What's new
By:
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

  • Thread starter Thread starter Priceless
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

Bob Gray said:
stop helping Priceless! make him answer his own questions! :p

not a bad answer, though I'd think one could be a fiscal conservative and have your main goal being a balanced budget, rather than a smaller budget. Just wanted to call Priceless on his false precision.
Click to expand...

Cute. I call you out for being dead wrong and you try to get me on "false precision." Also known as "using words as they are meant to be used."

The idea that someone can be a liberal and still balance the budget is just so foreign to you. He had to be fiscally conservative! If he wasn't then that might ruin the whole idea that fiscal conservatives are the only people who can run the country!

He didn't slash and burn the budget, he raised taxes (Communist!) to pay for more spending (what a novel idea).

In FY93 spending was $1.4T and increased to $1.8T by FY2000. However, thanks to that killer tax increase receipts grew from $1.15T to over $2T in the same time frame. The budget was in balance! We actually had a surplus of over $230 billion. Then the dot com bubble burst, taxes were insanely cut and we invaded two countries. Spending went from that $1.8T to $3T in FY09 while government receipts dipped, climbed sharply and are now a whole $100 billion higher at $2.1T. That isn't fiscal conservatism or fiscally responsible. That's just reckless.

Bill Clinton was many things. A fiscal conservative is not one of them. He balanced the budget by raising revenues (evil taxes) rather than by shrinking the budget.
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

Priceless said:
Fiscally responsible, sure. Fiscally conservative, no.

That implies liberals can't be responsible. Heaven forbid we describe someone who presided over a balanced budget as a liberal. It's as unimaginable as overthrowing a Middle East dictator through peaceful protest. That runs counter to the notion that everyone in the ME is a Muslim raghead who wants to kill us righteous 'Merikans.
Click to expand...

I don't see how it implies that.

A little defensive today?:)
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

Potato, Po-tah-to. Any balanced budget is a good budget, so far as I'm concerned. After that, the budget's percentage of GDP is simply a matter of taste.
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

Priceless said:
Cute. I call you out for being dead wrong and you try to get me on "false precision." Also known as "using words as they are meant to be used."

The idea that someone can be a liberal and still balance the budget is just so foreign to you. He had to be fiscally conservative! If he wasn't then that might ruin the whole idea that fiscal conservatives are the only people who can run the country!

He didn't slash and burn the budget, he raised taxes (Communist!) to pay for more spending (what a novel idea).

In FY93 spending was $1.4T and increased to $1.8T by FY2000. However, thanks to that killer tax increase receipts grew from $1.15T to over $2T in the same time frame. The budget was in balance! We actually had a surplus of over $230 billion. Then the dot com bubble burst, taxes were insanely cut and we invaded two countries. Spending went from that $1.8T to $3T in FY09 while government receipts dipped, climbed sharply and are now a whole $100 billion higher at $2.1T. That isn't fiscal conservatism or fiscally responsible. That's just reckless.

Bill Clinton was many things. A fiscal conservative is not one of them. He balanced the budget by raising revenues (evil taxes) rather than by shrinking the budget.
Click to expand...

see, whether I try to explain my reasoning or not to you, you flamethrow me either way. why would you think I'd bother to try to have much meaningful dialogue with you?:rolleyes:
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

LynahFan said:
Potato, Po-tah-to. Any balanced budget is a good budget, so far as I'm concerned. After that, the budget's percentage of GDP is simply a matter of taste.
Click to expand...

Wait. I believe this, but you're not supposed to believe this. :) You're supposed to be all "the larger the budget's percentage of GDP the greater the inefficiency." And then a quote from Jean-Baptiste Say.

Stop being reasonable, you're freaking me out!
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

unofan said:
My guess would be that responsible means a balanced budget regardless of size, so someone who increases the budget by 30% would nevertheless be responsible if the revenue supported such expenditures.
Click to expand...
Are those numbers in real dollars or not? Increasing spending 30% over a seven year period isn't saying much if the numbers haven't been adjusted for inflation (in which case the budget might be just keeping pace with the erosion in our money's value over time).
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

Bob Gray said:
see, whether I try to explain my reasoning or not to you, you flamethrow me either way. why would you think I'd bother to try to have much meaningful dialogue with you?:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Because its just so gosh darned fun, that's why.

If it makes anyone feel better: you don't live in Wisconsin right now. Should I just move to the backwoods of Mississippi right now?
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

Well, that could be said about Wisconsin prior to the protest.
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

Priceless said:
Bill Clinton was many things. A fiscal conservative is not one of them. He balanced the budget by raising revenues (evil taxes) rather than by shrinking the budget.
Click to expand...

I see... it was taxes... not "the internet"... funny, taxes are easier to collect when money moves swiftly through a society because of operational efficiency... who knew? I mean, Obama doesn't, but I suppose he's not alone.

Is Obama still waiting for his "internet" or has he put all his bets on green eggs and ham?
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

dxmnkd316 said:
Well, that could be said about Wisconsin prior to the protest.
Click to expand...

I know that you're being cheeky about Wisconsin, but there's a rant here that deserves to be said
The protest isn't the problem. The problem is that the people here couldn't elect a moderate to save our lives.

On one hand, we have uber-insane liberals who are corrupt to the bone and behave like little children, fleeing the state when they don't get their way. One the other hand, this state's conservatives are responsible for electing a college dropout (who couldn't handle his last post as a Milwaukee County Executive) as our Governor and hold up Jim Sensenbrenner (who is also corrupt to the bone, and accepts more money from special interest groups than the vast majority of Congressmen) as their ideal.

Go to the poll booth on a Wisconsin Election day, and you pretty much have to choose between corrupt bureaucrat children that would make the Daley family blush and a Palin/Bachmann paradise of "keep the Gubmint out of my Gubmint" dumbassery. It's ****ing depressing. I love everything about living in this state (granted, my main reasons probably have more to do with the Packers, beer and family...), but politics in Wisconsin absolutely destroys my faith in humanity.
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

ExileOnDaytonStreet said:
I know that you're being cheeky about Wisconsin, but there's a rant here that deserves to be said
The protest isn't the problem. The problem is that the people here couldn't elect a moderate to save our lives.

On one hand, we have uber-insane liberals who are corrupt to the bone and behave like little children, fleeing the state when they don't get their way. One the other hand, this state's conservatives are responsible for electing a college dropout (who couldn't handle his last post as a Milwaukee County Executive) as our Governor and hold up Jim Sensenbrenner (who is also corrupt to the bone, and accepts more money from special interest groups than the vast majority of Congressmen) as their ideal.

Go to the poll booth on a Wisconsin Election day, and you pretty much have to choose between corrupt bureaucrat children that would make the Daley family blush and a Palin/Bachmann paradise of "keep the Gubmint out of my Gubmint" dumbassery. It's ****ing depressing. I love everything about living in this state (granted, my main reasons probably have more to do with the Packers, beer and family...), but politics in Wisconsin absolutely destroys my faith in humanity.
Click to expand...

Move west. Most people cheer for the packers, we have all the beer you want (except on sundays), and we are all one big happy family. Taxes are higher but whatever, probably will be comparable when it's all said and done.
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

I tweeted earlier that I would offer Sensenbrenner to Illinois if they would send us a Senator or two back. No dice though.

I get that we disagree on this, fine. But really, the college dropout line? Jim Doyle had a JD from Harvard Law and he was a disaster. George Bush went to Yale and Harvard, and was similarly disastrous. Can we stop pretending that education has an impact on effective governance?

*Insert jibe about Harvard/Yale education from resident Cornell alums.
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

dxmnkd316 said:
Move west. Most people cheer for the packers, we have all the beer you want (except on sundays), and we are all one big happy family. Taxes are higher but whatever, probably will be comparable when it's all said and done.
Click to expand...

I don't think my birthplace can really stand on the soapbox when it comes to the whole "electing morons" thing... then again, what place can?
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

ExileOnDaytonStreet said:
I know that you're being cheeky about Wisconsin, but there's a rant here that deserves to be said
The protest isn't the problem. The problem is that the people here couldn't elect a moderate to save our lives.

On one hand, we have uber-insane liberals who are corrupt to the bone and behave like little children, fleeing the state when they don't get their way. One the other hand, this state's conservatives are responsible for electing a college dropout (who couldn't handle his last post as a Milwaukee County Executive) as our Governor and hold up Jim Sensenbrenner (who is also corrupt to the bone, and accepts more money from special interest groups than the vast majority of Congressmen) as their ideal.

Go to the poll booth on a Wisconsin Election day, and you pretty much have to choose between corrupt bureaucrat children that would make the Daley family blush and a Palin/Bachmann paradise of "keep the Gubmint out of my Gubmint" dumbassery. It's ****ing depressing. I love everything about living in this state (granted, my main reasons probably have more to do with the Packers, beer and family...), but politics in Wisconsin absolutely destroys my faith in humanity.
Click to expand...

As someone whose family has lived here for over 150 years, I couldn't agree with you more. It's god****ed depressing.
 
Re: Obama Presidential Thread XIX: Starting a new chapter

Kepler said:
Wait. I believe this, but you're not supposed to believe this. :) You're supposed to be all "the larger the budget's percentage of GDP the greater the inefficiency." And then a quote from Jean-Baptiste Say.

Stop being reasonable, you're freaking me out!
Click to expand...
I sincerely hope that nobody would ever be able to convict me of being an ideologue!

The unsustainability of our budget situations (at the federal, state and local levels) is a question of economics, not politics. Economics is dangerously close to being a real science (:P), so our budget problems are stubborn, inconvenient facts - and facts do not depend on your point of view. Neither side does the country any favors by trying to paper over the problems to win elections, but everybody does it - it's downright criminal.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top