What's new
By:
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

burd said:
Sequestration applies to non party witnesses, though. K and F aren't parties, but they should be able to hear what the other has to say, IMO. If I'm F's lawyer, I want to hear what K says, so the panel members can't misquote or misconstrue his testimony when they examine her. Same for K.
Click to expand...

I think another blunder that Ford's attorney has made is this demand that Ford never be in the same room as Kavanaugh. If I were her, or if I were her lawyer, I'd demand that she have the right to sit in the front row of that room while he testifies. If he's going to lie about her or his interactions with her, I'd want him to have to do it to her face.
 
SJHovey said:
I think another blunder that Ford's attorney has made is this demand that Ford never be in the same room as Kavanaugh. If I were her, or if I were her lawyer, I'd demand that she have the right to sit in the front row of that room while he testifies. If he's going to lie about her or his interactions with her, I'd want him to have to do it to her face.
Click to expand...

From the sounds of it that might have more to do with an emotional issue. Same with the flying. (She may have some PTSD)

It isn't easy to face your attacker. (If he actually did it). Ask a victim sometime.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

Handyman said:
From the sounds of it that might have more to do with an emotional issue. Same with the flying. (She may have some PTSD)

It isn't easy to face your attacker. (If he actually did it). Ask a victim sometime.
Click to expand...

I didn't say it was going to be easy. Nothing about this is going to be easy for her. It never is for women in her situation, whether it's a criminal case or something like this. What I'm saying is that if I were her friend or counselor, I'd encourage her stare him down and lie to her face.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

SJHovey said:
For reasons that aren't clear to me, I'll agree to type this one more time. There are no allegations from her. At least not yet. At least not that she's willing to swear to tell the truth to.

What we have is someone told the New York Times that they were told by Diane Feinstein that she received a letter which contained some allegations.

I have an idea. How about we let the woman testify. Let's hear her story. Then if Kavanaugh wants to respond, so be it. At least at that point he'll know what her story is, and anyone who wants to ask him a question will know what her story is.

All Kavanaugh has done thus far is deny what someone's cousin overheard his next-door-neighbor whisper to his dog.
Click to expand...

After the letter and her identity were revealed, Ford gave her account in the newspapers. Kavanaugh knows what she said he did. He says he wasn't even there, never happened.


If he was never there, if it never happened, what on earth can she surprise him with? Unless he's lying.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

SJHovey said:
I didn't say it was going to be easy. Nothing about this is going to be easy for her. It never is for women in her situation, whether it's a criminal case or something like this. What I'm saying is that if I were her friend or counselor, I'd encourage her stare him down and lie to her face.
Click to expand...
Please tell us more about what you'd do if you were a psychiatrist or a friend of a rape victim.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

Why Ford needs to be heard: https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...anaugh-heres-her-take/?utm_term=.0a585c148db1

Critics of Ford have taken to calling into question whether it’s possible for a 30-year-old memory to be credible.

Sex crimes prosecutors across the country forge ahead on “he-said-she-said” cases regularly.

“I stand to believe there’s no such thing as a ‘he-said-she-said’ case,” Linda Fairstein, former chief of the Manhattan District Attorney’s Office’s Sex Crimes Bureau, told The Post. “As a prosecutor, it’s your job to break down every minute of the encounter so that details on one side pushes the facts over the edge.”

Prosecutors do that regularly, in large part by parsing what’s reasonable and what’s believable through corroboration, details that have the ring of truth and inconvenient facts that are subtle signs of credibility.
Click to expand...

Ford’s account is credible, even though she can’t remember several details.
There’s no criminal trial, but Kavanaugh still has the presumption of innocence, said attorney Douglas Wigdor, a former prosecutor who now represents victims in sexual harassment and sexual assault cases against high-profile men.

“The reason we have statutes of limitations is because its difficult to defend yourself when someone makes an accusation against you from years ago. It’s difficult to have witnesses or forensics,” he said.

But, according to Fairstein, it was completely normal that Ford “didn’t remember” several details.

“If she testifies, I would expect her to say ‘I don’t remember’ scores of times,” Fairstein said, for two reasons: the passage of time and trauma. “She found this experience so upsetting that she felt her life was in danger. There might be 220 things she doesn’t know and then a very specific sentence about what happened that was so traumatic."
Click to expand...

According to psychologist Anne Meltzer, it may be challenging to recall peripheral details of an assault years later — such as who spread word of the party, who was the designated driver — but that should not detract from a victim’s veracity “if she can clearly and consistently articulate central details of what happened, such as the who, what and where,” she told The Post.

Meltzer, who has not reviewed the details of this case, has testified as an expert witness hundreds of times in child sexual abuse cases, with victims up to 17 years old.
Click to expand...

Are the details Ford did mention more telling?
Perhaps more striking are the details Ford did mention.

Fairstein said sexual assault rarely happens with witnesses present. Yet Ford puts two people in the room — Kavanaugh and his prep school classmate, Mark Judge, whom she called “an essential witness.”

“To me, it’s compelling that [Ford] puts someone else there, and that the person who happens to be in the room has a blackout drinking problem," said Fairstein. Judge, now a filmmaker and author, described himself similarly in his book “Wasted: Tales of a Gen-X Drunk.” “That’s sort of the intoxicated behavior she described that night,” she added.

“Ford mentioned details — like the pool party, the narrow staircase, that the house was in Montgomery County. There are enough facts for someone to remember it was their party and their house,” said Fairstein.

Wigdor echoed Fairstein, saying: “She put a third person in the room. If you were making something up, why would you do that?”

Wigdor also mentioned that Ford voluntarily took and passed a lie-detector test. “While not admissible in court, they’re used by various governmental agencies, and many people believe in their abilities,” he said.
Click to expand...

It is not alarming that Ford waited this long to talk about the assault.
The vast majority of sexual abuse victims delay disclosing what happened.

“It’s one of the most common features of child sex abuse,” Meltzer said. Most victims of child sexual abuse fear retaliation, that they won’t be believed or that their family may be angry. There are often very intense feelings of shame, guilt and humiliation.
Click to expand...

While none of this proves he's guilty it begs questions.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

I feel sorry for Dr. Ford. If I were her I would not have had the strength to come forward. Just hearing now that the Republicans have done even more disturbing things regarding the scheduling of this hearing. The Republicans are horrible.

Ford may not end up testifying. The Republicans want it their way or no way.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

LynahFan said:
A timely, sobering story of another victim: https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2018/opinions/arlington-texas/?utm_term=.f15a7e26d1e1

Anyone want to argue that DC prep students would feel even more invincible and entitled than some public school kids in the Texas burbs? Anyone still think there's no reason not to report? It always goes so well for those who report...
Click to expand...

Boys will be boys. I bet some around here will say this is no big deal and she cant be trusted. Plus we know God thinks women are awful and deserve to be treated as such.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-cards="hidden" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">GOP Senate candidate rips Kavanaugh accusation as "absurd" because it never "went anywhere" <a href="https://t.co/iZpnvJTC4L">https://t.co/iZpnvJTC4L</a> <a href="https://t.co/rZBDXxRBv0">pic.twitter.com/rZBDXxRBv0</a></p>— The Hill (@thehill) <a href="https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1043374596634947584?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 22, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Remember women of NoDak...it cant be rape if you are a teenager or were drunk.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

If you want to completely hate the world go on twitter and type in #whywomendontreport and read the stories. It is gut wrenching.

Here is one:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Why don't women report sexual assault?<br><br>Anchorage air traffic controller offered a woman a ride, kidnapped her, threatened to kill her, choked her unconscious, masturbated on her, left her on the side of the road<br><br>NO JAIL TIME <br><br>Cause he lost his job<br> <a href="https://t.co/AgebxYvaem">https://t.co/AgebxYvaem</a></p>— ☇RiotWomenn☇ (@riotwomennn) <a href="https://twitter.com/riotwomennn/status/1043103852667564032?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 21, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Last edited:
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Judge Kavanaugh I just granted another extension to Dr Ford to decide if she wants to proceed w the statement she made last week to testify to the senate She shld decide so we can move on I want to hear her. I hope u understand. It’s not my normal approach to b indecisive</p>— ChuckGrassley (@ChuckGrassley) <a href="https://twitter.com/ChuckGrassley/status/1043344767684366336?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 22, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Bro. You gotta learn the difference between dm and just posting it normal style to everyone. <a href="https://t.co/g874vlWYe2">https://t.co/g874vlWYe2</a></p>— Kumail Nanjiani (@kumailn) <a href="https://twitter.com/kumailn/status/1043366517088215041?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 22, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

Handyman said:
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-cards="hidden" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">GOP Senate candidate rips Kavanaugh accusation as "absurd" because it never "went anywhere" <a href="https://t.co/iZpnvJTC4L">https://t.co/iZpnvJTC4L</a> <a href="https://t.co/rZBDXxRBv0">pic.twitter.com/rZBDXxRBv0</a></p>— The Hill (@thehill) <a href="https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1043374596634947584?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 22, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Remember women of NoDak...it cant be rape if you are a teenager or were drunk.
Click to expand...

It's not even sexual assault unless there's actual penetration, I guess, based on what I assume he meant by "went nowhere".

So if a guy attacks you, and you manage to fend him off, or get away, you were never really attacked. Remember this, ladies, when it comes time to vote. Actual decent, human, guys, as well.

You neanderthals, just keep on doing what you're doing.
 
Re: Scotus 11: Will Thomas Ever Speak Again?

It is, however, Grassley's normal approach to be a colossal ****wad.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top