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Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

My local radio host ranted about how the media was quick to pigeon hole lacrosse as a whole. I'm from Northern New York where there are a lot of quality players. Are there a few bad eggs? Yes, but that is with everything. The majority of lacrosse players are quality people.

As for the victim, what a tragedy. From what I gathered, she was a great person and student. Really sad.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

In order to be convicted of first degree (intentional) murder, the Prosecution needs to prove the Defendant had a SPECIFIC INTENT to kill another. This speaks to one's state of mind, not their actions, and is very difficult to prove. There is an important distinction between intending to kill and intending to seriously injure, i.e. murder v. aggravated assault. What you might imply from the lawyers statements is that the Defendant has admitted to being angry and becoming violent, maybe even intending to injure. That does not mean he intended death. If that was the case the murder would be reckless or negligent, but not intentional. I.e. 2nd or 3rd v. 1st degree murder.

If there were written or witnessed verbal death threats, they would implicate some level of pre-meditation. But the context is critical here...
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Here's my viewpoint: this would be covered much differently if these two people were African American. This dude has been in jail for resisting arrest and other sorts of aggravated assault. If he had been black (with the same rap sheet), ESPN wouldn't be labeling it a "tragedy;" even though it is, regardless of race. Anytime someone is murdered it's a tragedy.

Not me being racist...I'm saying that the media has those tendencies.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Dude Love said:
Here's my viewpoint: this would be covered much differently if these two people were African American. This dude has been in jail for resisting arrest and other sorts of aggravated assault. If he had been black (with the same rap sheet), ESPN wouldn't be labeling it a "tragedy;" even though it is, regardless of race. Anytime someone is murdered it's a tragedy.

Not me being racist...I'm saying that the media has those tendencies.
Click to expand...

Chris Henry, anyone?
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Terrierbyassociation said:
Pretend Chris Henry wasn't a professional athlete, for all intensive purposes this guy was a nobody.
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There might be a class element mixed into this too. I'm not sure what the victim's socioeconomic status is, but the accused definitely comes from a privileged background and rich kids gone bad is always a story that sells.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Terrierbyassociation said:
Pretend Chris Henry wasn't a professional athlete, for all intensive purposes this guy was a nobody.
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Doesn't really matter, IMO.

Then how about Sean Taylor, who was charged with three felony counts (later plea bargained)? That's a little worse than being drunk, resisting arrest and such, and should bridge that pro-college gap.

I don't think this would be covered any differently.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Dude Love said:
Here's my viewpoint: this would be covered much differently if these two people were African American. This dude has been in jail for resisting arrest and other sorts of aggravated assault. If he had been black (with the same rap sheet), ESPN wouldn't be labeling it a "tragedy;" even though it is, regardless of race. Anytime someone is murdered it's a tragedy.

Not me being racist...I'm saying that the media has those tendencies.
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You are 100% correct. Many lacrosse players are white and tend to play at elite schools and often come from elite, upper income backgrounds. Thus, they are thought by the meida to have more "promise" and a far greater media interest. If these were two African American track athletes at Troy (Ala.) State, the story would be a lot smaller.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Puck Swami said:
You are 100% correct. Many lacrosse players are white and tend to play at elite schools and often come from elite, upper income backgrounds. Thus, they are thought by the meida to have more "promise" and a far greater media interest. If these were two African American track athletes at Troy (Ala.) State, the story would be a lot smaller.
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Lets face it though... we're a lot quicker to make up for the sins of white people in general especially if they have ability. We all know the scumbags growing up or that we see around. When some of them end up unchecked to enough of a degree then certain things tend to happen.

The thing is, the bulk of people identify with the white male athlete from good backgrounds because in general the bulk of people are white (humans are tribalistic) and they want to latch onto success.

The thing is that gets me when these things happen. People gloss over the behaviors of people... the "good kid" syndrome. Just because they're "good" on official situations doesn't mean they're good when those in charge aren't watching. I remember seeing a home town article about the shock that the kids of some of the more important people in town beat up a homeless guy at a McDonalds. I don't understand how people forget their own school year experience that tells them that there are screw ups and scumbags out there amongst their "peers". But you know, when people are popular people tend to gravitate to these people regardless of what they will do to others in the end because of the status given. I have to imagine this girl (the murdered UVA lax player) probably found a "good" handsome strong guy... and probably ignored what he did to others or the attitudes he carried around in general... until it became a problem for her.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Frat boys at a most competitive colleges are all good kids, intelligent, with bright futures...yet they still periodically kill one of their own via hazing, still hold parties at which only freshmen girls are allowed because they aren't wise enough to avoid getting date raped and every once in a while somebody gets killed falling off a roof/balcony etc.

Collect enough smart, white, 'good kids' at a $40+k/year college into a closed group and you frequently have a recipe for entitlement, arrogance and protection from the penalties faced when most 'normal' kids get into trouble.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Terrierbyassociation said:
Scum can be found at all class levels.
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True, but, to me, it is more interesting to see intelligent kids with many advantages acting like a mindless mob and doing things that are so far from their image. The street gang members may have no real chance of a future and 'represent' their surroundings and upbringing.

A bunch of rich white kids use that status and position to pursue a different kind of mayhem and frequently do so with few repercussions as they cover for each other and spend dad's money to solve problems.

In my view, at least the gang is upfront and not hiding behind image and daddy's money. We don't see the Crips or Bloods moonlighting as shelter workers and just acting the part of bad-asses.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

pirate said:
Frat boys at a most competitive colleges are all good kids, intelligent, with bright futures...yet they still periodically kill one of their own via hazing, still hold parties at which only freshmen girls are allowed because they aren't wise enough to avoid getting date raped and every once in a while somebody gets killed falling off a roof/balcony etc.

Collect enough smart, white, 'good kids' at a $40+k/year college into a closed group and you frequently have a recipe for entitlement, arrogance and protection from the penalties faced when most 'normal' kids get into trouble.
Click to expand...

Judging by all the prejudices crammed into your post, I'm guessing you were terribly disappointed by the outcome of the Duke "rape" case, since all of that bigotry was on display for all to see there, too.
 
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Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Old Pio said:
Judging by all the prejudices crammed into your post, I'm guessing you were terribly disappointed by the outcome of the Duke "rape" case, since all of that bigotry was on display for all to see there, too.
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I think he did a search and replace for 'Muslimist' from one of your posts.
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

MaizeRage said:
I think he did a search and replace for 'Muslimist' from one of your posts.
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I don't believe I've ever used that term, but thanks for the suggestion. Surely you aren't suggesting that Alpha Tau Omega presents the same level of threat to the United States as Muslim fascists do. And are you also suggesting that alleged rhetorical over reaching by me justifies blatant generalized biases against rich white college guys?
 
Re: Lacrosse Tragedy at U of Virginia

Old Pio said:
And are you also suggesting that alleged rhetorical over reaching by me justifies blatant generalized biases against rich white college guys?
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I'm saying that judging such a large group of people by a few embarrassments is foolish in both cases, and pointing out the comedy of you being able to see that in one group, and not the other.
 
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