Shannon Miller out at UMD?

[KTDC]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

As a far away outsider, geographically, but as someone who has closely been involved with a program's major upheaval, thru all this peripheral crap going on between the parties involved, in the end we only care about the players....the girls who give their all for the sport they love, who get caught up in the politics that surround sports.....so as we here at UNH are doing, support the team despite the other crap and noise! In the end you'll feel better...

I watched the UNH thing from faraway last year, that really seemed like a fiasco!

I'm not convinced the athletic department at UMD is really messing this one up. They decided it was time for Shannon to go. Early in the holiday break maybe was a good time to make the announcement. The players could get used to the idea while they are on break, let the drama settle a little bit, and be ready to go for the 2nd half. Shannon can really play the us against them card, which I would expect she's pretty good at. And they can try to make a good stretch run for her last season.

Saying it was a financial decision also seems true as far as it went and also offered some cover to Coach Miller if she wanted to accept it. She doesn't seem to want to, which probably isn't a surprise. But her response is fair warning to anybody who may want to hire her.

It also gives the players some time to make a measured decision about staying or leaving and also gives the AD some time to see who may be a good person to replace Coach Miller. Possibly they may even be in a position to not miss a whole recruiting season and keep some of the players around who may want to stay. I don't know, but I would think, if they aren't firing her but just not renewing the contract, they could have someone in place by the end of the season or very soon afterwards. There wouldn't be legal issues in that situation, would there?

 

[zoofer]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Some very valid points KTDC....I just think that as all institutions say their #1 concern is the student-athlete, inevitably they come out with their decisions at what seems like the worst times...yes Miller wasn't fired, so why not just play out the season and then state your case? Simple enough....at UNH, it was the handling of the decision as well, not so much their initial actions....although come March, I think the state of NH will have less $$$ in their general fund!!

 

[pokechecker]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Are you suggesting to get rid of all sports that do not impact the bottom line? I would argue the positive growth in women's college hockey has had a greater impact to the Duluth area then what you think. The economy as a whole benefits. Jobs, hotels, restaurants, sporting goods stores, gas stations...etc. The growth of female hockey has as much to do with the growth of women's college hockey - the bottom line is that this is new money being spent within these hockey communities. See the big picture! The $'s that are being discussed here UMD women's hockey salary cuts are peanuts compared to the positive economic impact that UMD women's hockey has brought to their region.

If we scrapped your so called "failed business model" across the country among your so called "failed business model" athletics programs there would be a serious negative economic impact felt - then you could bet your bottom dollar you would see a lot more ****ed off people then a few coaching staff.

Student athletes are resilient, they will recover from this and their are a lot of great coaches out there that would so an outstanding job at UMD.

Time to move forward and let this season play itself out. Come on UMD coaches, focus on what's most important here and what's in your control. Give your seniors a chance to win a National Championship.

you better believe some universities are looking at cutting some sports, happens all the time

I guess it is dangerous to use personal experience to generalize what is going on, but a year ago when I parked downtown and walked to Amsoil I noticed one Bar/R gave a free drink with a game ticket and another gave $5 off a meal, so I stopped in one the 1st night and the 2nd the next night. Both places were surprised there was even a hockey game that night, I didn't see anybody that looked like a Bulldog/Gopher fan. But I 'spose knowing Minnesotans , they all went to Canal park to see the bridge go up and down and dodge the pigeon poop, then went to Grandma's..

agree, , the 2nd half of the season looks like it will be an interesting one. Just another week to go until hockey.

 

[ARM]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

... why not just play out the season and then state your case?

In UMD's case, they said they were obligated to inform the coaches in advance that they were not going to be renewed. If so, the rumor mill would soon let slip that such a decision had been made, so IMO, it is better to have it out in the open than festering below the surface for the rest of the year. As others said, this allows a few weeks for people to digest the news before getting back to playing hockey.

 

[Cali]

In UMD's case, they said they were obligated to inform the coaches in advance that they were not going to be renewed. If so, the rumor mill would soon let slip that such a decision had been made, so IMO, it is better to have it out in the open than festering below the surface for the rest of the year. As others said, this allows a few weeks for people to digest the news before getting back to playing hockey.

I wonder if the admin anticipated Miller's, rather vocal, objection to be so prominent in the media? Even when you do the right thing, you can sometimes get bitten in the keester and the admins handling of this is now in question.

 

[CrankIt]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

It also gives the players some time to make a measured decision about staying or leaving and also gives the AD some time to see who may be a good person to replace Coach Miller. Possibly they may even be in a position to not miss a whole recruiting season and keep some of the players around who may want to stay.

Unfortunately, the players aren't left with time to find new schools should they choose to leave. A majority of programs already have their rosters set (or close to) for next season. Should the athletes really be thinking about new schools while in the middle of a hot streak? Right now, it sounds like A LOT of players are very highly considering leaving. With only 4 recruits coming in, UMD will not be able to fill all their roster spots with quality players. It also sounds like not all, if any, of the 4 recruits will decide to honor their NLI. And, honestly, I don't blame them.

 

[ARM]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Right now, it sounds like A LOT of players are very highly considering leaving.

Does that mean that Coach Miller is the only part of the UMD experience that they enjoy? People can think about leaving, but to actually leave, you also need a new destination. Some of the Europeans may choose to stay closer to home. For those wishing to still play NCAA hockey, most will likely have to settle for a lesser scholarship than what they have now. The seniors are gone in any case. If the juniors decide to go, that only impacts the program for one year. The real key is what becomes of current sophomores like Brykaliuk, Stalder, Morin, and Mrázová.

It also sounds like not all, if any, of the 4 recruits will decide to honor their NLI.

They are just a few of the hundreds of NCAA athletes every year who are impacted by a coaching change after signing.

 

[Skate79]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Unfortunately, the players aren't left with time to find new schools should they choose to leave. A majority of programs already have their rosters set (or close to) for next season. Should the athletes really be thinking about new schools while in the middle of a hot streak? Right now, it sounds like A LOT of players are very highly considering leaving. With only 4 recruits coming in, UMD will not be able to fill all their roster spots with quality players. It also sounds like not all, if any, of the 4 recruits will decide to honor their NLI. And, honestly, I don't blame them.

Not necessarily. When the BC scandal with Kelli Stack broke back in '07, Gina MacDonald decided to leave and she applied to Harvard, was accepted and played the following year on a team that was fairly loaded. This all happened in the spring and it went down pretty quick. Coaches will find room for players from other teams that are considering transferring if they think the player can make them a better team. It's not to late for these players to opt out and look for another school and program.

 

[shelfit]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Not necessarily. When the BC scandal with Kelli Stack broke back in '07, Gina MacDonald decided to leave and she applied to Harvard, was accepted and played the following year on a team that was fairly loaded. This all happened in the spring and it went down pretty quick. Coaches will find room for players from other teams that are considering transferring if they think the player can make them a better team. It's not to late for these players to opt out and look for another school and program.

That scandal had as mutch to do with the head coach as it did with Kelli Stack.

 

[CrankIt]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Not necessarily. When the BC scandal with Kelli Stack broke back in '07, Gina MacDonald decided to leave and she applied to Harvard, was accepted and played the following year on a team that was fairly loaded. This all happened in the spring and it went down pretty quick. Coaches will find room for players from other teams that are considering transferring if they think the player can make them a better team. It's not to late for these players to opt out and look for another school and program.

I guess my main point is that do you really want your athletes thinking about their next school while you're in the middle of your best season in four years?

 

[Eeyore]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

I guess my main point is that do you really want your athletes thinking about their next school while you're in the middle of your best season in four years?

Again, they didn't have a choice if they wanted to terminate the contract.

 

[joecct]

you better believe some universities are looking at cutting some sports, happens all the time

I guess it is dangerous to use personal experience to generalize what is going on, but a year ago when I parked downtown and walked to Amsoil I noticed one Bar/R gave a free drink with a game ticket and another gave $5 off a meal, so I stopped in one the 1st night and the 2nd the next night. Both places were surprised there was even a hockey game that night, I didn't see anybody that looked like a Bulldog/Gopher fan. But I 'spose knowing Minnesotans , they all went to Canal park to see the bridge go up and down and dodge the pigeon poop, then went to Grandma's..

agree, , the 2nd half of the season looks like it will be an interesting one. Just another week to go until hockey.

Or East was playing somebody decent.

 

[CrankIt]

Again, they didn't have a choice if they wanted to terminate the contract.

The only person that needed 6 months of advance notice was assistant Laura Schuler. They could have waited three months and would have only needed to pay her for the extra three months. At this point, that option looks a lot better for the university in terms of the way they handled this whole situation. I'm still of the belief that it was a very rushed decision by the university in which very little forethought was used

 

[hockeynut]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

The only person that needed 6 months of advance notice was assistant Laura Schuler. They could have waited three months and would have only needed to pay her for the extra three months. At this point, that option looks a lot better for the university in terms of the way they handled this whole situation. I'm still of the belief that it was a very rushed decision by the university in which very little forethought was used

If there was a rush, it was only created by the aha light bulb moment that they finally had a way out.

I beg to differ with folks that want to make this all about gender.

One need look no further for a comparison than Bobby Knight.

Once you get too big for your britches, it doesn't matter if those britches are men's or women's britches, those in charge will eventually send you and your britches packing.

 

[joecct]

If there was a rush, it was only created by the aha light bulb moment that they finally had a way out.

I beg to differ with folks that want to make this all about gender.

One need look no further for a comparison than Bobby Knight.

Once you get too big for your britches, it doesn't matter if those britches are men's or women's britches, those in charge will eventually send you and your britches packing.

Unless you win (and I guess bring in alumni $$). W's cover a lot of sins.

 

[pokechecker]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

I beg to differ with folks that want to make this all about gender.

the problem with that is that they can't boycot UMD, they are already effectively boycotting UMD by not attending games. The only way to save Miller would be for people to attend the games, show their support by showing up.
saying it was bad timing ... when would it be good timing to say they weren't going to renew her contract, among other reasons, the AD likely waited until the winter break so it had time to blow over, after seeing that support just wasn't there even after a resurgance of the team's performance. It's sad really, they are the NY Yankees of women's college hockey, the team everyone loves to hate, only problem is there is more interest in the team everywhere except where it should be ... in Duluth.

I wonder if the admin anticipated Miller's, rather vocal, objection to be so prominent in the media?

Even when you do the right thing, you can sometimes get bitten in the keester and the admins handling of this is now in question.

seriously, are you even remotely familiar with Miller, UMD, and Duluth?

Or East was playing somebody decent.

I doubt East plays on both F & Sat, nor would it explain it every other weekend unless UMD women's hockey has had the unlikely coincidence of having all of their home games scheduled at the same time. But points to you for trying.

 

[Blackbeard]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

they are already effectively boycotting UMD by not attending games. The only way to save Miller would be for people to attend the games, show their support by showing up.....after seeing that support just wasn't there even after a resurgance of the team's performance.

At around 1000 per game that's not exactly "not attending games".

I get the argument about attendance relative to other programs attendance...the best looking one in an ugly bunch. But at 4th or 5th in the nation in attendance how much better does it have to get in order to cross some theoretical magical line?

You seemed to previously imply that attendance was not your definition of support. I asked you if it wasn't then what was? I didn't get an answer from you. Have you changed your mind or if not then, I'll ask again, what do you consider to be support?

(Another poster responded to that previous question of mine to you with "$$$$$$". Of course, ultimately it's money, but the question is how is it objectively measured as having been brought in by the hockey program? Attendance would seem to be one obvious answer as would sales of team paraphernalia in the sales shop in the arena).

 

[ne7minder]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

(Another poster responded to that previous question of mine to you with "$$$$$$". Of course, ultimately it's money, but the question is how is it objectively measured as having been brought in by the hockey program? Attendance would seem to be one obvious answer as would sales of team paraphernalia in the sales shop in the arena).

Have been to a lot of games at DECC and AmSoil 1000 would be a big night. They have done better recently but it sure does not look like nearly that many. I was told by someone who claimed to know that Miller was a rainmaker & brought some large donations into the program. Maybe that was not true, is no longer true or the administration didn't see big enough showers. Hard to know since everyone has a reason to lie. Sadly, there is not much women specific paraphernalia for sale. Everyone sells a lot of "HOCKEY" stuff but not much "WOMENS HOCKEY". I talked to the buyer for Goldy's & he whined to me that an undefeated national championship team could only sell 98 T-shirts the week after the win. Unless the moneyed interests stepped in Miller is done. This is a hazard for every coach. Hopefully her replacement as them back in the NCAA play-offs & winning soon.

 

[TonyTheTiger20]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Sadly, there is not much women specific paraphernalia for sale. Everyone sells a lot of "HOCKEY" stuff but not much "WOMENS HOCKEY".

Tell me about it; the only thing I own that says "women's hockey" on it is a Minnesota t-shirt.

That goes into the bottom of the closet come March.

 

[D2D]

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Tell me about it; the only thing I own that says "women's hockey" on it is a Minnesota t-shirt.

That goes into the bottom of the closet come March.

I think the pink hoodie would be perfect for you, Grant:
https://www.mygophersports.com/onli...B-95AD-E23413BAE22F&doWork::WScontent::search