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Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

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Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

ck1969 said:
I'm sure he does want to implement his style but he doesn't have the type of players to be successful with that type of play.....so as the coach you adjust and try to maximize what you have. He hasn't done that IMO and I think they players know it isn't working and have clearly tuned him out. All great coaches no matter what the sport adapt to the talent they have. You can't rely on a system to create talent. The season is almost over and he hasn't been able to figure out how to best use what he has. Yes there's a lack of talent but this team should be better than they are. I'm sorry but that's poor coaching and stubbornness.
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I agree with everything you said. In my opinion, he either doesn't see the limitations of these players or if he does, refuses to implement a system that gives them a fighting chance to be successful.
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

BBDiehard14 said:
All due respect, "it's going to take time," "rebuild," "Rome wasn't built in a day" are things that Maine fans do not like hearing.
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They don't like hearing it because the administration kept Whitehead for about 5 years longer than they should have. Red may be the guy for the job, but I do think that they could have brought someone in that may have started getting better results from the get-go. Where Red may take 4 years to realize real improvement in the teams play and record........a younger coach that is more in-tune with todays players might have been a better way to go. But again......the prior administration created this situation by rewarding mediocrity and in the end.....just plain losing. Blake James could not fire his friends and Ferguson did not have the balls to override him.

Maine fans will have to have patience and if Red doesn't start to turn this thing around going by the final year of his contract then he should be fired......period.
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

CollegeHockeyRinkReport said:
http://www.sbncollegehockey.com/hoc...ne-red-gendron-defense-goaltending-ineptitude

What's wrong with Maine?
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I think this article makes some good points, but for me the bigger issue is Maine throwing away games they should win versus having some bad performances. If Maine comes out, has a bad game, and loses 4-1 once in awhile I'm fine with that. When they have a two goal lead and blow it that bothers me much more. For as bad as Maine has been they could pretty easily be in third place. I count seven league games they should have had a better result in; both BU games, @UML, Friday @UVM, both UConn games, and Friday against Notre Dame.

I've posted this a million times, but even if Maine gets better it isn't going to change the college hockey landscape. College hockey as a whole is extremely mediocre now and I don't see that changing any time soon, unfortunately.
 
Drew S. said:
I think this article makes some good points, but for me the bigger issue is Maine throwing away games they should win versus having some bad performances. If Maine comes out, has a bad game, and loses 4-1 once in awhile I'm fine with that. When they have a two goal lead and blow it that bothers me much more. For as bad as Maine has been they could pretty easily be in third place. I count seven league games they should have had a better result in; both BU games, @UML, Friday @UVM, both UConn games, and Friday against Notre Dame.

I've posted this a million times, but even if Maine gets better it isn't going to change the college hockey landscape. College hockey as a whole is extremely mediocre now and I don't see that changing any time soon, unfortunately.
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Too many blown leads. This team just can't finish
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

Bazin took Lowell to the NCAA's with Doug Carr, and a defense that along with him threw up an 898 save percentage in Blaise's last year there. He changed something about that team well beyond just being fortunate enough to get Hellybuck.

Point does make more sense for Leaman.

Morris' sv% is .07 lower than Marty's was last year, that drop does not account for what we've seen in the differences terms of effort, skating, power play and generating chances from last year. Granted they've played Romeo a ton and he's only at .904. The teams with Flynn and Nyquist got a hell of a lot worse goaltending than this team has gotten and never had the dismal "look" that this one does. Hanging it on the goalies is insane to me.
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

BoSox3066 said:
Bazin took Lowell to the NCAA's with Doug Carr, and a defense that along with him threw up an 898 save percentage in Blaise's last year there. He changed something about that team well beyond just being fortunate enough to get Hellybuck.

Point does make more sense for Leaman.

Morris' sv% is .07 lower than Marty's was last year, that drop does not account for what we've seen in the differences terms of effort, skating, power play and generating chances from last year. Granted they've played Romeo a ton and he's only at .904. The teams with Flynn and Nyquist got a hell of a lot worse goaltending than this team has gotten and never had the dismal "look" that this one does. Hanging it on the goalies is insane to me.
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Its lack of offense and team D. Who do you see as a sniper on this team? I see no one. Shore looks to pass first. Vesey may be one in the future. Hutton has a good shot from the point. People love Cam Brown but sniper? Not. He keeps his feet moving all the time and would be a tremendous 3rd liner on a better team. Byron? He's good but sniper? I watched some ND forward hit a spot on Romeo, no one on Maine hits that spot. This has been going on for years, its not new to this team.
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

But Bazin and Leamon don't exactly have snipers or blue chip defensemen among their group, but somehow they're getting it done while Maine still struggles. There's something more to the equation other than better recruits and lack of top flight talent. Something else is missing here.
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

Drew S. said:
Yeah, Red deserves a break where only four or five kids on the team is his. He needs to get rid of the kids who don't have the proper amount of toughness after the season is over though. He would have been well served to get rid of some kids last summer and get tougher players in.
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Drew, Red is the ultimate mis-manager. Was hopeful and optimistic after last year, but the coach hasn't shown me anything this season. He doesn't look like a keeper.
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

rufus said:
But Bazin and Leamon don't exactly have snipers or blue chip defensemen among their group, but somehow they're getting it done while Maine still struggles. There's something more to the equation other than better recruits and lack of top flight talent. Something else is missing here.
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Yes there is something missing.....a coach that can optimize and adapt his systems to the talent he has.
 
walrus said:
Its lack of offense and team D. Who do you see as a sniper on this team? I see no one. Shore looks to pass first. Vesey may be one in the future. Hutton has a good shot from the point. People love Cam Brown but sniper? Not. He keeps his feet moving all the time and would be a tremendous 3rd liner on a better team. Byron? He's good but sniper? I watched some ND forward hit a spot on Romeo, no one on Maine hits that spot. This has been going on for years, its not new to this team.
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Agreed completely. What I find troubling is the people and article crying get a goalie and everything will be fine, as if this mess is Morris and Romeos fault. Ive seen teams where the mess was on the goalies, this is not that.
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

ck1969 said:
Yes there is something missing.....a coach that can optimize and adapt his systems to the talent he has.
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I think that's a bit unfair. I said before last season that I didn't care about wins and losses, I wanted to see the team play better, take fewer penalties, make fewer mistakes, be fundamentally sound, hockey smart, aggressive and tough to play against. And that's still the way I feel. Maybe Red's the same way, and he'd rather pass up a win or two to get his guy's familiar with playing an uptempo, aggressive, fast-paced style. Get the elements of the system in place, the expectations of what he wants from his players, the 'process' of how he wants them playing the game.

Trouble is, while we saw some of that last season, not so much this year. Stupid mistakes, dumb penalties, coming out 'flat'. It's looking more apparent that either these guys are unable to play that style, whether lack of ability and talent, or can't grasp the fundamental concepts, or they've willingly chosen not to. And the only solution to that is to wait until we get guys in here who can and will play that way.

Sure, Red might be able to eke out a few extra wins each season by clogging the middle and slowing things down playing the trap and mucking up the defensive zone, as we saw TIMMAY play, but then he's abandoning the concepts of what he thinks needs to be done to be successful in the long term. Right now, he's got some players who might excell better at that sort of style, but for the one's he's gonna be bringing in, he might want that newer style already in place and ready to go. The guys who can't play it will sit, be scrub or role players, while the guys who can step right in and run with it. And how's he gonna attract guys who play uptempo fast and aggressive when they come here and see the team trying to bore their opponents to death?
 
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Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

An interesting point from Adam Wodon:

With no offense to Red Gendron, who is a great coach, does anyone still believe Maine's issues were only related to Tim Whitehead. I mean, I never thought that, and said so at the time he was fired. The point is, Gendron is a great coach, yet the team is still struggling. Sure, he needs more time, but the fact of the matter was and still is that Maine has institutional issues with funding that aren't going away any time soon.
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Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

AMC said:
An interesting point from Adam Wodon:
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interesting at most... red, unfortunately has NO track record as a head coach.
a great assistant, maybe, but nobody can say he isa great head coach.

if any of you ever saw what Standbrook did at Darrmouth you might scratch your head. Grant hated being a head coach and was not good at it.
 
Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

AMC said:
An interesting point from Adam Wodon:
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All I know are the same rumors everyone else has heard about what wasn't working which led to Whitehead being dismissed. I don't think Maine's institutional issues were bigger than the issues under the previous coaching regime. Maine's problem towards the end of the Whitehead era was consistent recruiting. I know I'm going to upset people for bringing it up again, but when I point out institutional flaws I'll point to the way the University of Maine handled Ryan Lomberg's dismissal as a good example of poor decision making at the administrative level that had a toxic effect on the team. I know Lomberg wasn't in the running for a humanitarian award before his infraction happened, but with the talent level on the team being what it is, just taking away that one piece of the puzzle is a huge difference between this year and last year. For those people who are sick of hearing this, try arguing that things would be just as bad this season if we still had our third leading scorer from last year on the team.
 
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Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

I think you guys are missing the point. I agree with getting rid of Lomberg, other people don't, whatever. This team with Lomberg doesn't jump from 10 wins to 20. Some people apparently think Gendron is an awful coach, some think he's fantastic, I think he's probably somewhere in between. Whatever. With the talent on this team, I don't think there's a coach out there that gets them to 20 wins. If you think someone else, with Lomberg on the team, could get them to maybe 15/16 wins, okay. I can buy that, but the point to follow stands:

Beginning in the late 1980's through the 90's, Maine probably was in the top 5-10 nationally in spending on ice hockey. Right now, I would be shocked if Maine was in the top 50%. And that matters. A lot. Most of Maine's peer schools have much less broad athletic programs. UNH doesn't have baseball anymore, it's big sports are football and hockey (and their hockey is suffering). UVM doesn't have football or baseball. Lowell doesn't have football. Northeastern dropped football. Maine has 50+ football scholarships, 18 hockey scholarships, 12ish baseball scholarships to pay for, as well as women's equivalencies. That's a lot, especially considering how every time you open the paper you read about how much the UMaine system as a whole is in crisis. There's a limited pool of money to spend, and Maine is trying to spread it across a very wide swath.

For years and years, Maine could rely on having the biggest recruiting budget, the most up to date facilities, the best equipment, etc. Maine used to play a true national schedule, from Alaska to California to Florida to Ohio to Minnesota, etc. Now they are limiting flights, staying close to home, etc. Is Maine committing more resources to hockey than Lowell? Or Northeastern? Or Quinnipiac? Or.... you name it.

That's why Maine isn't MAINE anymore. And why we won't be again until the state/board of trustees figures out how to fix the statewide system, then the Orono administration figures out its plan for athletics with the money it has, then the athletic department figures out how to divvy up funds.

TL;DR version: the university is broke, and hockey is expensive, and we aren't outspending our rivals anymore.
 
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Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

AMC said:
.

TL;DR version: the university is broke, and hockey is expensive, and we aren't outspending our rivals anymore.
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Another place where Tim hurt the program, fund raising. Red is out there, shaking hands before every game. Jay and Ben are out there also. Red is very approachable, his office is open. You can ask questions but be prepared to not like the answer:) He calls a spade a spade
 
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