems. In this case I argue the false hope of peace talks exacerbated the situation.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The Global War on Terror 5.0: Putin on the Risk

That's a false choice. It's not like people sit around and say, I will either talk to my enemy or fight him in a war, which should I do. Talking can help solve problems, or can exacerbate problems. In this case I argue the false hope of peace talks exacerbated the situation.

I don't get it. I'm sure what you're saying makes sense, but honestly I'm just not following what you're saying.

And anyway, it's not my quote -- blame YOUR guy.