The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

[Bakunin]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Blame useless Harry Reid. The reason why the Dems couldn't accomplish what they should have when in the majority is because of that clueless idiot.

So why is he still majority leader?

Secondly, who do you blame for the extension of the Bush tax cuts in the lame duck session? That had to pass both chambers and be signed by the president, didn't it?

The Democrats are pretty much inept as a majority party. So the voting public gets to choose between horrible and inept. Wonderful, just wonderful.

And Scooby, it shouldn't surprise you that Obama has not been able to strong-arm Congress to get his way on anything - it mimics his approach to foreign policy: defer to everybody else out of fear of p*ssing people off. It's basically over-compensating for what W did the previous eight years, but the problem is too much deference leads to a muddled pile of ****. At some point, you have to take a bold stand on something, especially domestically. Congress is a complete mess when left to its own devices.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

So why is he still majority leader?

Secondly, who do you blame for the extension of the Bush tax cuts in the lame duck session? That had to pass both chambers and be signed by the president, didn't it?

The Democrats are pretty much inept as a majority party. So the voting public gets to choose between horrible and inept. Wonderful, just wonderful.

And Scooby, it shouldn't surprise you that Obama has not been able to strong-arm Congress to get his way on anything - it mimics his approach to foreign policy: defer to everybody else out of fear of p*ssing people off. It's basically over-compensating for what W did the previous eight years, but the problem is too much deference leads to a muddled pile of ****. At some point, you have to take a bold stand on something, especially domestically. Congress is a complete mess when left to its own devices.

Not surprised at all. It's one of the reasons I didn't vote for him.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Blame useless Harry Reid. The reason why the Dems couldn't accomplish what they should have when in the majority is because of that clueless idiot.

Harry's usually bad, but he actually hasn't been out to lunch this time. This one's "on the House." His strategy of waiting for Boehner to pass his bill, then immediately tabling it and throwing his own back to force the House to adopt with a few changes is still the right thing to do. It would have worked if Boehner had been able to control his caucus.

I wonder whether Boehner could convince the TPers to stage a flounce out, and then pass his bill in their absence? That would be the kind of Gotterdamerung Drama Queen political theater those types love, the TP could claim they were pure, and we'd be able to get on with running the country.

Inconveniently, the Constitution protects imbeciles just as it does any other sizable minority.

Because of all the derp the GOP has whipped up about That Half Breed Muslin, when Obama had his hand in the talks the GOP was robotically programmed to oppose anything. He stepped back because that was the only way to give the sane Republicans room to get a deal. The GOP leadership is caught in its own trap -- the coward who yelled "hold me back, hold me back!" That's what happens when you pretend not to see the vicious animals among you because it's politically expedient. How's that workin out for you now? Anyway, Obama got his Dems all lined up -- that's all he had the power to do. Jesus, there's going to be UNANIMITY from the Dems in both chambers -- when's the last time that happened?!

 

[aparch]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

The US Congress and Presidency can be summed up like this:

They're the Chicago Cubs of politics.

No matter how many head coaches (Presidents) they go through, the bumbling idiots (Congressmen/Representatives) don't ever change (names yes, talent no), the team still loses, and yet the fans (US Voters) still keep coming back to watch their "lovable losers."

 

[bronconick]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Obama just told Boehner he's wasting his time and the only thing getting through the House requires Democratic votes.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Obama just told Boehner he's wasting his time and the only thing getting through the House requires Democratic votes.

I'm pretty sure he's been telling him that for a week.

Boehner's bill isn't just political theater, it's internal Republican political theater. It's twice removed from actually legislating. I'm glad he felt it was important to waste 3 whole days setting up a mock vote that will then be immediately flushed.

There's a point at which Reid-McConnell should pass a bill with a huge bipartisan majority, and then with the House stalled until the eleventh hour Boehner will have no choice but to pull his off the floor and have a vote on the Senate version. The GOP has already gotten everything they wanted; they can't force the country into default just to save Boehner.

 

[Rover]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

So why is he still majority leader?

Secondly, who do you blame for the extension of the Bush tax cuts in the lame duck session? That had to pass both chambers and be signed by the president, didn't it?

The Democrats are pretty much inept as a majority party. So the voting public gets to choose between horrible and inept. Wonderful, just wonderful.

God only knows why Reid is Majority Leader. I suspect its out of deference to his seniority which is ridiculous but is how the Senate works. The problem for Dems is they tend to play by rules that no longer apply which gets them in trouble in multiple ways.

Obama made a deal on the 2 year extention of tax cuts again mistakenly thinking that old rules applied to negotiations and that the GOP would be willing to reciprocate somewhere down the line. He was clearly wrong on that count, something I suspect he's slowly figuring out.

Democrats problem with governing is that they think they can reason with everybody. As most of us in the working world realize sooner or later, there's no point arguing with idiots. All this so called camaraderie of the Senate doesn't actually exist. The GOP leadership pretends it does when for example they're trying to kill the Health Care bill by pretending to negotiate while at the same time telling they're supporters they're purposefully blocking the bill. I can understand a bumpkin like Jimmy Carter not realizing how Washington works, but I'm not sure why the Obama-Biden team, two former Senators, couldn't figure this out. Don't get me wrong, they've accomplished quite a bit that I like. But what he needs to realize, like it or not, is that he doesn't have the ability to change the tone in Washington and that the opposition party has already declared war on him, so he may as well join the battle. Some people get that. Pelosi does. Howard Dean did (as DNC chairman, I can't believe they got rid of him). Bill Clinton did eventually. I don't see Obama going for the jugular yet in this current fight, and I'm not happy about that. He's fortunate for the circular firing squad going on in the House but he has nothing to do with that.

 

[bronconick]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Supposedly Boner is now talking about adding on the balanced budget amendment onto his bill to get the Tea Party on, making it more radioactive to everyone else. What a dick. Pun intended.

 

[Rover]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Supposedly Boner is now talking about adding on the balanced budget amendment onto his bill to get the Tea Party on, making it more radioactive to everyone else. What a dick. Pun intended.

The best part is that you can't raise the debt ceiling again in 6 months unless a balanced budget amendment has passed. Good luck with that. We'll be lucky if the country's credit rating is a "C" by that time.

Isn't it about time the guy focuses on the possible instead of base pleasing idiocy?

 

[bronconick]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

That and I don't think he could get 290 members of the House to agree that water is wet at this point. Since he can't, the amendment dies in the House regardless of what it's attached to.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

That and I don't think he could get 290 members of the House to agree that water is wet at this point. Since he can't, the amendment dies in the House regardless of what it's attached to.

If he had any leadership ability at all he should be able to pass a compromise bill with non-tea party republicans and the democrats. Hang the tea party nutjobs out to dry.

 

[unofan]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

If he had any leadership ability at all he should be able to pass a compromise bill with non-tea party republicans and the democrats. Hang the tea party nutjobs out to dry.

That's what'll ultimately happen, I bet. You get the Dems plus about 50-75 GOP members from the more liberal areas (and thus more insulated from being primaried) to vote for Reid's plan.

The Tea Party needs to get their asses handed to them next year. Unfortunately, there's probably too many districts like Steve King's and Michelle Bachmann's to make that happen. But we'll see.

 

[Twitch Boy]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

If he had any leadership ability at all he should be able to pass a compromise bill with non-tea party republicans and the democrats. Hang the tea party nutjobs out to dry.

Enough people are upset with the Teabaggers that their primary weapon (pun intended) will lose its effectiveness. The incumbent will either win the primary anyway or pull a Lisa Murkowski.

And there are plenty of rational Republicans who realize this, or will soon...right? Right?

 

[bronconick]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Let me pull something from the last thread, you know, when we thought we might not default.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Enough people are upset with the Teabaggers that their primary weapon (pun intended) will lose its effectiveness. The incumbent will either win the primary anyway or pull a Lisa Murkowski.

And there are plenty of rational Republicans who realize this, or will soon...right? Right?

538 (or somebody like that) has an analysis where the Republicans who are on record opposing Boehner no matter what are actually from safe GOP seats -- in other words, they are Republican incumbents who are afraid of being primaried from the right rather than losing their general elections. As safe seats drift right, any contested seats that are successfully primaried will be lost to centrist Dems. So moderate Republicans are eroded on both ends.

Since the loudest mouthpieces on the right make their money fostering conflict, we should expect Tea Party rhetoric to become more and more strident, until either the fever breaks or they reduce the party to a regional circle jerk irrelevant to national politics. Which would fine, except these people are armed and believe Jesus tells them to vote the way they do.

The derp South has mounted two insurrections against national democratic government, in the 1860's and the 1960's. Maybe better communications means their third try is coming a few decades early. The first two ended in crushing, coerced humiliations -- the only thing Johnny Reb does better than living on welfare is losing. This time, though; why bother? Just let them go.

 

[unofan]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/....html?hp&gwh=E32BF54C4B7AF63816156536B9F8AD52

Interesting graph by NY Times readers...clearly not a scientific sample, and some people cannot figure out the axes (axises? axii?), but a nice pictoral nonetheless.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/....html?hp&gwh=E32BF54C4B7AF63816156536B9F8AD52

Interesting graph by NY Times readers...clearly not a scientific sample, and some people cannot figure out the axes (axises? axii?), but a nice pictoral nonetheless.

This chart is hysterical because people are clearly not matching their positioning with their opinions. Jesus Christ, people, it's Cartesian geometry, not Lobachevskian.

 

[BCeagle]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

I say Obama must invoke the 14th amendment if the clowns in Congress can't reach an agreement. He may suffer politically but if he's sincere, he will do what is best for the country and raise the debt ceiling by invoking the 14th.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

I say Obama must invoke the 14th amendment if the clowns in Congress can't reach an agreement. He may suffer politically but if he's sincere, he will do what is best for the country and raise the debt ceiling by invoking the 14th.

That would make for an interesting Court challenge. Scalia's head might explode, which would be a nice side effect.

If Obama and Reid had Pelosi's balls, they would propose this as their plan, and tell the GOP the "compromise" is a clean debt ceiling bill and cut the crap.

 

[WetSubArticCanine]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/....html?hp&gwh=E32BF54C4B7AF63816156536B9F8AD52

Interesting graph by NY Times readers...clearly not a scientific sample, and some people cannot figure out the axes (axises? axii?), but a nice pictoral nonetheless.

An idea for a USCHO poll (Pole): What is the “information” source of responders that would produce a mirrored distribution - what’s the sources of the pyre’s flammables. Freddy?