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RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Is it Saturday yet? <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/RPIHockey?src=hash">#RPIHockey</a> <a href="https://t.co/j3V6J90hmS">pic.twitter.com/j3V6J90hmS</a></p>— RPI Men's Hockey (@RPI_Hockey) <a href="https://twitter.com/RPI_Hockey/status/649645112113430529">October 1, 2015</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

sk8tronthepond said:
I'm more shocked that a partial qualifier made it through RPI admissions!
Click to expand...

Just playing devil's advocate - if this is the case (and I doubt it has anything to do with Wiffen's academic capacity, more, as has been mentioned, the testing and what constitutes a core course), are some of the concerns over "the administration is too stringent on academics" perhaps unfounded?

Anyway, I wrote a little bit about how we seem to have a pretty common theme lately of something like this cropping up and striking the team right in the nuts on a regular basis: http://www.withoutapeer.com/2015/10/it-just-keeps-happening.html
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

The whole Wiffen thing has me asking, the kid graduated HS 3 years ago?..... committed 9/21/14 & this comes out days before the season starts?
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

NBinks said:
This really sucks. How much risk is there of losing Wiffen to major junior now? Not playing for an entire season isn't the most palatable thing to a talented player like Wiffen...
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that depends on how committed he is to getting a "free" education.
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

turk181 said:
The whole Wiffen thing has me asking, the kid graduated HS 3 years ago?..... committed 9/21/14 & this comes out days before the season starts?
Click to expand...

That is a legitimate question. Why did it take so long? The NCAA seldom moves quickly. This may have been a months-long ordeal that just had to play out.
I don't believe the NCAA moved with great dispatch on the Servinis and Oates cases either.

This may be a case of RPI taking a chance, like with Oates and Servinis, and hoping things work out. It is too bad that he won't play this year, but if he plays 3 or 4 years here and graduates, it a'int so bad.
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

Oates and Servinis arrived with the knowledge they would miss portions of the schedule, due to their previous team arrangements. This feels like a surprise, and turk raises some great questions on timing.
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

In honor of Cam Hackett and Sara Till, today is 2 October 2015. There is 1 day until RPI's next game.


This is based upon 3 October 2015 for the start of next season.
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

sk8tronthepond said:
Ralph....you are on the right track. The other thing to consider is that what the NCAA considers a core course, might be different than what the Canadian High School considered a core course. Since there was an appeals process, it might have had to do with a particular course not being considered a core course. You would then appeal and provide the NCAA with a sylabus of that particular course, and then the NCAA determining if it fits their requirements. Just speculation as to another possibility, but as Wicked stated, somebody definitely dropped the ball. I'm more shocked that a partial qualifier made it through RPI admissions!
Click to expand...

Based upon lugnut's post earlier, he had to have all the core courses, or else he would be a non-qualifier. If they appealed to bring it from non-qualifier to partial qualifier, you may have a point. Also, with a technical school, it's entirely possible that certain courses were excelled and others weren't, yet he'd still get in. Wiffen shows in the directory as BMGT so the case may not necessarily apply, but I'll still leave the hypothesis there.
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

ServinisScores said:
Oates and Servinis arrived with the knowledge they would miss portions of the schedule, due to their previous team arrangements. This feels like a surprise, and turk raises some great questions on timing.
Click to expand...

He committed last September, so likely applied for admission soon after. That means it was likely November before the school could start the process with the NCAA. It often takes months before they render a decision, then more time for the appeal.
Again, just speculation of course, but this may be a case of the program and the school willing to take a chance on a kid they think can make it at RPI. His penalty is a full year, as opposed to the few games imposed on Oates and Servinis. RPI probably knew that the odds were against them, but decided it was worth it. As I said, if they get 3 seasons from him and he gets a degree, it is a win-win. Maybe they hoped he would be able to play this year, but everyone was willing to roll the dice. let's hope it likes it here, does well in school and is ready to go next fall. he appears to have few other options, unless he goes to Europe.
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

sk8tronthepond said:
Ralph....you are on the right track. The other thing to consider is that what the NCAA considers a core course, might be different than what the Canadian High School considered a core course. Since there was an appeals process, it might have had to do with a particular course not being considered a core course. You would then appeal and provide the NCAA with a sylabus of that particular course, and then the NCAA determining if it fits their requirements. Just speculation as to another possibility, but as Wicked stated, somebody definitely dropped the ball. I'm more shocked that a partial qualifier made it through RPI admissions!
Click to expand...

I know from my experience working in a high school that exactly what sk8tronthepond described here can happen. Our school offers a course titled Sports & Entertainment Marketing and it's NCAA eligibility was questioned with respect to one of our students applying to play D-1 in college. If I remember correctly, it was turned down the first time and accepted after the instructor submitted a more detailed and beefed-up syllabus, so it's clear that the process can be lengthy.

If something like this is the story, though, and Brady is going to lose a year of eligibility, I'm surprised that the possibility of taking a class in time for second semester eligibility wasn't investigated.

On a related topic, hockey tomorrow!! :) (Been asleep all summer, figured it's time to wake up.)
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

cmmarkham said:
If something like this is the story, though, and Brady is going to lose a year of eligibility, I'm surprised that the possibility of taking a class in time for second semester eligibility wasn't investigated.
Click to expand...

An excellent question Charlene. Had he not attended a class, this would have been a viable option!
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

sk8tronthepond said:
An excellent question Charlene. Had he not attended a class, this would have been a viable option!
Click to expand...

If he didn't attend a class, though, wouldn't he be a non-qualifier? The requirements clearly state for a partial qualifier that the thirteen core courses are satisfied, and that the only thing in question is either a lower "GPA" from the core courses, or a lower SAT/ACT score.
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

cmmarkham said:
I know from my experience working in a high school that exactly what sk8tronthepond described here can happen. Our school offers a course titled Sports & Entertainment Marketing and it's NCAA eligibility was questioned with respect to one of our students applying to play D-1 in college. If I remember correctly, it was turned down the first time and accepted after the instructor submitted a more detailed and beefed-up syllabus, so it's clear that the process can be lengthy.

If something like this is the story, though, and Brady is going to lose a year of eligibility, I'm surprised that the possibility of taking a class in time for second semester eligibility wasn't investigated.

On a related topic, hockey tomorrow!! :) (Been asleep all summer, figured it's time to wake up.)
Click to expand...

I think that good academic performance will wipe out the partial qualifier. However, he still can't play for a full year.
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

Housekeeping question:

since tomorrow's game is an exhibition, is it still "pre-season" until October 9?
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

Okay, after going back and reading the NCAA bylaw that lugnut posted (should have done that first!), I can see that Brady Wiffen has to miss a whole year if he doesn't qualify at the start of the year. That doesn't negate my earlier suggestion though. It may well be that Brady and RPI were hoping that some course he took and got a good grade in could count as one of his NCAA core courses, thereby getting his GPA above the cutoff limit, and that the NCAA didn't agree.

It seems like if his SAT scores were the problem, you'd just get him some SAT-prep tutoring and have him keep retaking them until the deadline came instead of going through an appeals process. Or maybe do both, but did he really take the SATs multiple times and still not get an adequate score, yet meet RPI's academic criteria? I know for a fact that RPI's academic standards, for the hockey players at least, are not as stringent as some of you like to think, but still...

I wonder, too, where the waiver part of the "waiver process and subsequent appeal process" that Dr. McElroy mentioned comes in. What were they asking the NCAA to waive?
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

I'm back!! Hockey tomorrow!!

Did I miss anything useful in the forums while I was gone? ;)
 
Re: RPI 2015-16 Preseason Thread: To Dream the Impossible Dream

Sigh. Ralph, you're a math guy - why didn't you call on me this by now? I showed the pertinent NCAA by-law to Nick (my son, and another math guy) and he patiently (well, sort of patiently) pointed out to me that the range of acceptable core GPAs for partial qualifiers starts where the range for qualifiers leaves off, meaning Brady's core GPA is definitely high enough for him to be a qualifier. The problem has to be with his SAT or ACT scores and the score he apparently hasn't reached is very specifically 820.

There may still be things we don't understand - I still don't get where the waiver and appeals process fits in - but it seems there's no way the problem is with his core GPA. I stand corrected. (I knew I should have just kept my mouth shut, or sat on my hands, or whatever!) Aside: I hate Nick sometimes.
 
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