Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

[IrishHockeyFan]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

First off I didn't state he said he was the only reason. As a matter of fact I posed a ?. Shouldn't A ND FAN know the difference from a ? and a statement? As to # 10 I do not know him but Friday while watching the game there were comments that he seemed to be playing better as a winger.His physical play is much needed.

Your "question" was really a comment. Using the word "the" in your post and forming it as a question, followed by the "WOW!!" logically leads me to believe you felt the post was mostly or completely laying the blame at one player for the sweep, which it certainly was not. People make statements all the time in the form of a question. I knew exactly what you meant. I just get a little uptight because it seems as if every time one of the Notre Dame posters dares to say anything less than glowing about the team or a player, someone appears to offer a drive by post that indicates it makes one less of a fan if you dare to be critical in the least. If that was not your intention, my apologies.

As for Gerths playing better as a winger than a center, I respectfully disagree with that. I haven't noticed an uptick in his game playing the wing now, versus what he was doing earlier in the year centering a 3rd or (usually) 4th line. Yes he brings some physicality with his game, probably even more than his size would indicate, but we need scoring. As JJfP pointed out, when Lee and Tynan are held off the scoresheet, Notre Dame does not win. Sheahan, Lee, Wuthrich, Larson, and Costello all bring the physical aspect to the game. It is one area where this team is not lacking a bit, certainly not upfront. We could use a little more along the blueline, but as a group our forwards are as physical as any in the CCHA.

 

[Third Family Member]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

No, Irish83, your original post did not say you thought he was the only one. Your post ONLY questioned the comments of another poster, it offered nothing that even came close to an opinion of your own, one way or the other about David's play. It offered nothing approaching an analysis from you that could be used to argue that the player is playing up to his potential. Your post was worded in such a way that it lead more than just me into thinking that you felt an honest opinion from someone could not be expressed if it was not 100% rah rah for old Notre Dame. And we are sorry, but if this is the way you feel, then this forum is definitely not for you because we are going to call a spade a spade, as we see it. That means if that same player comes out this coming weekend and scores a goal or contributes to the play positively and doesn't do something stupid like taking a penalty 23 seconds into a major penalty power play on our part, then he stands a pretty good chance of getting the accolades he deserved. Until then, he's probably going to see that we are questioning his judgments and his play. If you want a rah rah thread, you probably need to start it on your own.

 

[NDgolden]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

I think we all are on this page now.

I also like your analysis of the lines. While you are correct about splitting Lee and Tynan up to spread out scoring, I like them together, too. I remember feeling this way anytime Condra-Deeth-Thang were split up. The thing is, Tynan is not a goal scorer and Lee is not a set up guy. They need each other. Tynan sets it up and Lee finishes. When neither of them registers a point, ND loses quite often. Not that way with Michigan, for example. When their top scorers don't register a point it almost has no bearing on the outcome.

I find it hard to believe that one or two struggling players can bring down a team especially a team as deep in talent as Notre Dame is. In short one of the adjustments Jackson is finally faced with is the tough task of which all top tier programs and coaches have, is keeping the talented player(s) engaged when their roles may involve a less glamorous role than they are use to. Involving at times limited playing time or being a healthy scratch. Last year, a very large talented group of Freshman arrived and performed incredible well. Unfortunately, too much press and attention were awarded to Tynan and Lee even if it was warranted. For a good part of the season their success had some to do with not having to face other teams top lines often being matched up against teams 3-4 lines. They are no longer unknown and this year without a plethora of goal scorers, (Calle Ridderwall where are u) other teams can load up and defend the likes of TJ and Anders.

The other conclusion in question between Tynan and Lee bare out something completely different when you look at the stats more closely. Since the two have played together at ND Lee has over TWICE the amount of first assists to Tynan than TJ has to Lee. Obviously second assists come into play from Tynan handling the puck as much as he does and on the PP. Lee came to ND as a center out of HS and the USHL who during his Sr. yr in HS had 60 assists in 30 games. Lee has had success with a number of ND combinations, starting last year with Guentzel and Ryan last year, in fact that entire line were leading the team in scoring during the first 10 games of the season. Then a change was made and Tynan and Lee became a combination that had obvious success up until the last change which came after a disappointing result in the CCHA play-offs, Jackson again shuffled the lines. Lee was assembled with Sheehan and Maday. This line became the go to line up to the frozen four. This team simply needs to find more scoring combinations to advance deep gain this year along with a consistent goaltender. ND will be far more dangerous if this can be achieved with these two contributing on separate lines. What Lee does create is additional scoring chances and extended offensive play by using his physical skills and ability to protect the puck down low. What ever line Lee plays on will almost always generate the most shots on any given night by a fair margin.

On a side note, a few other observations.

1. ND needs to reduce the amount of "emotional" penalties they take and often by the usual suspects. Credit this year to Johns for huge improvements in this area. TJ take the chip off your shoulder, love your spirit but your going to get hit once in a while and are too valuable to be in the box instead of the PP. Also when you score especially on the road, knock off the antics of incensing the crowd, The Kessel hand to ear in Minnesota or the open arm embrace to Western student section. Go nuts when you get to the frozen four.

2.Give Summerhays an extended run of games and weekends. This guy is talented & competitive, he proved it in the USHL and has earned a chance to a solid run of games.

3. Defense move the puck, keep it simple and realize you will never skate the puck faster than making a pass.

4. This team is really pressing right now, the expectations are higher and flying under the radar is no longer an option. The over-all strength of the CCHA is staggering this year and weight of this schedule the remainder will require new contributors to step forward.

5. Centers will need to contribute more and distribute the puck better. Their goal is to make everyone around them better, and not try and shoulder all of the scoring responsibilities.

6. When this group plays as a disciplined "TEAM" they are incredibly tough to beat. The most recent examples are the BU & Minnesota.

7. When we start hearing less Tynan and less Lee we will know we are on the right track. Provided they are mentioned in the mix!

"Opinions are like onions, they make some people cry."

 

[Jeff_Jackson_for_Pres.]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

If Minnesota scared the crap out of me, then Michigan (scares the crap out of me)².

I was thinking about those "keys to success" you always see prior to televised games and wondered about keys to success for the games this weekend when it comes to league play.

Both teams have 4 guys in double digits in league scoring, and each team has an impact player in league games. Hold him off the scoresheet in the CCHA and they don't win. For Michigan, that player would be freshman Alex Guptill. For ND, it's T.J. Tynan.

Another key to success for ND is to capitalize on the PP. They lead the league at 19.8%. They just need to avoid taking penalties altogether.

When Michigan scores first in league play, they win 67% of the time. When the opposition scores first, Michigan is winless. When ND scores first, they are unbeaten. When the opposition scores first, ND still wins 45% of the time.

When Michigan leads after the first or second period, they are unbeaten, and if the margin of victory is 3 or more goals, they are also unbeaten. When the opposition leads after the first or second period, Michigan is winless. In close games, they win 33% of the time.

When ND leads after the first or second period, ND wins 77% of the time. In blowouts, ND wins 60% of the time. They are actually better in close games, winning 63% of the time if the margin of victory is 1 or 2 goals. When ND trails after the first or second period, they win 29% of the time.

To sum up for Notre Dame: Make sure Tynan registers a point, score first, score on the PP, take a lead into either intermission and keep the game close.

Former University of Oklahoma football coach Bud Wilkinson once said, “We compete not so much against an opponent, but against ourselves. The real test is this: Did I make my best effort on every play?” Well, did you?

 

[streaker]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

If the Irish can contain the GWB line, which has done 80% of their scoring lately, then they have more than a fair chance at beating Michigan. Michigan also has the worst PP % in the CCHA. Mindblowing, actually. Michigan's PK has improved but still sits at around 81%. Michigan is not a good come from behind team, although they did do that to beat MSU in the GLI- which scored first in the game and probably is the exception this season, JJFP.

One other thing- Michigan is allowing a ton of shots this season. Merrill's return has changed the complexion of the defense immensely, but they are still vulnerable to the cycle and to coverage mistakes on rebounds.

 

[Jeff_Jackson_for_Pres.]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

If the Irish can contain the GWB line...

Great. Just like that NCAA game against Bemidji State. "Just stop Matt Read's line and you'll be fine..."

...although they did do that to beat MSU in the GLI- which scored first in the game and probably is the exception this season, JJFP.

I was only counting league games. No OOC or tourney games went into my stats.

 

[streaker]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

I'm only doing you the same favor.... providing meaningless stats that determine tendencies. But feel free to try to stop all four lines Michigan has.

Edit: Okay, so I checked the stats on the top line (with a little help from another Wolverine hockey fan). Since Michigan went to Alaska in December and broke their winless string (at the same time this line was put together) they are 7-0-2. The top line has been involved in 59% of their scoring- 17 goals out of the 29 in nine games. They accounted for an amazing 38 points and were a +30 last weekend alone. I hold to my original thinking- stop them and you'll have a great chance to shut down Michigan's offense especially since they are cranking out a 14% PP.

 

[Jeff_Jackson_for_Pres.]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

Holy crap! Riley Sheahan has a league-ordered suspension for an "illegal" hit?! Did the league look at many factors in this decision? Like, say, the fact that the wrong guy was kicked out of the game? Or the fact that it was a shoulder-on-shoulder hit? Or that the Western guy is out with a SHOULDER injury? NOT a head injury? Since when is interference a suspendable infraction?

Man I cannot wait for the demise of this league.

 

[streaker]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

Holy crap! Riley Sheahan has a league-ordered suspension for an "illegal" hit?! Did the league look at many factors in this decision? Like, say, the fact that the wrong guy was kicked out of the game? Or the fact that it was a shoulder-on-shoulder hit? Or that the Western guy is out with a SHOULDER injury? NOT a head injury? Since when is interference a suspendable infraction?

Man I cannot wait for the demise of this league.

I didn't see the hit... is it available? Also- who were the clowns in stripes this time?
Sounds like the pendulum has swung the other way in the CCHA as far as suspensions.

 

[Jeff_Jackson_for_Pres.]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

I didn't see the hit... is it available? Also- who were the clowns in stripes this time?
Sounds like the pendulum has swung the other way in the CCHA as far as suspensions.

I have a game "tape." I watched the hit several times. Extremely obvious that it's shoulders hitting. It was interference, not CTH (or whatever the league thinks is "illegal").

As Mr. JJfP is wont to say, "C.C.H.A. Can't Comprehend Hockey at All."

 

[Craig P.]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

I didn't see the hit... is it available? Also- who were the clowns in stripes this time?

Sergott was one of them.

Incidentally, wasn't the WMU shoulder injury suffered on a hit along the boards by Johns? I didn't think anybody lost time due to the Sheahan hit.

 

[WeAreNDHockey]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

Keith Sergott and Matt Miller were the refs. Sergott was moved off the series, and Miller did not ref the next night anywhere. Vida and Troester were the linesmen and they too were removed from the series and did not work games the next night, although I don't think Troester works many games anymore outside of South Bend. Walters went down after the hit and stayed down until the whistle. He did not return, nor did he play the next night.

I believe it was Miller who made both the incorrect call on Sheahan (misidentifying him in the process), and the too many men on the ice call (that was really a bench minor for unsportsmanlike conduct when Miller thought players were yelling at him when they were really yelling at a WMU skater who illegally checked Johns) that led to the game tying goal.

 

[streaker]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

Wow. I have been highly critical of CCHA officiating for a long time, but I think they have hit rock bottom. I know they are breaking in fairly new officials but you would think that their desire to get the proper rulings and quick judgement would be balanced.

Michigan had a case two weekends ago where (Wilkins /Langseth) missed two egregious calls that could have resulted in serious injury. One of the hits (which knocked our player out-CTTH) resulted in a LSSU player being suspended for his next game- which didn't do us any good at the time. Same thing occurred in the MSU/Miami series that same weekend. A Miami player was suspended after the fact.

I think that the CCHA is just calling anything close now. I actually saw the best officiated series of the year with (ironically) OSU/Michigan. Aaron /McInchak were the officials. They called some tic-tac stuff, but had control of both games.

It's a thankless job, but it is critical that these officials get it correct.

 

[IrishHockeyFan]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

Officiating is always a crap shoot in this league.

What bothers me the most is that in doling out the suspension to Sheahan the CCHA also should have acknowledged the issues that led to Notre Dame being so vehement in their complaints that night. Fess up to a poorly officiated game, even if you still see something that no one else did when reviewing the clearly shoulder-to-shoulder hit Sheahan delivered that resulted in Costello being ejected. (that odd fact can't be stressed often enough)

I hate calling out the referees when Notre Dame loses -- and I am not shy in pointing that out when others do to defend my "good sportsmanship", I know -- but the way the game was called on Friday had something to do with the outcome. Now a large part of that is how the team responded to it mentally and emotionally, but had the calls made in the game more accurately reflected what was happening on the ice, tempers would not have flared, emotions would have been kept more firmly in check, and I doubt we would have seen Western pot two in 14 seconds.

I wonder what is going to happen in two years. Is Hockey East going to pay to fly an officiating crew out here every other week? Are we going to use "local" officials for non-conference games? Are we going to see perhaps a combining of referee crews perhaps, guys working for both the Big Ten AND hockey east, but remaining in their own regions to call games?

Missing Riley for Friday is huge. I wonder if Lee will not end up back on TJs line for at least a night. I posted over on the UM thread that somehow I think I'd rather see Lee out for a night than Sheahan if we had to be missing one. It's always tricky to think you need one line -- or a couple of individuals -- to carry you, but Tynan and Lee have got to come through. I cannot see them having success either night if those guys are kept off the scoresheet. And if they are someone else is going to have to come up huge.

What is it they say about opportunity...?

 

[Craig P.]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

I wonder what is going to happen in two years. Is Hockey East going to pay to fly an officiating crew out here every other week? Are we going to use "local" officials for non-conference games? Are we going to see perhaps a combining of referee crews perhaps, guys working for both the Big Ten AND hockey east, but remaining in their own regions to call games?

I've wondered about this myself. It seems like most of the CCHA guys could potentially work games for any of the BTHC, NCHC, or WCHA, as all three will have multiple teams in the Michigan-Ohio area. I wonder if the BTHC and NCHC won't aim to poach the "best" for exclusive work in their own conference and leave the rest to the WCHA and possibly spot duty on Hockey East games at ND—but that may be tricky to do depending on how league scheduling works out and how steady the work is that they actually need. It's certainly not unprecedented for guys to work both the ECAC(H(L)) and HEA out east, Scott Hansen being a notable example.

I think the case of Maine would be somewhat instructive, as the travel time (if not cost) to Orono would be almost as much from south of Boston as the travel time to South Bend.

 

[Craig P.]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

For the record, what I think the ref(s) thought happened on the hit by Sheahan was the same thing that got Ian Cole suspended by the NHL: skating across the guy who gets hit and having the primary contact be with the head (shoulder-to-head in this case). We know that isn't what did happen, but it looked enough like it that I can understand one or both officials seeing it that way. The trouble is, if the CCHA is undertaking sufficient video review to determine that the wrong guy was penalized and, necessarily, throwing the official under the bus for making that egregious error, they might as well go all the way and also determine that his judgment call was incorrect and no further punishment to Sheahan is merited.

 

[IrishHockeyFan]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

Both goalies will be playing this weekend. I'm not even venturing a guess as to who starts either night.

 

[streaker]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

So what is the most maddening things about your team?

Just at a cursory, it is strange that most of the roster carries a (-) and yet the team GA average isn't horrible. Winning that many one goal games? Could they use more two way play from the forwards backchecking? How about the median GF average- is it all or nothing with Tynan, Lee and Sheahan? Is the style of play to forecheck, create turnovers and capitalize or draw calls? It must work considering a 20.7% PP.

Would you say that team defense has not been as consistent or the two headed goalie monster been less than spectacular? I mean, beating UMD, Minn, BC, BU... they had to play well, right?

Just trying to gage what to look for considering some of the doom and gloom I have read on other Irish hockey sites.

 

[IrishHockeyFan]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

So what is the most maddening things about your team?

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say it's the goaltending. I bet the others in our little group agree at least partially with my feeling. Slightly above average goaltending and we'd probably be about 2nd in the pairwise. As it is with the netminders as inconsistent as they've been were still solid. Jackson is reluctant to let Summerhays either play his way into the #1 role, or for Johnson to play his way out of it.

We do forecheck well, likely one of the more tenacious teams you'll see this year in that regard. Even in losses we've been a pretty good team along the walls or in the corners. One of the things I like about Lee for instance is his willingness to play hard compete and win battles, even as he struggles to light the lamp. We get pretty good two-way play from the forwards. This is one area where we're really going to miss Sheahan tonight.

Secondary scoring, the penalty kill and the goaltending have all been issues in the games we've lost. Sometimes one, sometimes all three. If we get good goaltending, stay out of the box and get someone like Austin Wuthrich or Jeff Costello to score, we're hard to beat. If Mike Johnson lets in goals on the first shot he faces in a period (something that has happened more times than I care to count this season) and we spend too much time killing penalties, we're easy to beat.

Just trying to gage what to look for considering some of the doom and gloom I have read on other Irish hockey sites.

There are other Irish hockey sites?

 

[Jeff_Jackson_for_Pres.]

Re: Irish Hockey: Straight Inta Compton

Both goalies will be playing this weekend. I'm not even venturing a guess as to who starts either night.

I don't know whether to be , , or

So maybe I'll just