Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

[DoubleA]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

I agree with most of this post. As we see it right now there is no gain. But just perhaps the process is still on going. I understand dismissing Tim due to ticket sales, but of this moment, the increase in ticket sales is not going to be all that significant. However, if the team puts together a win streak early in the season, people will be buying tickets. How did you get all of those red chiclets, you make too much sense?

Runsub, this is very disappointing. Your insight and posts are generally solid. Have you not called for Whitehead's scalp time and again? Please...

 

[Runsub5]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

We'll see if season tickets return to normal. You should understand that this forum is not the only place Maine fans go to talk about the program - it's just the most public. There are private message boards and email lists (some of us are still stuck in 1992) that you never see. Oh, that's right...you're a Maine fan. So you probably are on all those groups, right?

Not a lot of people are happy with the administration, not just the "Internet Nutcases" on this forum. This feeling of disappointment extends far beyond the USCHO Fan Forum. It has been misunderstood as just anger at losing Montgomery, but it goes much deeper than that. Maybe Corkum will end up being the long term coach, and maybe he will enjoy success. I care about the players and the program and will continue. On my last visit to Alfond I picked up an application to join FOMH and am considering season tickets regardless of who stands behind the bench. I would encourage people to remain engaged - or come back - and give the next coach a chance; but I'm not going to blame them for abandoning the school after the way the school has treated them.

Well said. Good point about being stuck in 1992. Almost impossible to go back in time and duplicate anything.

 

[Hokydad]

He may. But as you say, he's going to have to work at it, and he's gonna need to be successful right out of the gate.

Jimmy would have brought those fans back, and the increased enthusiasm and $$$$ from day one, the minute he's introduced on the ice. And that kinda enthusiasm would have afforded him a grace period should it take some time to right this mess that Whitehead made.

Corkum, for all his strengths as a coach, isn't gonna have that wild enthusiastic backing from the very first time he's introduced on the ice as the head coach, and certainly won't have any kind of grace period. Like it or not, there's gonna be suspicion of his abilities based on what he's done the last five years. If he stumbles coming out of the gate, expect the boobirds to be there in full force.

Why? What does Montgomery bring to the table outside the fact you support him?

List the bullet facts

The me why some blue chip kid from Natl team would play for humor a ushl kid vs going to bu or BC or Harvard. Not one would
.can he tell them I know what it takes to play in the NHL? Can he say I coached a us team? Can he say I played for devils and these 5 NHL super coaches?

Nope. They have no interest in talking to maines version of Dave Emma without the over seas carear

Why would anyone put up money when they wouldn't for Whitehead?

 

[Runsub5]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

Runsub, this is very disappointing. Your insight and posts are generally solid. Have you not called for Whitehead's scalp time and again? Please...

No it wasn't me. I've been fairly reserved in calling for Tim's dismissal. I think he failed miserably as a recruiter, but was very good in recruiting good student athletes and was successful in developing many of them. An example would be last years team and the second half of this year. Losing Matt Mangene and John Parker were huge. I think a change is warranted at times, but it is also a slippery slope.

 

[Wayuphere]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

No Jimmy, no more season tickets. Had them since the 80's
'nuff said?

 

[amherstblackbear]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

Why? What does Montgomery bring to the table outside the fact you support him?

List the bullet facts

The me why some blue chip kid from Natl team would play for humor a ushl kid vs going to bu or BC or Harvard. Not one would
.can he tell them I know what it takes to play in the NHL? Can he say I coached a us team? Can he say I played for devils and these 5 NHL super coaches?

Nope. They have no interest in talking to maines version of Dave Emma without the over seas carear

Why would anyone put up money when they wouldn't for Whitehead?

I agree. Montgomery might be able to help Maine make some modest inroads in the USHL, but Maine will always be at a disadvantage recruiting that league compared to schools that are actually in the same geographic area as the USHL, as well as schools that are more prestigious, as well as whichever schools are "hot" at the moment. It doesn't mean Maine won't get any USHL players, or top BCHL or OPJHL players. They have, and they will. But if you set personal history aside, Denver is more the right profile for a successful USHL coach who's making the move to the NCAAs.

I take it what you're saying is, for Maine to be more successful, they're going to have to do a better job getting players who aren't highly recruited, for whatever reason, but who develop into good players by the time they graduate. Those kids might identify with a guy like Corkum, and he might be able to get the best out of them.

But what does that really mean?

The problem isn't that the recruiting pipeline has *no* good USHL prospects, or Mr. Hockey finalists, or solid ontario league prospects . . . it's that there aren't enough. So the problem is where Maine is getting the rest of the players? Is your point that Maine should take chances with older players, or players from rural Canada? Instead of just relying on filling out the roster with kids from the EJHL? I guess I could be sold on that, except that it looks like Corkum (former Monarch) is the guy who's been behind the EJHL pipeline in the first place.

So what gives? What am I not getting, here?

 

[walrus]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

Its interesting that alot of the vocal types were whining about a Nat'l search, in the other breath they are saying Maine blew it by not giving the job to Jimmy, essentially without any kind of search. So which is it? The same guys saying Jimmy, Jimmy, Jimmy, 2 years ago were saying Bobby, Bobby, Bobby WT F
Anyone following Maine hockey knows the damage was done 3 years ago when Blake gave out the 3 year extension. I'm not sure the program will ever recover from that? No one knows what is happening behind the scenes and I understand you don't trust that its good, UMaines reputation precedes itself. Lets see if a Nat'l search is done.

 

[Hokydad]

I agree. Montgomery might be able to help Maine make some modest inroads in the USHL, but Maine will always be at a disadvantage recruiting that league compared to schools that are actually in the same geographic area as the USHL, as well as schools that are more prestigious, as well as whichever schools are "hot" at the moment. It doesn't mean Maine won't get any USHL players, or top BCHL or OPJHL players. They have, and they will. But if you set personal history aside, Denver is more the right profile for a successful USHL coach who's making the move to the NCAAs.

I take it what you're saying is, for Maine to be more successful, they're going to have to do a better job getting players who aren't highly recruited, for whatever reason. Those kids might identify with a guy like Corkum, and he might be able to get the best out of them.

But what does that really mean?

The problem isn't that the recruiting pipeline has *no* good USHL prospects, or Mr. Hockey finalists, or solid ontario league prospects . . . it's that there aren't enough. So the problem is where Maine is getting the rest of the players? Is your point that Maine should take chances with older players, or players from rural Canada? Instead of just relying on filling out the roster with kids from the EJHL? I guess I could be sold on that, except that it looks like Corkum (former Monarch) is the guy who's been behind the EJHL pipeline in the first place.

So what gives? What am I not getting, here?

Whitehead was the EJ guy..... also was the Tim Lovell guy

Corkum knows what it takes player wise.

I loved Corkums message and so won't the players. Now a days 99% of the us batl, ushl and bchl kids want go think they can play pro hockey. That is a fact, they all feel that. Even the 3rd and 4th line ushl guys feel they are victims when they don't get drafted. Cofkym can tell them, "I came to Maine, kicked some *** and went on to play 800 NHL games and made 4.5 million doing it. They don't want to hear "I came to Maine, plated with Jariya and he waved and left after one year, he made millions and I couldn't get to rhs next level, didn't play for any NHL coaches and have no idea how to get there".

Denver is perfect fit for him as facility and program rep sells that

 

[DoubleA]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

Its interesting that alot of the vocal types were whining about a Nat'l search, in the other breath they are saying Maine blew it by not giving the job to Jimmy, essentially without any kind of search........ Lets see if a Nat'l search is done.

I believed all along that Abbott had the stones and was going to fire Whitehead. And he did.
I also believe that his Plan A here is not to hand the reins to Bobby without a National Search. No way.
I hope to the Lord above that I am not naive.

 

[BlackI]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

Its interesting that alot of the vocal types were whining about a Nat'l search, in the other breath they are saying Maine blew it by not giving the job to Jimmy, essentially without any kind of search. So which is it? The same guys saying Jimmy, Jimmy, Jimmy, 2 years ago were saying Bobby, Bobby, Bobby WT F
Anyone following Maine hockey knows the damage was done 3 years ago when Blake gave out the 3 year extension. I'm not sure the program will ever recover from that? No one knows what is happening behind the scenes and I understand you don't trust that its good, UMaines reputation precedes itself. Lets see if a Nat'l search is done.

Hypothetical situation : You tell me Gwozdecky and Whitehead are fired, that Jimmy would be a coach of one of the teams. And you ask which team is Jimmy coaching. I would say Maine even if you asked over and over again.

Denvers search yielded Jimmy. My thought process is that the management in the UMaine athletic department is looking incompetent. Why would I believe in their abilities to form a competent search committee.

I think Maine just missed out on something that could have been great. And everyone that is backing Corkum isn't getting it. I'm not not backing Corkum, if that makes sense. I'm saying how great would Jimmy/Bobby/Dan coaching staff had been. Corkum would still be behind the Maine bench. It would have been enthusiastic for the fans and brought in money. There would have been some hype about it generating some momentum to restore the ticket sales. You have retained Bobby and Dan and held some continuity.

 

[Wayuphere]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

Blackl's first para., hypothetical, sums it up.

 

[Hokydad]

Blackl's first para., hypothetical, sums it up.

If he was first pixk maybe. Others said " no, I don't want to "

 

[rufus]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

Why? What does Montgomery bring to the table outside the fact you support him?

He's won everywhere he's been?

He can say, I helped a team win a National Championship. I played for and learned what it takes to win and build a team from two of the greatest coaches ever in the college game. From them, I learned what it takes to build a program, to win games, and to win championships.

He could say, look at my coaching record, I built a champion from scratch.

 

[all bear]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

BlackI....only problem is no way in hell Corkum would want to continue on as an assistant. He wants to be in charge, period.

 

[rufus]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

If he was first pixk maybe. Others said " no, I don't want to "

So what? How does that reflect poorly on Montgomery? There's thousands of hockey coaches in this country, and he's good enough to be in their top ten choices for their program.

Again, so what?

 

[rufus]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

You have retained Bobby and Dan and held some continuity.

And no buzz, and no ticket sales unless the team starts winning. And who knows how long that might be? Corkum doesn't have a long time to right this ship, or else he faces the same scrutiny that TIMMAY did. Even worse if Monty is successful in Denver.

 

[BlackI]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

BlackI....only problem is no way in hell Corkum would want to continue on as an assistant. He wants to be in charge, period.

Well, I don't know this would be the case. But I have a real problem with this line of thinking. First off, you are a top assistant on a team that won only 2 home games and turned in about the worst season in 25 years. And your head coach got fired. And you are not only worried that a new coach could come in and clean house. Oh no, better take it up a notch and insist on being entitled to the head coaching position. I feel on some level Corkum might understand it if a new head coach came in and wanted to work with him and retain him as the top assistant. It would be a good thing in my opinion to have this open attitude if what he is saying is true. He says he wants to bring back the glory of Maine hockey. It may take an open attitude to working with a new head coach and working on developing the model of the product. I'm sure a new head coach would love to retain him. He knows the players, their strengths and weaknesses. He knows how things run in the office. He knows the management and staff. A new head coach at Maine would probably be dumb to let Corkum go. Now, having said all of that I don't think Corkum should feel he is entitled to the position.

Then again, anything I think could/would/should happen at UMaine in the coaching staff won't happen. Even when the decision making is simple, like hit you over the head with a 2 by 4 simple... it has to get turned upside down for complexity's sake. This way things can be so confusing when it goes wrong nobody is sure anymore where the mess started.

Again, and for the record, I have nothing against Corkum and do/will support him. However, the athletic department really stuck a knife in the gut of the average Maine hockey fan when they decided they wouldn't even have Montgomery in for an interview where both sides could gauge if it was a good fit or not.

 

[Priceless]

Wait...recruiting at Maine is hard? I thought people in this very thread said it was easy to recruit kids to come to Maine.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

(Monty) can say, I helped a team win a National Championship. I played for and learned what it takes to win and build a team from two of the greatest coaches ever in the college game. From them, I learned what it takes to build a program, to win games, and to win championships.

He could say, look at my coaching record, I built a champion from scratch.

This works for me. I think UMaine has lost an opportunity here, with Montgomery going to Denver.

The comparison of NHL hockey careers is also somewhat amusing. Corkum had a marginally better NHL career, but let's face it - his single best year was after he was taken by Anaheim out of the Buffalo organization in the expansion draft. Before then he was a 4th liner at best who also spent a ton of time in the AHL. After that, his most productive stretch was a three year stretch as a 3rd/4th line player on some mediocre Phoenix teams. After that, he finished up his NHL career as a spare part.

Montgomery was a spare part at the NHL level for virtually his entire career, but he was in better organizations overall (Montreal, Philly, San Jose and Dallas) and never got a shot at an expansion team, whereas Corkum spent almost his entire career with poor teams. Both guys clearly worked their butts off to carve out their playing careers, and both spent 10+ years in and out of the NHL to try to make it.

To even suggest Monty quit, whereas Corkum was a millionaire superstar, would be to stretch the truth quite a bit. One could even suggest that had Monty gotten the break Corkum did with the expansion draft, their NHL careers could have been virtually identical.

Having said that, there is no correlation between length/success of NHL playing career, and success at a D-1 coaching career.

 

[BlackI]

Re: Maine Summer 2013 - Pizza Season

Wait...recruiting at Maine is hard? I thought people in this very thread said it was easy to recruit kids to come to Maine.

Evidently. Even when the guy says he is interested. Even when the guy holds arguably the most impressive accolades of any player to wear the Maine jersey.

Yes, it is very hard to recruit to Maine when you ensure the recruiting process not happen.

Something is in the way.