POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

And where did anyone here say that?

That is the logical conclusion to draw from what Hovey is saying and how America voted. I am not saying he BELIEVES that...but that is how America acted.

Women protect rapists because "he didnt rape me so I am lucky just shut up and deal" all the time. People have tunnel vision and that is what Scooby is saying.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

Yeah, but no one blames him losing the race on that one comment.

That's true. I think most people look at it like just another piece of evidence of a poorly run campaign. That's my take. It's also my take with respect to the deplorable comment.

 

[The Rube]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

That is the logical conclusion to draw from what Hovey is saying and how America voted. I am not saying he BELIEVES that...but that is how America acted.

Women protect rapists because "he didnt rape me so I am lucky just shut up and deal" all the time. People have tunnel vision and that is what Scooby is saying.

That's why I specified "here." I think all of us around here are a bit smarter than the average voter. None of us are saying "bullying is ok as long as it's not against me"/etc.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

And now look back at Fade's comments on automation.

I saw it...my point still stands. Automation was coming anyways that is the ultimate red herring.

Question: Lets say automation came before the rate increase. Do you think companies would just stop paying people the lowest wage possible since the lowest job possible is gone? Of course not they would just find the new lowest job available and start hiring new people at that wage and firing people at the higher wage. Business 101.

There is always going to be low end jobs and there will always be people desperate enough to take them. Pay them a livable wage. If you cant do that go F yourself and leave.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

That is the logical conclusion to draw from what Hovey is saying and how America voted. I am not saying he BELIEVES that...but that is how America acted.

Women protect rapists because "he didnt rape me so I am lucky just shut up and deal" all the time. People have tunnel vision and that is what Scooby is saying.

How in the world is "bullying is ok so long as you're bullying someone else" the logical conclusion of my posts???

I just posted that if you're a candidate who's success depends upon people checking a box next to your name in support, it's not a great strategy to go out and insult 46%, 26%, 13% or any of them. End of point.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

That's true. I think most people look at it like just another piece of evidence of a poorly run campaign. That's my take. It's also my take with respect to the deplorable comment.

Agreed the difference being Romney still maxed out his votes while Hillary did not. That goes back to the "Magic R" debate though.

 

[The Rube]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

I saw it...my point still stands. Automation was coming anyways that is the ultimate red herring.

Question: Lets say automation came before the rate increase. Do you think companies would just stop paying people the lowest wage possible since the lowest job possible is gone? Of course not they would just find the new lowest job available and start hiring new people at that wage and firing people at the higher wage. Business 101.

There is always going to be low end jobs and there will always be people desperate enough to take them. Pay them a livable wage. If you cant do that go F yourself and leave.

And there is where the getting rid of cheap labor comes in/illegals. If one eliminates a chunk of the work force, then supply (workers willing to work for cheap) is less than demand (jobs). You are correct that companies will try to get by on the cheap, and there will always be a certain percentage that will work for that wage. We both are trying to change the game a little, just in different ways.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

How in the world is "bullying is ok so long as you're bullying someone else" the logical conclusion of my posts???

I just posted that if you're a candidate who's success depends upon people checking a box next to your name in support, it's not a great strategy to go out and insult 46%, 26%, 13% or any of them. End of point.

I think you misunderstand me. (that is why I said that isnt what you believe) I read your posts like Scooby did that since Trump was insulting specific groups as opposed to an entire voting block his voters ignored it. (i.e. I am not a woman, why would I care he treats them like dirt) If you bully him you arent bullying me seems to be parallel to your point and certainly how they voted.

I apologize if it sounded like I was attacking you or insulting you I most certainly was not.

 

[St. Clown]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

I saw it...my point still stands. Automation was coming anyways that is the ultimate red herring.

Question: Lets say automation came before the rate increase. Do you think companies would just stop paying people the lowest wage possible since the lowest job possible is gone? Of course not they would just find the new lowest job available and start hiring new people at that wage and firing people at the higher wage. Business 101.

There is always going to be low end jobs and there will always be people desperate enough to take them. Pay them a livable wage. If you cant do that go F yourself and leave.

Actually, businesses tend to layoff on a LIFO basis these days. When the FIFO process was in place, with the assumption of the largest paychecks being with the most senior staff, companies began to realize that their workforce had become demoralized and less productive. So they keep their most senior staff. Short of it is this: It's better to have more skill than less, and skill often comes with time.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

I think you misunderstand me. (that is why I said that isnt what you believe) I read your posts like Scooby did that since Trump was insulting specific groups as opposed to an entire voting block his voters ignored it. (i.e. I am not a woman, why would I care he treats them like dirt) If you bully him you arent bullying me seems to be parallel to your point and certainly how they voted.

I apologize if it sounded like I was attacking you or insulting you I most certainly was not.

Ok, I didn't understand what you were saying.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

So you want to punish people for their beliefs. How very Trumpian of you...

You dont have to accept their vile hate, but you have to accept that they are allowed to hate. The Dems just need to walk away from them.

You don't have to punish them. But you also don't have to go out of your way to acknowledge those beliefs and feelings, to relate to those people as if those feelings are perfectly acceptable and a valid viewpoint. To tolerate those feelings. They need to be shunned, not mainstreamed.

Brent and Slappy just think we need to speak to them as equals, and all their hatred and bigotry will just go away.

 

[The Rube]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

You don't have to punish them. But you also don't have to go out of your way to acknowledge those beliefs and feelings, to relate to those people as if those feelings are perfectly acceptable and a valid viewpoint. To tolerate those feelings. They need to be shunned, not mainstreamed.

Brent and Slappy just think we need to speak to them as equals, and all their hatred and bigotry will just go away.

Whoa whoa whoa. I just said listen to them, and figure out why they think that way, and try to slowly change their viewpoint. Pretty sure that back before the whole civil rights movement, more people than not were all for segregation/etc. That slowly changed to where we are now. Unfortunately, there are some who are still of that mindset. We need to keep chipping away to change that mindset.

I will concede that some will never change. I hope, and believe, that there are some that can be changed, though, and the answer isn't condemning them. It's listening and conversing and providing opposing viewpoints in a civil manner.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

Even if it was 13%, and even if it were true (I would say it is), it was incredibly stupid to say it.

But it's perfectly fine to attack the "out of touch eliteists" and the "God-hating liberals", right?

 

[The Rube]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

But it's perfectly fine to attack the "out of touch eliteists" and the "God-hating liberals", right?

Never said that.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

Whoa whoa whoa. I just said listen to them, and figure out why they think that way, and try to slowly change their viewpoint. Pretty sure that back before the whole civil rights movement, more people than not were all for segregation/etc. That slowly changed to where we are now. Unfortunately, there are some who are still of that mindset. We need to keep chipping away to change that mindset.

I will concede that some will never change. I hope, and believe, that there are some that can be changed, though, and the answer isn't condemning them. It's listening and conversing and providing opposing viewpoints in a civil manner.

Complete waste of time. Democrats do that they will continue to lose in epic fashion.

 

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

The TSA thing was a race/racism tangent on my part, which is related to the immigration point. I should have clarified that better.

As for "going out in a field and working," go back to the min wage debate going on. Many say that only illegals will work for that low pay. Well, if we get rid of cheap labor, companies will basically be forced to raise wages (and not this mandatory $15/hr bs we have going on) and then yes, folks will take those jobs. By the way, I work blue collar. Not a glamorous job, not a high-paying job (I make enough to live off of), it's physically demanding, and I like the work.

Finally, I agree with Handy. You can THINK and SPEAK whatever you want, you have that right. Once one starts ACTING on that hatred...yeah, we have a problem.

Except that you posted that the Israeli version of TSA would prevent some illegal immigration. I can quote it again.

And my point is that the TSA screening has zero impact on immigration- legal or otherwise.

Where the TSA works, you can NOT enter the US without multiple checks of a valid visa. And none of those checks are via the TSA- so even if someone had an invalid visa (of any kind) the TSA is not where it would be found.

We can have a full discussion of wages and work- but listening to what some farmers say, I don't agree that farm work is as simple as raising wages. I fully know you are a blue collar worker, and my point is- would you go out into a field at your wage right now? What wage would it take for you to pick strawberries for 8 hours a day? Or cabbage? But that's a complete different thread. (and we won't even bring up the accessibility of those jobs- most of the people without jobs are no where near where the jobs are, and likely don't want to live there, either)

 

[The Rube]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

Except that you posted that the Israeli version of TSA would prevent some illegal immigration. I can quote it again.

And my point is that the TSA screening has zero impact on immigration- legal or otherwise.

Where the TSA works, you can NOT enter the US without multiple checks of a valid visa. And none of those checks are via the TSA- so even if someone had an invalid visa (of any kind) the TSA is not where it would be found.

We can have a full discussion of wages and work- but listening to what some farmers say, I don't agree that farm work is as simple as raising wages. I fully know you are a blue collar worker, and my point is- would you go out into a field at your wage right now? What wage would it take for you to pick strawberries for 8 hours a day? Or cabbage? But that's a complete different thread. (and we won't even bring up the accessibility of those jobs- most of the people without jobs are no where near where the jobs are, and likely don't want to live there, either)

And that's why I clarified what I was saying. The US isn't adopting Israeli tactics because that is "racial profiling" in our culture. It only relates to the immigration thing, because when we start talking illegal/legal immigrants, racism is immediately brought to the forefront to defend illegal immigrants; do you know what I mean? (honestly, not intending this to sound like I'm talking down to you).

 

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

Guardian reporting that Nigel Farer, brexit architect, is now a person of interest in the Trump campaign- Russia probe

http://thehill.com/policy/national-...farage-person-of-interest-in-fbi-probe-report

 

[MaizeRage]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

How in the world is "bullying is ok so long as you're bullying someone else" the logical conclusion of my posts???

I have no idea how anyone could think that about someone that has spent almost a year giving kneejerk defenses of Donald Trump.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

And that's why I clarified what I was saying. The US isn't adopting Israeli tactics because that is "racial profiling" in our culture. It only relates to the immigration thing, because when we start talking illegal/legal immigrants, racism is immediately brought to the forefront to defend illegal immigrants; do you know what I mean? (honestly, not intending this to sound like I'm talking down to you).

The US isn't adopting it because the Courts are stopping it. The Trump administration is all for it.