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The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

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Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Bob Gray said:
You really believe that? Egads! We really are from different planets. Maybe you don't have an interest in rolling us, but you're the exception to the rule. We aren't the ones pushing things down anyone's throat, that's you and yours.
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Too funny. If Christians, as a group, just wanted to live in *homes* that were free from gay marriage, there would be no issues. But that's not the case at all. By and large, Christians want to live in a *society* that is free from gay marriage, and therein lies the issue.

I have yet to hear of anyone who thinks that all of society should be gay married - if you can find one, I'd love to know about it so I can laugh at him/her just as hard as I laugh at gay marriage opponents. The two ends of the spectrum truly are "everyone should be gay married" and "nobody should be gay married." The middle position is "those who want to can get gay married." Christians are so used to society being so far out in right field that they forgot what the middle looks like - they don't even recognize it when they see it.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

LynahFan said:
Too funny. If Christians, as a group, just wanted to live in *homes* that were free from gay marriage, there would be no issues. But that's not the case at all. By and large, Christians want to live in a *society* that is free from gay marriage, and therein lies the issue.

...

The two ends of the spectrum truly are "everyone should be gay married" and "nobody should be gay married." The middle position is "those who want to can get gay married." Christians are so used to society being so far out in right field that they forgot what the middle looks like - they don't even recognize it when they see it.
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Thank you, that's a better version of what I was trying to say.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

St. Clown said:
How many Christmas movies has the popular culture machine in Hollywood produced over the years? There have been so many that I don't have a count. How many Channukah movies? I know of only one - a lousy Adam Sandberg animated movie at that. How many Ramadan movies? Now let's go into the polytheistic religions that were made as articles of faith, not told as ancient myths/fiction...

And then there are the non-holiday movies supporting one religion over another, and still the Christians are going to come out on top.

At the same time, yes, there are factions of our culture taking aim at Christians just as I see Christians taking aim at them. That's the burden of being the top dog in town, you become a target.
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If you're living in the 30s or 50s, what you say has some merit, though even then the course of moviemaking was away from Christian values, it just took awhile to reach cesspool stage we're at now. I was talking about now and within the lifetimes of most of us. Movies now and recently are overwhelmingly garbage that I can't imagine almost any Christian endorsing. Same with TV, popular music, etc., etc., etc. I find it very fascinating that people won't even admit the astoundingly obvious observation I made.
 
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Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Bob Gray said:
If you're living in the 30s or 50s, what you say has some merit, though even then the course of moviemaking was away from Christian values, it just took awhile to reach cesspool stage we're at now. I was talking about now and within the lifetimes of most of us. Movies now and recently are overwhelmingly garbage that I can't imagine almost any Christian endorsing. Same with TV, popular music, etc., etc., etc. I find it very fascinating that people won't even admit the astoundingly obvious observation I made.
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So, you want to go back to the Hays Code.

If you look at pre-code movies from the 30s they were "dirty" enough to give the prudes of the day the vapors, too. We then had a 30-year period in which studios self-censored to the level of Ma and Pa Kettle in Peoria because they knew politicians will always bow to the bluenoses for the same reason that intolerance always beats tolerance: the intolerant are louder, more violent, and more relentless in forcing their version of moral codes on society than the tolerant are in defending freedom of expression, since "burn the witch!" is always stronger than "dude, she's not even a witch, so chill out."

You're also thinking that it's Those Evil Secularists who are consuming all those violent, prurient movies out there, when in reality if you look at the high brow movies that are popular among the atheist academic set they are quieter, gentler, and if anything more moral than the stuff the studios churn out for the swine. And who is primarily low brow? Religion is big with the orcs. Just as the Deep South is also the league leader in drunkenness, unemployment, divorce, teen moms, sexual assault and domestic violence, it's the salt of the Earth types who are packing the theaters to watch big budget flicks.

It aint us, friend. I recommend the passage about the mote and the beam. :)
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Bob Gray said:
All depends on what one considers to be in balance. I respect that others reasonably come to different conclusions on what in balance means. Not everyone seems able to do so.

Funny how Christianity is dominant, yet is almost universally mocked in the media and popular culture. As I've asked before, show me characters on TV in recent years that reflect this supposedly dominant cultural force.
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https://www.fcc.gov/guides/obscenity-indecency-profanity-faq
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Kepler said:
So, you want to go back to the Hays Code.

If you look at pre-code movies from the 30s they were "dirty" enough to give the prudes of the day the vapors, too. We then had a 30-year period in which studios self-censored to the level of Ma and Pa Kettle in Peoria because they knew politicians will always bow to the bluenoses for the same reason that intolerance always beats tolerance: the intolerant are louder, more violent, and more relentless in forcing their version of moral codes on society than the tolerant are in defending freedom of expression, since "burn the witch!" is always stronger than "dude, she's not even a witch, so chill out."

You're also thinking that it's Those Evil Secularists who are consuming all those violent, prurient movies out there, when in reality if you look at the high brow movies that are popular among the atheist academic set they are quieter, gentler, and if anything more moral than the stuff the studios churn out for the swine. And who is primarily low brow? Religion is big with the orcs. Just as the Deep South is also the league leader in drunkenness, unemployment, divorce, teen moms, sexual assault and domestic violence, it's the salt of the Earth types who are packing the theaters to watch big budget flicks.

It aint us, friend. I recommend the passage about the mote and the beam. :)
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Keep telling yourself that. Not that it makes it true.

I never said anything about any code, just observing how things have trended, but nice try at a diversion.

Also, I never said anything about atheists. If I had to list folks I'm concerned about, atheists would be well down the list. At least they have taken the time to think about religion and come to some conclusions and at least in some cases are good folks to talk to. You sure come to a lot of conclusions about me on stuff I haven't said a word about.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Weren't most of the Hollywood studio moguls Jewish?

Best Jewish movie: Fiddler on the Roof
Worst Jewish movie: Yentl
Best Catholic movie: Keys of the Kingdom
Worst Catholic movie: The Cardinal (not that Otto tried. The book is 1000x better than the movie)
Best religious movie (tie) Ten Commandments, Ben Hur
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Bob Gray said:
Funny how Christianity is dominant, yet is almost universally mocked in the media and popular culture. As I've asked before, show me characters on TV in recent years that reflect this supposedly dominant cultural force. The silence has been deafening. At the very least I'd hope such facts would help some people realize that things aren't as simplistic as is often represented. Or maybe people really are that oblivious.
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Certainly destroyed this nobody's career. ;)
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/enterta...-says-premature-son-restored-my-faith-in-god/
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Bob Gray said:
You sure come to a lot of conclusions about me on stuff I haven't said a word about.
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It would help if you would state what you would do to change things. "The world is going to hell in a handbasket" is a slogan, not a program for change.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Kepler said:
It would help if you would state what you would do to change things. "The world is going to hell in a handbasket" is a slogan, not a program for change.
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Donald Trump used that slogan very well in his announcement speech yesterday.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Kepler said:
It would help if you would state what you would do to change things. "The world is going to hell in a handbasket" is a slogan, not a program for change.
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You never seem to like the changes I suggest, so I try not to subject you to them at every turn! :p
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Bob Gray said:
Funny how Christianity is dominant, yet is almost universally mocked in the media and popular culture. As I've asked before, show me characters on TV in recent years that reflect this supposedly dominant cultural force. The silence has been deafening. At the very least I'd hope such facts would help some people realize that things aren't as simplistic as is often represented. Or maybe people really are that oblivious.
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Well a couple come to mind for me immediately. On the TV show Bones the lead male character is devoutly Catholic. His professional partner (and later wife) is an empiricist, probably atheist and certainly agnostic, yet following their marriage she so respects his faith and beliefs she enthusiastically agrees to baptize their first born. His Catholicism is not a constant part of the show's storyline, but it is used often enough to establish his beliefs in a very concrete way. And in the comedy series The Big Bang Theory the co-lead male character is also a scientist, seemingly an avowed atheist. His mother though is a devout Christian. While her beliefs are played up for comic value (as is everything else on the show as all the beliefs and habits of the characters are played up for comic value, it is a comedy after all) she is also respected immensely by the other characters and is shown to be an incredibly warm and loving mother who would do anything for her son and respects his friends. The other co-lead male character has a mother who is a scientist as well and while her religious leanings are not part of the story arc of her character one can safely assume she believes as the others do, in science and not religion. Yet her character is constantly mocked as being cold, unfeeling and a bad parent.

I don't watch a lot of TV other than sports, maybe 2 or 3 shows I like enough to DVR, but I don't see Christianity being mocked in television to any great extent, and certainly not out of balance to places it is portrayed favorably.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Kepler said:
It would help if you would state what you would do to change things. "The world is going to hell in a handbasket" is a slogan, not a program for change.
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When I was at Tech, we had a small group of geriatric war protesters who stood out in the veteran's memorial park above the bridge between Houghton and Hancock where all the cars coming across could see them, with their "Grandmas For Change" signs. The running bad joke was that they wanted something changed, but they had forgotten what. Maybe their Depends needed changing.

Point is, you aren't supposed to have a plan or be all that interested in action, you're just supposed to complain. It's part of being American.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

FadeToBlack&Gold said:
When I was at Tech, we had a small group of geriatric war protesters who stood out in the veteran's memorial park above the bridge between Houghton and Hancock where all the cars coming across could see them, with their "Grandmas For Change" signs. The running bad joke was that they wanted something changed, but they had forgotten what. Maybe their Depends needed changing.

Point is, you aren't supposed to have a plan or be all that interested in action, you're just supposed to complain. It's part of being American.
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As we all observe, well laid out, detailed plans for all the issues discussed on this board are rife!


I joke.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

FadeToBlack&Gold said:
When I was at Tech, we had a small group of geriatric war protesters who stood out in the veteran's memorial park above the bridge between Houghton and Hancock where all the cars coming across could see them, with their "Grandmas For Change" signs. The running bad joke was that they wanted something changed, but they had forgotten what. Maybe their Depends needed changing.

Point is, you aren't supposed to have a plan or be all that interested in action, you're just supposed to complain. It's part of being American.
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I support the right to be promiscuously ANTI-. But people who do that without clarifying what they would like to see done differently among hordes of complainers who have the same complaints and a very definite To Do list do risk being lumped in with the crowd.

Bob says I don't like his recommendations for change, but I don't recall ever seeing one. Granted, I don't follow that closely, but I'm pretty sure I'd have noticed something other than "turn the clock back to 1955." Which, BTW, I am not nearly as opposed to as Bob et al. might think. 90% top marginal rate and this as fashion? We could do a lot worse.
 
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