GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

[RStarr]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Snot sure how you can say that the twins can't score goals at this level. at least one of them had at least one point in every game except for the first one against Canada. so obviously they can score. i agree they do take too many penalties sometimes and some of the penalties they take are stupid, but they play hard. i have seen them play a number of times and they are always giving 110%.

Didn’t say they couldn’t score goals, just said they aren’t cranking them in at the level they do in college. At this level it takes more than scoring to be a contributing member of the team anyway....if you're not playing offense, you're playing defense. They could've at least pretended.

Also, I said nothing about penalties. I’m more concerned with the team taking 4+ too many men penalties than the tLams sitting in the box of checking, or roughing or high sticking.

 

[DC78-82]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

She was on the bench. I watched the game and the problem was the team in front of Schaus...not Schaus.

I only saw half the game, but I'd agree the problem was not Shaus, nor the people in front of her, because the people that should have been in front of her were in the penalty box

 

[binnyrus]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Is there any place to get a recap or box from the 3rd place game??

 

[still amazed]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Finnish site for the 4 nations has all of the links to every game sheet, shot charts, time on ice, etc


http://www.finhockey.fi/maajoukkuee...si_2009-2010/neljan_maan_turnaus_2-8_11_2009/

 

[leafsfan]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Specifically I thought the Lams played like crap. It’s obvious that they can't score goals at this level like they can in college/prep. I'd rather have someone with some forechecking abilities.

not sure how you can say that the twins can't score goals at this level. at least one of them had at least one point in every game except for the first one against Canada. so obviously they can score. i agree they do take too many penalties sometimes and some of the penalties they take are stupid, but they play hard. i have seen them play a number of times and they are always giving 110%.[/QUOTE]

All together now "Oh Canada, our home and native land".........

 

[siglet]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

not sure how you can say that the twins can't score goals at this level. at least one of them had at least one point in every game except for the first one against Canada. so obviously they can score. i agree they do take too many penalties sometimes and some of the penalties they take are stupid, but they play hard. i have seen them play a number of times and they are always giving 110%.

All together now "Oh Canada, our home and native land".........[/QUOTE]

funny that you say that, because they are dual citizens and could have been playing for canada

 

[leafsfan]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

All together now "Oh Canada, our home and native land".........

funny that you say that, because they are dual citizens and could have been playing for canada[/QUOTE]


Just having a little fun, don't take this tournament to seriously, I think MJ is still trying to figure out who can/can't play at this level. The cream will rise.

 

[ARM]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Is the "Quote" feature that hard to use?

Regarding the Lams not scoring at the same rate in international play as in college, who does?

As for Schaus versus Vetter ... Schaus may be a fine goalie. There may have been a bunch of goals that weren't her fault. But after years of watching Vetter save shot after shot that wouldn't have been her fault had it gone into the net, I very much hope that she gets the big starts come February.

 

[Angus]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

As for Schaus versus Vetter ... Schaus may be a fine goalie. There may have been a bunch of goals that weren't her fault. But after years of watching Vetter save shot after shot that wouldn't have been her fault had it gone into the net, I very much hope that she gets the big starts come February.

More to the point--unlike Schaus, Vetter has three national championships, a couple of international gold medals, a Kazmaier trophy, and the "Sportswoman Of The Year" award.

I'd say she's paid her dues.

 

[xwildfan]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

I don't think it was a bad idea using Schaus in the finals against Canada. Johnson knows that 99.9% of the typical US sports fan doesn't know or care about who wins the Four Nations. But he does know that a few more will pay attention to the Olympics. If something happens to Vetter and she can't play in an important Olympic game, at least Schaus has the experience of the championship game at Four Nations against the most likely opponent they will see in the Olympic Gold Medal game. This assumes that Finland, Sweden or others don't trip up the favorites. I don't think there is any doubt that Vetter will play in all the meaningful Olympic games. But injuries do happen; a couple years ago at the U18 Worlds, Grogan had to play in all the games because the other very capable tender was injured.

 

[LG4]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

I don't think it was a bad idea using Schaus in the finals against Canada. Johnson knows that 99.9% of the typical US sports fan doesn't know or care about who wins the Four Nations. But he does know that a few more will pay attention to the Olympics. If something happens to Vetter and she can't play in an important Olympic game, at least Schaus has the experience of the championship game at Four Nations against the most likely opponent they will see in the Olympic Gold Medal game. This assumes that Finland, Sweden or others don't trip up the favorites. I don't think there is any doubt that Vetter will play in all the meaningful Olympic games. But injuries do happen; a couple years ago at the U18 Worlds, Grogan had to play in all the games because the other very capable tender was injured.

Grest post. I may be Canadian but I don't take too much stock in this win either. Keeping your eyes on the real prize does mean giving your all your players the best chance to be prepared . The experience of a championship game only unfortunately ...helps the Americans.

 

[DC78-82]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

I don't think it was a bad idea using Schaus in the finals against Canada. Johnson knows that 99.9% of the typical US sports fan doesn't know or care about who wins the Four Nations. But he does know that a few more will pay attention to the Olympics. If something happens to Vetter and she can't play in an important Olympic game, at least Schaus has the experience of the championship game at Four Nations against the most likely opponent they will see in the Olympic Gold Medal game. This assumes that Finland, Sweden or others don't trip up the favorites. I don't think there is any doubt that Vetter will play in all the meaningful Olympic games. But injuries do happen; a couple years ago at the U18 Worlds, Grogan had to play in all the games because the other very capable tender was injured.

Did I miss the post where it was decided that Shaus' play lost the game for USA? I only saw the 3rd period, but IIRC, USA played most of it shorthanded and in their own end. and prior to the penalty parade, USA was in the game. Had the USA played the game like they had the day before, what conversation might we be having? About how fortunate we are to have two stellar goalies?

 

[OnMAA]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Grest post. I may be Canadian but I don't take too much stock in this win either. Keeping your eyes on the real prize does mean giving your all your players the best chance to be prepared . The experience of a championship game only unfortunately ...helps the Americans.

Always interesting to notice the volume of posts in a win vs. loss situation.

The Canucks have been struggling in recent years, and here have been various lengthy threads on the Ontario Board, calling for changes and discussions about what is wrong with the program. We win four nations, and only three, yes count them three, posts about it.

Same on this board. Yanks lose one game, and the "What is wrong" crowd comes out of the woodwork. As a Canuck, cheer for the maple leaf, and I am encouraged by the 4 Nations win, but, and this is a big but, not convinced the canuck program has turned the corner yet.

Just remember that in 1998, Canucks won everthing pre-Olympics and lost the final to the Yanks . The roles were reversed in 2002.

One win or loss at this stage means little. How you perform as a team in February is the only thing that most will remember down the road.

 

[ARM]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Did I miss the post where it was decided that Shaus' play lost the game for USA?

Hockey is a team game, and no single player wins or loses a game.

About how fortunate we are to have two stellar goalies?

I also don't think it is a given that we assume Schaus is at the same level as Vetter. Plain and simple, her body of work is not of the same caliber. This isn't the fault of Schaus, because she clearly hasn't had the same opportunities. But in addition to being the most accomplished goalie in the NCAA era (having three separate seasons allowing a single goal in the entire tournament is pretty impressive), Jessie Vetter's performance stands out for the USA in international competition. While Schaus does not deserve fault for the most recent loss, neither does she gain credit for all the wins that Vetter has piled up over the years.

 

[vid]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Hockey is a team game, and no single player wins or loses a game.

I also don't think it is a given that we assume Schaus is at the same level as Vetter. Plain and simple, her body of work is not of the same caliber. This isn't the fault of Schaus, because she clearly hasn't had the same opportunities. But in addition to being the most accomplished goalie in the NCAA era (having three separate seasons allowing a single goal in the entire tournament is pretty impressive), Jessie Vetter's performance stands out for the USA in international competition. While Schaus does not deserve fault for the most recent loss, neither does she gain credit for all the wins that Vetter has piled up over the years.

Recent USA Team History
Quest Tour Oct. 16 USA 2 Canada 5 Vetter in net
Four Nations Nov 7 USA 1 Canada 5 Schaus in net

 

[rinkrat890890]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Recent USA Team History
Quest Tour Oct. 16 USA 2 Canada 5 Vetter in net
Four Nations Nov 7 USA 1 Canada 5 Schaus in net

Yeah 5-1 however 3 pp goals one being 5 on 3. Not a good game to judge Schaus.

 

[vid]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Yeah 5-1 however 3 pp goals one being 5 on 3. Not a good game to judge Schaus.

I agree. Both goalies are top goalies and exciting to watch.

Also:

Quest Tour Oct. 16 USA 2 Canada 5 Vetter in net
Power Play:USA 1-9; CAN 2-5

Four Nations Nov 7 USA 1 Canada 5 Schaus in net
Power Play:USA 0-4; CAN 3-10

 

[rinkrat890890]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

I agree. Both goalies are top goalies and exciting to watch.

Also:

Quest Tour Oct. 16 USA 2 Canada 5 Vetter in net
Power Play:USA 1-9; CAN 2-5

Four Nations Nov 7 USA 1 Canada 5 Schaus in net
Power Play:USA 0-4; CAN 3-10

Yes they are! We're lucky to have them in net, I just wish they'd give McLaughlin a game or two. I bet she'd do fine.

 

[ARM]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

Recent USA Team History
Quest Tour Oct. 16 USA 2 Canada 5 Vetter in net
Four Nations Nov 7 USA 1 Canada 5 Schaus in net

The Oct. 16th game was an exhibition game, so I'm not sure why you'd select that over Vetter's most recent performance versus Canada. All I'm saying is that J.V. has proven to be a money performer in the big games like few others, maybe no others in net. I believe Wisconsin played with more confidence with the knowledge that she was back there. And I hope that come crunch time in February, we see that same confidence out of the skaters in Red, White, and Blue.

 

[Angus]

Re: GO FOR GOLD - USA/Can - 2009 Four Nations Final

While I really don't have any quarrel with what anybody else is saying about the game last Saturday, what bothered me about the benching of Vetter in the gold medal gamme was that it gave me flashbacks to Salt Lake City--Ben Smith's boneheaded insistence that Tueting and DeCosta were interchangable, culminating in his benching of Tueting in the gold medal game.

And yeah, I am annoyed that the U.S. lost, even if it was just the 4 Nations Cup. But I suppose I'd really be sweating if the Canadians had managed to beat Vetter.