POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

And they accuse us of living "in the bubble".

One of the hallmarks of the reactionary cult is projection. They accuse liberals of intolerance and having designs to create an authoritarian state precisely because that's what lives in their hearts.

 

[Rover]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

I work with dozens of people every day who are completely convinced that the Mueller report fully exonerated Dump.

Hey Kep, instead of arguing out there then could you perhaps put some of that effort into changing your co-workers minds? I'm assuming they're all educated people given your own background....

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

Before each of the three heists, economists and other experts predicted everything that would happen: massive deficits, no reinvestment, no material improvement for the middle class or poor, lethal spurts of wealth inequality. Each time all that happened. With the latter cases, economists could point to the prior heists as empirical proof.

Yet it never matters: people keep falling for it. It's an amazing example of mass ideological myopia. And it's not abstract; it has actually ruined the lives of the people who have voted R far more than those who have voted D. We have the education and skills to survive. They don't, so they perish. And yet they keep on pulling the lever on the slot machine, hoping this time will be the one. And when it doesn't they blame liberals, blacks, women, and immigrants.

Remarkable.

Not remarkable. Just America.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

Hey Kep, instead of arguing out there then could you perhaps put some of that effort into changing your co-workers minds? I'm assuming they're all educated people given your own background....

Maybe he could pull it off but I have tried. Those people compartmentalize their stupidity. They can show and teach you things about their field of expertise that will shock and amaze you while at the same time be completely ****ing stupid about public policy and politics.

 

[Rover]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

Maybe he could pull it off but I have tried. Those people compartmentalize their stupidity. They can show and teach you things about their field of expertise that will shock and amaze you while at the same time be completely ****ing stupid about public policy and politics.

Pick 'em off one at a time Scooby. In my experience its easier to reach the educated ones than the non educated ones.

 

[jerphisch]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

And therein lies the problem. This whole "fark you coasties for being more successful and having more opportunities than us" part of Bernie and Trump culture. Is it really any wonder Sanders did better in the Upper Midwest than anywhere else?

The problem is trying to imply that those people are true Bernie supporters. While one may exist somewhere, no one (almost) with a functioning brain actively supported Bernie based on his policy positions and then when Hillary won the nomination decided that Trump was the next best thing to achieve their policy goals. The people who went from Bernie to Trump were either the "burn it all down" types that decided Bernie was the best option (even though he isn't really a "burn it all down" guy), a pure Hillary hater, or an R that voted in the D primary. Maybe toss in a few extra super butt hurt conspiracy theorists convinced that the D machine absolutely screwed Bernie out of the nom and they'd do anything to get revenge, but again that isn't someone who actually supported Bernie and then Trump based on rational thinking. Basically anyone who flipped is a loon, so predisposed to be an R anyway

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

Pick 'em off one at a time Scooby. In my experience its easier to reach the educated ones than the non educated ones.

I think you missed the point of my post. Their politics are like their religion. They take everything on faith. Facts are irrelevant to them on those topics.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

I talk one on one with my coworkers and have tried many different approaches. I've made some progress with some and little with most. Typically it goes like this:

"Republican policies are bad for the country and bad for you."

"No, they're not."

"Here's proof."

"You can say anything with statistics."

"Here is the methodology and the controls."

"Well you may be right but I'm still voting R on abortion (or guns)."

Interestingly, when I reach people on economics I tend to reach them all the way to significant solutions rather than incrementalism. The populist strain is latent in the conservative soul: they have no love for the Plutes and no patience for Third Way myths. Once I demonstrate to my coworkers the basic mathematical reality of liberal vs conservative economic policy I'm on the way to making a new Socialist.

The deal breaker is then religion. I do my best to demonstrate that liberal social policies result in far fewer abortions because of sex ed and the development of an attitude towards women as equals instead of conquests. That's a much more difficult road to go down because it activates all the defense mechanisms and cultural identifications that were pounded into them by their parents and preachers. Programming is difficult to break -- programming that was accompanied by intensive and highly emotional brain washing in childhood is nearly impossible.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

The people who went from Bernie to Trump were either the "burn it all down" types that decided Bernie was the best option (even though he isn't really a "burn it all down" guy), a pure Hillary hater, or an R that voted in the D primary. Maybe toss in a few extra super butt hurt conspiracy theorists convinced that the D machine absolutely screwed Bernie out of the nom and they'd do anything to get revenge, but again that isn't someone who actually supported Bernie and then Trump based on rational thinking. Basically anyone who flipped is a loon, so predisposed to be an R anyway

Exactly. Bernie is right but because he is radical he also attracts people who just want to burn the system to the ground. They didn't choose Bernie because of a sophisticated understanding of the contradictions of Late Stage Capitalism; they chose him because he wants to make a big change and so do they. Dump said he wanted to make a big change too, so when Bernie was denied a chance they naturally jumped to Dump.

One of the embarrassments of radicalism is we attract a few arsonists. They are attracted to the form of our protest, not its content. They are a tiny sliver of the movement but because they are dramatic and self-promoting, and because they are useful to somebody trying to de-legitimize us, they get coverage that exaggerates their frequency and influence.

 

[Rover]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

The problem is trying to imply that those people are true Bernie supporters. While one may exist somewhere, no one (almost) with a functioning brain actively supported Bernie based on his policy positions and then when Hillary won the nomination decided that Trump was the next best thing to achieve their policy goals. The people who went from Bernie to Trump were either the "burn it all down" types that decided Bernie was the best option (even though he isn't really a "burn it all down" guy), a pure Hillary hater, or an R that voted in the D primary. Maybe toss in a few extra super butt hurt conspiracy theorists convinced that the D machine absolutely screwed Bernie out of the nom and they'd do anything to get revenge, but again that isn't someone who actually supported Bernie and then Trump based on rational thinking. Basically anyone who flipped is a loon, so predisposed to be an R anyway

I agree with a lot of this. All I would add is that there's more people than one would think that fall into the "everybody to the right of Bernie is almost as bad" camp. I think the difference next year vs last time is that they won't go out and vote FOR Trump this time. They'll just stay home or go 3rd party. I'm also curious for core Sanders supporters if they'll enthusiastically accept an alternative to him (Say Elizabeth Warren) or if its Bernie and Bernie alone that they're excited about.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

I work with dozens of people every day who are completely convinced that the Mueller report fully exonerated Dump.

S**t there's plenty out there that not only believe it exonerated him, but that Mueller and his team doctored much of it in an attempt to cover for the Democrats and smear Trump.

 

[Rogie21]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Quite the headline: Study Finds Trump Tax Cuts Failed to Do Anything But Give Rich People Money<a href="https://t.co/8pSJMeYNZA">https://t.co/8pSJMeYNZA</a></p>— Amy Klobuchar (@amyklobuchar) <a href="https://twitter.com/amyklobuchar/status/1135643650770255872?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">June 3, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> Will this Congressional Research Service report be labelled "fake news" or "deep state bias"? Can't wait to hear what Paul Ryan says when questioned about it.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">This is an abuse of power. <a href="https://t.co/6kzsMkwtDP">https://t.co/6kzsMkwtDP</a></p>— David Corn (@DavidCornDC) <a href="https://twitter.com/DavidCornDC/status/1135529907767971841?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">June 3, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I'm still partially in disbelief that we are seeing today that our beloved two party system has completely collapsed because one of those two parties forgot that they were supposed to care.

 

[rufus]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">This is an abuse of power. <a href="https://t.co/6kzsMkwtDP">https://t.co/6kzsMkwtDP</a></p>— David Corn (@DavidCornDC) <a href="https://twitter.com/DavidCornDC/status/1135529907767971841?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">June 3, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I'm still partially in disbelief that we are seeing today that our beloved two party system has completely collapsed because one of those two parties forgot that they were supposed to care.

Forgot, or don't care that they're supposed to care?

But they do care. They care about getting billionaires whatever they want.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

Forgot, or don't care that they're supposed to care?

But they do care. They care about getting billionaires whatever they want.

It is interesting how they only care about three things.

1. Fetuses.
2. Billionaire's and Millionaire's.
3. Guns.

Anything else? Those are the three I come up with.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

It is interesting how they only care about three things.

1. Fetuses.
2. Billionaire's and Millionaire's.
3. Guns.

Anything else? Those are the three I come up with.

They don't give a crap about fetuses -- they bankrupt women's medical care. They care about the Invisible Man.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

They don't give a crap about fetuses -- they bankrupt women's medical care. They care about The Invisible Man.

LOL

Good point. However, if they did care about God they might spend more time actually reading the Gospel instead of just skipping it and going directly to Paul.

 

[trixR4kids]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

I'm still partially in disbelief that we are seeing today that our beloved two party system has completely collapsed because one of those two parties forgot that they were supposed to care.

Well hopefully the other party spends a little bit less time focusing on Ilhan and actually moves toward impeachment because there's no shortage of impeachable offenses.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

LOL

Good point. However, if they did care about God they might spend more time actually reading the Gospel instead of just skipping it and going directly to Paul.

Their God isn't in the Bible. It's in their f-cked up heads, right next to the incest and violence fantasies.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:53: I Didn't Appoint That Judge So It Doesn't Matter.

Their God isn't in the Bible. It's in their f-cked up heads, right next to the incest and violence fantasies.

Another point taken.