NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

[Jimjamesak]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

If I were starting a new professional sports brand, I know that re-using a minor league franchise name would be high up on my list of priorities.

Yeah don't wanna anger those thousands fans that were wearing Moose jerseys today in Winnipeg...

 

[joecct]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

The NHL is a Non-profit? Does that mean it's just a container and the franchises are the corporations?

Just go to Guidestar, join (free), and look at any not for profit return you want to. The NHL is real interesting. USA Hockey moreso.

 

[moose97]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

And didn't I hear a report today saying that the NHL was prepared to "give" the name back to Winnipeg if they wanted it? If nothing else, I would imagine TNSE would want the right to sell Jets stuff in the team store and reserve the right to use the logo for 3rd jersey/throwback games.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2011/05/31/winnipeg_name/

The league owns the rights to the Jets name and Winnipeg can have it if they want it, said commissioner Gary Bettman.

 

[Patman]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2011/05/31/winnipeg_name/

wanna bet there's a price and the price is "subsidize the next season of Coyotes hockey"? Frankly, Thomson would be an idiot for not taking the Jets name and images gratis.

 

[Handyman]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

I lived in the Cities post-Stars, pre-Wild and the Moose were...okay. You are the first person I can think of who is nostalgic/lamenting losing that team.

I wasnt lamenting losing them, just remembered going. That was my first exposure to hockey really. (went to 1 North Star Game and zero Gopher games before going to the U)

 

[The Rube]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

I wasnt lamenting losing them, just remembered going. That was my first exposure to hockey really. (went to 1 North Star Game and zero Gopher games before going to the U)

Wow, even I went to many more North Star games (also my first exposure to hockey; won tickets through our church festival). First game I went to, Dino leveled a guy near the crease. Nobody "saw anything," including the refs. Probably went to a couple dozen (always saved my allowance for the good seats, until high school, then it was whenever someone wanted to go/seats didn't really matter too much). Of course, back then the best seats were about $30-$40, IIRC.

I'm not against the Moose; it's more that I'm for the Jets.

 

[aparch]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

Looks like AHL hockey is returning to St. Johns, as it was just (unofficially) announced today that they'll be moving the team to St. Johns Newfoundland.

I'm hoping for the NHL Manitoba Moose and the AHL St. Johns Jets!

 

[Kepler]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

Looks like AHL hockey is returning to St. Johns, as it was just (unofficially) announced today that they'll be moving the team to St. Johns Newfoundland.

There is no St. Johns.
Saint John is in New Brunswick.
St. John's is in Newfoundland.
This is all anyone has ever discovered about the Maritimes except Anne of Green Gables was PEI.

 

[JF_Gophers]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

This will last 15 years tops before the team folds or moves again.

 

[Kepler]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

This will last 15 years tops before the team folds or moves again.

Hopefully by then the NHL will have contracted back to 21.

 

[aparch]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

There is no St. Johns.
Saint John is in New Brunswick.
St. John's is in Newfoundland.
This is all anyone has ever discovered about the Maritimes except Anne of Green Gables was PEI.

I missed the apostrophe.


Not sure how they'll fit into the North Division of the AHL (rumored to just take the Moose's spot in the North). The flights between them and Abbotsford, BC are going to be killer. It's almost looking like the start of the IHL demise (the IHL California expansion).

 

[moose97]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

This will last 15 years tops before the team folds or moves again.

Hopefully by then the NHL will have contracted back to 21.

And Winnipeg will be one of the 21 remaining teams.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2008/31/nhl08_NHL-Team-Valuations_Income.html

Yes, that data is a couple years old, but if Calgary and Edmonton are amongst the top-10 in profit (hey, look at that - all the Canadian teams are top-10!), there is no reason to think that Winnipeg won't be that successful as well. And if you think that they lost the Jets because of lack of fan support, you are dead wrong:

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/tAJmArEsY9Q" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

(note that they eventually raised $13 million from donations)

Also note these articles on the support currently:

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/06/02/nhl-in-peg-jacket-tie-affair

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/lo...calls-emails-from-anxious-fans-123086843.html

 

[bronconick]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

Here's the more recent one.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/31/hockey-valuations-10_rank.html

The tricky thing for Winnipeg is the size of the market. Calgary, Ottawa and Edmonton are viable because they bring home an average of $91, $85 and $84 from each person in their metro area. The other Canadian teams are in the upper 30's to mid 50's per person, while larger American cities (Detroit, New York, Minnesota, San Jose, Philadelphia, etc.) for the most part are in the 20's. Pittsburgh is $39, Columbus $42, Nashville $47 and Buffalo is an impressive $72. Probably helps that those cities don't have a NBA team. The question for Winnipeg is if ~$90 is the Canadian max or if they can manage to go higher. If $91 is it, Winnipeg's revenue is about $63 million.

That's tied for last with the New York Islanders. If they can get $110ish, it's around $77 million, which is 22nd, and they aren't solely dependent on a $22 billion owner eating the losses.

 

[jmh]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

And Winnipeg will be one of the 21 remaining teams.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2008/31/nhl08_NHL-Team-Valuations_Income.html

Yes, that data is a couple years old, but if Calgary and Edmonton are amongst the top-10 in profit (hey, look at that - all the Canadian teams are top-10!), there is no reason to think that Winnipeg won't be that successful as well.

Well sure there is. The Calgary and Edmonton metropolitan areas are both over a million people, the Winnipeg metro area is under 700k. 30% less is a pretty big difference, and as far as absolute numbers it's marginally smaller than Quebec City and significantly smaller than Hartford, and significantly smaller than Buffalo which has had problems of its own. It will be the smallest market in the NHL (Edmonton is currently the smallest) and the second smallest in the big four sports leagues after Green Bay (but without revenue sharing and the huge NFL TV contracts). I hope it's successful because I think there should be more NHL teams in Canada but you can't just pretend all cities in Western Canada are the same.

 

[Kepler]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

To support more Canadian teams the NHL would need to either move completely to the NFL model (real competitive balance, massive revenue sharing) or give up and go to the MLB model (a few essentially rigged Globetrotters who drive all the revenue and media attention and trickle it down to a field of Washington Generals paid to show up and lose).

The former aint happening: a Wellington Mara comes along once every hundred years. The latter is what ESPN and, on odd numbered days, the league office tries to force, but so far the overall pie hasn't been big enough for the yokel owners to roll over.

 

[Patman]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

The rest of the season tickets sold out in 17 minutes... 5,000 tickets liquidated in a flash. So much for Bettman's threat.

 

[Almington]

The rest of the season tickets sold out in 17 minutes... 5,000 tickets liquidated in a flash. So much for Bettman's threat.

I don't think that anyone really doubted that they would sell out the tickets, the question is what will happen in 5 to 10 years when the team isn't winning. Fans will only support a inept franchise for so long.

 

[aparch]

I don't think that anyone really doubted that they would sell out the tickets, the question is what will happen in 5 to 10 years when the team isn't winning. Fans will only support a inept franchise for so long.

Maple Leafs what?

 

[amherstblackbear]

Re: NHL hockey returns to the 'Peg! Maybe?

I don't think that anyone really doubted that they would sell out the tickets, the question is what will happen in 5 to 10 years when the team isn't winning. Fans will only support a inept franchise for so long.

Exactly.

The thing about the Maple Leafs and Knicks is that they're in Toronto and New York. Does anyone really think that a moribund franchise would have as much staying power in Winnipeg or Memphis?

Winnipeg is off to a good start, I'll give 'em that. Hopefully the franchise end up being well-run and all this talk is hypothetical.

 

[aparch]

Exactly.

The thing about the Maple Leafs and Knicks is that they're in Toronto and New York. Does anyone really think that a moribund franchise would have as much staying power in Winnipeg or Memphis?

Winnipeg is off to a good start, I'll give 'em that. Hopefully the franchise end up being well-run and all this talk is hypothetical.

From everything I was told and heard, the AHL Moose owners ran them as if it was an NHL team already. As long as they continue to run the Moose like they have, it will definielty do well.

Especially if Cheveldayoff becomes the GM. He's won at every level and he was why the Chicago Wolves have done so well in the past.