Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

[5mn_Major]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

The US is ahead of China in innovation on solar, they can't produce it with the regs in place as cheaply as China. Its all about costs and demand

Couldn't be that the average worker earns about $3 an hour.

If only our environmental standards were as low as Communist China's...

It seems there's a certain 'charm' about living in 3rd world conditions.

 

[Tundra]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Solyndra and Evergreen in particular suffered because they pursued unusual technologies whose competitiveness depended on their using less polysilicon, the main material for solar panels. That has become less important because polysilicon prices have tumbled more than 80 percent in the last three years as output has caught up with demand.

Solyndra (cylinder) reads like a fake start up company created just for solar mania IPO. And Evergreen (string) lost money for a long time (And couldn't raise more money). Not sure why government is guaranteeing a loan for a particular company when these type of start-up should be funded via venture capital and IPO (Like Evergreen). risk vs reward and the whole point of lower capital gains tax rate was formation of capital for these type of start-ups.

http://www.solyndra.com/about-us/timeline/

2005 Founded by Dr. Christian Gronet

2007 Began production in Fab 1
2008 Commenced commercial solar panel shipments
Opened office in Germany
2009 Largest single Solyndra installation in U.S. 529kW
Received $535 million DOE loan guarantee for construction of Fab 2
Groundbreaking for Fab 2 with Vice President Biden, Energy Secretary Chu, and Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger
Reached $100 million in annual revenues

http://evergreensolar.com/en/invest/

Loss in millions 2010 2009 2008 2007 2006
-465.44 -244.56 -237.05 -18.77 -28.01

 

[Priceless]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Not sure why government is guaranteeing a loan for a particular company when these type of start-up should be funded via venture capital and IPO (Like Evergreen). risk vs reward and the whole point of lower capital gains tax rate was formation of capital for these type of start-ups.

Are you sure why we're giving billions to oil companies when they're enjoying record profits? Can you explain that one?

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Are you sure why we're giving billions to oil companies when they're enjoying record profits? Can you explain that one?

Who knows. But I'll bet as a whole they invest more in green tech as a percentage of their budget than the US.

 

[Tundra]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Are you sure why we're giving billions to oil companies when they're enjoying record profits? Can you explain that one?

Oil PAC and corrupt congress and President Obama.

we guarantee housing (Fannie/Freddie), banks (MBS, TARP holdings) and sometimes make loans to established companies (GM) but start-up company with no "systemic risk".

How about we just guarantee all the new loans that business can't borrow from banks? that might be money better wasted than direct stimulus. And we get to balance the budget by keeping these liability off book.

 

[Tundra]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Solyndra (cylinder) reads like a fake start up company created just for solar mania IPO.

Fed read my memo?

http://news.yahoo.com/feds-execute-search-warrants-calif-solar-firm-154313839.html

FBI agents executed search warrants on Thursday at the headquarters of California solar panel manufacturer Solyndra, which received more than $500 million in federal loan guarantees before filing for bankruptcy last week.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

This is beyond stupid. Way, way, way, way beyond stupid.

www.startribune.com/business/172584031.html

I call bullsh*t on the $400 per year savings. Complete, absolute, and utter bullsh*t. I have a five-bed 2,200 sqft house.

I calculated my baseline gas use by taking the average usage in 2011 and 2012 during the months of June, July, August, and September. This came out to be 13.25 therms/month. I subtracted the baseline from all months (excluding any months that were below the average).

I then calculated the average cost per therm from April 2011 through September 2012 by dividing my total cost by therms used. This came out to be about $0.96/therm. I then multiplied the $0.96/therm by the difference between monthly usage and the baseline. I added this up to get my "total estimated heating cost". This came out to be just over $475 between April 2011 and September 2012 (inclusive). How am I going to save $400 per year when I'm spending about $317 per year?

Quick math (accounting for about 20% waste being reduced to 10% waste), I'm going to save about $23.47 PER YEAR. If the average additional cost is $1,500, that's going to take 64 years to pay back. Un-f*king-believable. The only way I'm going to hit $400 a year in savings is if I keep my windows open all winter.

Feel free to check my math:

Month.....Cost.....Therms
4/2011…..$60.36…..67
5/2011…..$52.14…..58
6/2011…..$21.17…..14
7/2011…..$21.29…..14
8/2011…..$19.09…..11
9/2011…..$19.60…..12
10/2011…..$19.26…..12
11/2011…..$35.00…..34
12/2011…..$72.60…..84
1/2012…..$89.09…..108
2/2012…..$86.55…..108
3/2012…..$70.08…..86
4/2012…..$33.30…..38
5/2012…..$24.72…..27
6/2012…..$18.01…..14
7/2012…..$19.08…..15
8/2012…..$17.73…..12
9/2012…..$19.07…..14

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

This came out to be just over $475 between April 2011 and September 2012 (inclusive). How am I going to save $400 per year when I'm spending about $317 per year?

Clearly I am missing something because how do you heat your home for $317 per year? Granted my house is nearly double your size, but our natural gas bill goes up I bet $180+ per month November through February and the heat is going to be on at the very least in spurts in October, March and April. And although this article is from 2007: Heating an Apartment or Home in Minneapolis and St. Paul

Most homes in Minneapolis and St. Paul are heated by natural gas. Heating costs are high because the winters here are cold and long, somewhat offset by slightly lower than average natural gas prices. But still, average annual heating bills are the third highest out of every metro area in the continental USA, averaging $1,475.11 in 2007.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Honest to God. That's the actual data taken directly from Xcel's website. I keep it about 70-73 degrees in the winter. I let it coast down to 64 during the night and day but I can't recall any time I've ever gotten below 66 when I woke up in the morning. I know the insulation on my house is excellent. During the stretches where we have 100-degree days outside, my house would rarely get above 80 degrees at any point.

I'd post my public record housing info to confirm the size, but I really don't feel like sharing my address on the intarwebs.

 

[Foxton]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Honest to God. That's the actual data taken directly from Xcel's website. I keep it about 70-73 degrees in the winter. I let it coast down to 64 during the night and day but I can't recall any time I've ever gotten below 66 when I woke up in the morning. I know the insulation on my house is excellent. During the stretches where we have 100-degree days outside, my house would rarely get above 80 degrees at any point.

I'd post my public record housing info to confirm the size, but I really don't feel like sharing my address on the intarwebs.

Quick question, do you already have a newer furnace?

I pay more than what you're reporting and I live in one of these. Keeping the temp around 64 except in the morning from 5-7 and in the afternoon 5-9 when it's up to 68. (windows insulated and thermal curtains)

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

I believed your numbers, just jealous.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Quick question, do you already have a newer furnace?

I pay more than what you're reporting and I live in one of these. Keeping the temp around 64 except in the morning from 5-7 and in the afternoon 5-9 when it's up to 68. (windows insulated and thermal curtains)

Just pulled off the front cover. Rated at 81%. It's a Lennox Diplomat installed 9/1994.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

I believed your numbers, just jealous.

I guess I'm a bit stunned to hear how lucky I seem to be with this house... The only thing I can think of is that the insulation throughout the house is preposterously good. But then again, I also have a vaulted ceiling in the kitchen, dining room, and living room. So I'm a bit mystified myself now...

 

[LynahFan]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

I guess I'm a bit stunned to hear how lucky I seem to be with this house... The only thing I can think of is that the insulation throughout the house is preposterously good. But then again, I also have a vaulted ceiling in the kitchen, dining room, and living room. So I'm a bit mystified myself now...

What's your electric bill? Perhaps you should check to see if your toaster is permanently turned on!

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

What's your electric bill? Perhaps you should check to see if your toaster is permanently turned on!

haha, that's another thought that crossed my mind. But there's only two people in my house. I try to be energy conscious although I leave the fan on the furnace on at all times. During the non-A/C months, it averages about $40-$50 per month. Since April 2011 through September 2012, my average combined gas and electricity bill is $109.48.



(also, I don't own a toaster )

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Another possibility is that your meter isn't reading accurately. That can cut both ways, but obviously in your case if anything it's reading lower. Of course in your situation I'm not sure you'd want to ask the utility to check the accuracy.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

Maybe, maybe not. They inspect the meters from time to time to make sure they are accurate. These are extremely simple instruments if you've ever seen the inside of a meter. Almost entirely mechanical.

I sure as hell am not going to say anything. But they DO reserve the right to adjust, higher or lower, up to the previous six months of bills if they find the meter is 2% off (up to six months of bills).

 

[Kepler]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

I sure as hell am not going to say anything. But they DO reserve the right to adjust, higher or lower, up to the previous six months of bills if they find the meter is 2% off (up to six months of bills).

Never discount the possibility of incompetence.

My current provider (PEPCO) just can't seem to get the hang of the bi-monthly alternating inspection / adjustment cycle I've seen in every other place I've lived. As a result, not only do their estimates seem bizarre (I have tracked monthly actuals for 7 years and they follow a completely predictable "double hump" peaking in August and January, but the estimates are never year over and need constant readjusting) but they pile up for months and then burst into either a ridiculously large payment or a 1-2 month payment holiday.

The meter however keeps on humming away reporting correctly.

I think they use palm readers. Or the cats are scaring them.

 

[walrus]

Re: Global Warming -- 4th Edition: Carbonated Planet.

haha, that's another thought that crossed my mind. But there's only two people in my house. I try to be energy conscious although I leave the fan on the furnace on at all times. During the non-A/C months, it averages about $40-$50 per month. Since April 2011 through September 2012, my average combined gas and electricity bill is $109.48.



(also, I don't own a toaster )

You must have cheap electrical rates
, My electric bill alone is more than that

 

[goldy_331]

You must have cheap electrical rates
, My electric bill alone is more than that

We do. One of my colleagues was at a national conference earlier this week presenting a case study of an energy model study we did. I watched her practice run and recommended she note how cheap our power is or the numbers would make no sense to people from out east or California.