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Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

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Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

dxmnkd316 said:
I read a few RT-ized review summaries and it’s hard to make out what to think. I trust your reviews pretty much unequivocally. So I’m going to see this (and I appreciate your warnings).

But the RT summaries have all the “smart” critics (Slate, Atlantic, NYT, NPR, WaPo, New Yorker, AP, etc.) all saying the same thing: this movie is nothing; it’s garbage; it’s “faux social commentary”. Which both makes me wonder whether so many top reviewers could be wrong or if they just somehow don’t get it. Usually they don’t all struggle to not get it, not all of them at once.

Again, I actually believe comic book character movies are allowed to make social commentary, so that probably takes out at least Slate and the New Yorker. The NYT can’t get anything right these days, so nix them. AP probably has an issue with violence in general, and it’s essentially mcmedia for the masses, so they get a pass. That leaves WaPo, NPR, and the Atlantic. Why would all of them hate the movie so much? Atlantic and NPR at least think about the stores they publish and don’t really have oxen to gore.

How on earth could all the smarties hate this movie so much?
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I could give you reasons but it really isnt worth it. Truth be told this is not the type of film that American audiences are gonna fall all over themselves to praise. There is a reason the Toronto Film Festival was divided about it but Venice gave it The Golden Lion and 10 minute standing ovations.

Now you could make the argument it is timing, or that it is because the film is about a comic book character so they expect something different, but only they know. I have my theories but they are just speculation. I kind of knew after the Venice Film Festival that things were going to go negative in the US though I didnt think it would be to this degree.

In the end, as always, I will judge it based on my own set of standards, though I kind of feel that the way tica described it is how I feel about it. I have followed the movie since it was announced so I have a pretty good idea what I am in for. I also know how sadistic and evil the Joker can actually be in the comics so there is also that.
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

I'm curious to see how the masses react to this movie.

Unfortunately I do think there are going to be a bunch of people that think this will be a "comic book movie" which it clearly is not. Its arthouse style of commentary has me hesitant to see it, but at the same time, I feel that I probably need to see it to make myself face the questions and points it raises.
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

If people think it is a comic book movie they need to start paying more attention to the world around them :p ;)
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

Handyman said:
If people think it is a comic book movie they need to start paying more attention to the world around them :p ;)
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Alamo Drafthouse put up a sign to warn people this isn't a Batman movie.
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

I have a feeling Trumpies are going to hate it because they'll assume it's social commentary aimed in their direction, a few liberal snowflakes will be taken aback by the violence, comic book fans will have their own subgroups that are divided to varying degrees that I'm not in tune with enough to break down further, and people like me that are open to just about anything that will give the film an honest look going into it with no preconceived notions of what to expect.
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

They've released a 40th Anniversary Edition, 4K Ultra HD, Blu-ray of Apocalypse Now. Loved that movie.
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

Slap Shot said:
I have a feeling Trumpies are going to hate it because they'll assume it's social commentary aimed in their direction, a few liberal snowflakes will be taken aback by the violence, comic book fans will have their own subgroups that are divided to varying degrees that I'm not in tune with enough to break down further, and people like me that are open to just about anything that will give the film an honest look going into it with no preconceived notions of what to expect.
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Oh the Snowflakes have been hating this film since the first trailer. Some of the critics and RT bloggers were tweeting out the hate of the film a month before they saw it. (and shockingly their views didnt change after seeing it...get right out of town! ;) ) The Incel/Trumpers...well who cares what they think anyways ;)

Stuff like this is why I almost never read reviews until after the film. (and why I detest RT)
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

ticapnews said:
I'm really struggling to come up with a score for this. I thought it was brilliant. It might be the film of the year. Yet watching it was so uncomfortable I cannot with a good conscience say this is a must-see. It depends on each person. For posterity I'll give it a 9/10 but you'll have to decide if you want to subject yourself to this piece of cinema. I both want to see it again and simultaneously wish I had never seen it in the first place.
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Going to a Sunday morning matinee. I guess I'll consider myself warned.
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

This was predictable

A movie theater in Huntington Beach, Calif., showing the film “Joker” was closed down on Thursday night after a “credible” threat was reported to police, the Huntington Beach Police Department said on Friday.

The final two showings of the movie at the Century Huntington Beach and XD theater in the Bella Terra shopping center were canceled after officers were sent to the scene. Showings resumed on Friday. The Huntington Beach Police Department said in a statement that it had received information about a possible threat to the Century Theater in response to the opening of “Joker.”

“The police department deemed the threat was credible enough to provide a uniformed presence at the theater,” the statement said. “As the investigation continued, our officers worked with the managers of the theater, who determined they would cancel the final two showings of the movie and close the theater out of an abundance of caution. Based on the investigation, and in working with theater management, it was determined that the theater could safely reopen today and resume normal operation.”

“The Huntington Beach Police Department will provide patrols at Century Theater for the rest of this weekend,” the police added. “We are working in conjunction with the theater’s management as well as mall security to provide a safe environment to the public. This incident is currently under investigation, and no further details will be provided.”
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Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

Just got out...oh my God :eek:

Full review when I get home...
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

solovsfett said:
Someday this war’s going to end.

Have you seen the documentary heart of darkness about the making of the movie?
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No, never knew it existed. But I'm going to check it out. YouTube has it for $3.99
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

Ok...I apologize if this is very long but well I got things to say:

First and foremost I havent been this disturbed at a film since I saw Silence of the Lambs back in the day. I legitimately had shivers running up and down my spine the whole first half of the film. Part of that is the story and a large chunk of that is the score. Good lord I am not sure there has been a better score in a film. Even the non-original pieces are perfect for their scenes. If this was a "silent" film the score would be enough to terrify you in some scenes.

I can see where, on the surface, it could be said the film makes Arthur into the "hero". If you pay attention to half the film sure he might be. But the script pretty much beats you over the head Nolan Style with the truth that he isnt the hero and what has happened to him doesnt excuse what he did or does. Gotham may be the incubator, and the people there may be awful (including its saviors) and Arthur is completely mentally ill to the point of being a danger...but his actions are his own. Phillips has said he wanted to give you a reason to pull for Arthur until there is no way you can justify what he did and I think he hit that line on the nose. There is a point (well many points depending on how much sympathy you choose to give him) where everyone will say "I was with you until then...but yeah you are evil and I am out!". Hell there is even points where they try and walk you back from the edge, show he isnt as bad as what he does...but then he jumps five steps ahead and you just cant...ultimately there is no hero in this story.

I still have yet to read any reviews, but any that say this film glorifies violence (or even worse Incel violence) need to go back to college and get a different degree. This film no more glorifies those things than Silence of the Lambs (or Manhunter) glorifies serial killers or Fight Club glorifies the breakdown of society. Again if you look on the surface only it does appear that anarchy is loved and violence is the answer to all problems but usually in the very same scene something happens that shows that such a thought is ludicrous. If you really pay attention you can see how Arthur is not only an unreliable narrator but where his reality and the real world break from each other. You have to try to not see it, you have to want to not see it. Phillips isnt that good of a director that he is able to hide it, its right there clear as day. (though Phoenix has intimated that was by design...one of the reasons he said yes to making the film)

Maybe some of the reviews that say "it has nothing to say" are correct (not in my mind but I think I get the gist based on what I have been told) in that the film is not some social commentary per se...but it isnt supposed to be. The purpose was to show how far a society has to fall for something like The Joker to happen. Again that isnt an excuse, it just is the reality. Joker doesnt cause the downfall of Gotham...Joker is just a human example of what has become of a once great society. He didnt just fall through the cracks, he was sucked up by quicksand and if not for a twist of fate probably is never seen or heard from again. The story in reality is predictable as heck...it just isnt very Hollywood which is another reason it is so offputting. I think if this had just been about a non-comic character it would be looked at different.

I have never seen an actor carry something to the level Phoenix did. I mean he is literally in every scene. Even if you hate everything about the film the performance he puts forth is so ridiculously above the bar it is hard to imagine anyone equaling it any time soon. It is better than Ledger because Ledger is only in like 15 minutes of The Dark Knight. I mean we are talking DDL in There Will Be Blood levels of acting. If he doesnt win the Oscar he will win the Golden Globe because the foreign press seems to like the film more.

Unlike tica I can say I enjoyed the film though maybe I should say I enjoyed being completely disturbed instead. It reminded me of watching the film Falling Down, or even the first season and a half of Mr. Robot. I would say probably 9.5/10 but it is tough to put a number on it. I think everyone should see it, but I also think they should know what they are in for before they do it. I plan to see it again because I want to see if I am maybe romanticizing it a bit...but wow.
 
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Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

I was leaning home because I have an amazing setup with a big plasma and a 7.1 surround. But more importantly I like to immerse myself without distractions. People in a theater can ruin experiences like this. Plus my fiancée wants nothing to do with this movie. Too close to home with work.

Wait for Netflix Blu-ray and rent it I think.

Unless there’s a compelling reason why people enhance the experience.
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

Handyman said:
That is tough. For me it was theater must but I have biases.

Though at home with the lights out might give me nightmares :eek:
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I want to see it in a theater at least once, so I don't have to worry about accidentally stumbling upon something on the interwebs.

Also, to dx's point, that's why I'm going to a 10am Sunday showing. The past few blockbusters (even on opening weekend), there's been maybe 7-8 others in the theater. It's awesome.
 
dxmnkd316 said:
I was leaning home because I have an amazing setup with a big plasma and a 7.1 surround. But more importantly I like to immerse myself without distractions. People in a theater can ruin experiences like this. Plus my fiancée wants nothing to do with this movie. Too close to home with work.

Wait for Netflix Blu-ray and rent it I think.

Unless there’s a compelling reason why people enhance the experience.
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The theaters won't be filled so you shouldn't be distracted.
 
Re: Movies 51 - Rise of the Frozen Joker: Chapter II: Dark Fate

Joker was fantastic!

If the Power Elite/palpatine supporters at The Atlantic or NYT are lukewarm or dismissive of this movie it’s obvious why.

Joker is a mirror turned on our society. A necessary and uncomfortable truth. The yellow vest movement in France is now almost one year in and no coverage here just like this movie will cause mass amnesia amongst the fourth estate.

“Kill the rich”? Yeah, NYT and Atlantic can’t even fathom sympathy for the victims portrayed in this movie.

America needs this movie now more than ever.
 
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