GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

[IrishHockeyFan]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

Having been there for the last couple years, in my observation, the Beanpot still means a TON to the BU, BC, and NU fanbases. Harvard fans don't show up. They've been playing it for 52 years straight with the same four teams and it hasn't become stale. It's a different dynamic, though, because all four schools are within minutes of the Garden. It's much easier for those students to show up in big numbers.

Oh it certainly means a lot to the participating schools and their fans. Reading your post I think I was a little unclear in mine. I meant that fans of BU, BC, NU and Harvard (or maybe not Harvard, based on your observations) all love this thing and pay attention passionately, but fans of the rest of college hockey see it as nothing more or less than just 2 more games in the middle of the season.

 

[streaker]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

CC has had issues in the third period at times this year. They seem to lack some conditioning, or they sit back too much. Or both.

Prophetic after tonight. What a game- score four PPG's and lose.

 

[bigmrg74]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

I have often wondered if a 'thinking outside the box' solution, such as moving the tournament to Van Andel in Grand Rapids for a few years to spark a new fanbase would be a good move for freshening up the tournament. I worry that more than 30 years in the same city with the same arena with 3/4 of the teams the same is a cause of tournament fatigue.

I am all for keeping the three regular participants, as I do believe in tradition. But tradition without innovation is a recipe for a stagnant event. And a stagnant event isn't going to drive extra fans into the seats. Also, with more than half of college hockey now participating in games this week (non-con series and 7 holiday tournaments), it is harder to draw a big name fourth team because of the options out there.

The problem with moving it to Grand Rapids is that Van Andel only holds 12,000+ fans. If the GLI drew 13,000+ yesterday and drew a larger crowd for tonight, then it wouldn't make sense to move to a smaller arena. If Van Andel held 15,000, it would be a slam dunk.

A benefit to Grand Rapids is that it opens things up to a different fan base. Detroit is 2.5 hours away, Ann Arbor is 2, and East Lansing is a little more than an hour. This is easily a drivable distance by fans. However, you also open the game up to the Chicago Alums, since Chicago to Grand Rapids is a 3 hour drive versus a 5 hour drive to Detroit. Van Andel has also hosted NCAA Regionals before.

Advertisement is about as good as you are going to get for college hockey. It has been mentioned on every Redwings telecast for the last 1-1.5 months, which covers most of the potential target audience.

Not suggesting it, just throwing it as an idea out there that there are ways to freshen the tournament.
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If Tech can come out and play today with the intensity they played with last night, then hopefully the losing streak ends today. 12 games is long enough. GO HUSKIES!!!

It wouldn't hurt to try it at the Van Andel for 2 or 3 years. Might not hurt to see if Ferris and Western Michigan would want to have a tilt there as well if they could get a weekend date for the GLI there at the VA.

 

[MaizeRage]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

A benefit to Grand Rapids is that it opens things up to a different fan base. Detroit is 2.5 hours away, Ann Arbor is 2, and East Lansing is a little more than an hour. This is easily a drivable distance by fans.

No. I'm willing to bet at least 75% of the people there were Michigan fans from the SE Michigan area that wouldn't be willing to make the trip to Grand Rapids. Arena size wouldn't be an issue because the tournament would be very lucky if they drew 5000 people.

 

[bigmrg74]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

No. I'm willing to bet at least 75% of the people there were Michigan fans from the SE Michigan area that wouldn't be willing to make the trip to Grand Rapids. Arena size wouldn't be an issue because the tournament would be very lucky if they drew 5000 people.

I think it would be a wash with the number the SE Michigan Wolverines you would lose when you factor in the number of West Michigan Wolverines you would have showing up, along with those coming in from Chicago as well. GR is a pretty nice city to be in, and doesn't have that reputation of were you might get stabbed, shot, raped and rob that Detroit has. Not that one would really expect to see that happen around the Joe mind you, but there is that attitude out there among those that have never set foot in Detroit.

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

My UM friend and I took a guess and agreed that attendance for the third place game looked like 5,000-6,000. I'd say there were maybe 12,000 for the title game, and indeed 75% of them were Michigan fans (the real ones and the clueless Walmart variety who seemed to cluster in our section )

At any rate, the tourney isn't moving. It's not really worth discussing.

 

[MaizeRage]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

I think it would be a wash with the number the SE Michigan Wolverines you would lose when you factor in the number of West Michigan Wolverines you would have showing up, along with those coming in from Chicago as well.

Not even close. Over half the state's population is in the metro Detroit area, and that area of the state is much more pro-UofM, and much more interested in hockey in general than the other side of the state. Chicago is at least 3 hours from Grand Rapids, making it pretty much a non-factor. They'd be silly to move the tournament, and if they did, I imagine it would only last a year.

 

[kdilks]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

The kind of crowds that a switch to the west side of the state would bring in would be more fitting for K-Wings stadium than Van Andel.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

I still dont understand why the Red Wings are the team stuck in a crappy old arena...they actually win games, why build new stadiums for the Tigers and Lions when the Red Wings are the championship caliber team...I think that would help the GLI.

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

I still dont understand why the Red Wings are the team stuck in a crappy old arena...they actually win games, why build new stadiums for the Tigers and Lions when the Red Wings are the championship caliber team...I think that would help the GLI.

The Tigers legitimately deserved a new ballpark. Compared to other facilities that had opened up in the early-to-mid 90s, Tiger Stadium was a dump in need of major renovation or replacement.

In the case of the Lions, it mostly had to do with politics. The City of Detroit, having lost the Lions to the suburbs in the mid-70s and the Pistons shortly thereafter, really wanted the Lions back downtown. They came up with a plan to build Ford Field and CoPa together in the Grand Circus Park area, with the hope that it would spark economic growth and revitalize that part of downtown (which it has, to some extent).

At the time most of those plans were formulated, JLA was still a servicable 20 year-old building.

 

[Arwen22266]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

The Tigers legitimately deserved a new ballpark. Compared to other facilities that had opened up in the early-to-mid 90s, Tiger Stadium was a dump in need of major renovation or replacement.

Considering its history, Tiger Stadium deserved to be renovated rather than replaced, which could have happened for about 1/10th the cost of building Comerica Park.

 

[MTUHatTrick84]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

Considering its history, Tiger Stadium deserved to be renovated rather than replaced, which could have happened for about 1/10th the cost of building Comerica Park.

This is likely true. However, if they had renovated Tiger Stadium, Illitch would not have been able to install as many revenue-generating suites and club seats. How would have have found a way to put in high-price seating and add all those extra little amenities to the park? It would not have been worth his while to stay in that stadium, regardless of who is actually paying for a renovation or paying for a new stadium. And we all know, the stadium is all about making the owners happy.

I was driving around Detroit late this past October and came across the corner of Michigan and Trumbull. All that remains is a chain-link fence, part of a gate to the old stadium, and an basepath/pitchers mound. I just started at it for a while, and realized that much like the city of Detroit, there is basically nothing left of the history, except an empty and unused lot.

Somehow, Fenway Park and Wrigley do just fine. But even the Yankees found a need to replace to House the Ruth Built.
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The Redwings deserve a new arena. The Joe, for its great sightlines, is a pit on the shores of the river. The problem is that the city is completely broke, lacks any form of leadership, is waiting for the Pistons to be sold so that they can build a combination arena for the Pistons/Redwings downtown, especially if Illitch buys the Pistons. And then, since they have all four teams downtown, will add a tax to the citizens of all the counties in the Metro area (regional tax, just like Cobo) to pay for the downtown arena, even when the people in the suburbs do not recieve an economic benefit to the stadium they payed for and Oakland County loses revenue because of the loss of the Pistons.

 

[owslachief]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

<blink>Warning: Baseball conversation follows</blink>

 

[streaker]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

Wherever the Wings build a new arena (Foxtown etc.) or renovate the Joe, the GLI will be there. End of discussion. This thing is basically owned by Olympia Entertainment (i.e. Illitch). The CCHA championships are convenient to the CCHA HQ and they too have a sweetheart deal with Olympia Entertainment. Attendance at ~14,000 isn't all that bad.

 

[alfablue]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

Interesting change in discussion.

One thing very clear now, JLA is all about the Pistons right now-if that falls, then it will be 100 hockey. But I see that working out AND no new local taxes, that will stay with the hotels and restaurants. BTW both comerica and ff were done with a broke city and broken leadership so it will be done.

As for the gli. Well I've not been around to watch for 20 years now....

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

This is likely true. However, if they had renovated Tiger Stadium, Illitch would not have been able to install as many revenue-generating suites and club seats. How would have have found a way to put in high-price seating and add all those extra little amenities to the park? It would not have been worth his while to stay in that stadium, regardless of who is actually paying for a renovation or paying for a new stadium. And we all know, the stadium is all about making the owners happy.

I was driving around Detroit late this past October and came across the corner of Michigan and Trumbull. All that remains is a chain-link fence, part of a gate to the old stadium, and an basepath/pitchers mound. I just started at it for a while, and realized that much like the city of Detroit, there is basically nothing left of the history, except an empty and unused lot.

Somehow, Fenway Park and Wrigley do just fine. But even the Yankees found a need to replace to House the Ruth Built.
----

The Redwings deserve a new arena. The Joe, for its great sightlines, is a pit on the shores of the river. The problem is that the city is completely broke, lacks any form of leadership, is waiting for the Pistons to be sold so that they can build a combination arena for the Pistons/Redwings downtown, especially if Illitch buys the Pistons. And then, since they have all four teams downtown, will add a tax to the citizens of all the counties in the Metro area (regional tax, just like Cobo) to pay for the downtown arena, even when the people in the suburbs do not recieve an economic benefit to the stadium they payed for and Oakland County loses revenue because of the loss of the Pistons.

The yankees built a new stadium because capital expenses on the new stadium was a loophole in the mlb luxury tax.

 

[guinness]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

The G.L.I. continues to lose a bit of its luster...

Only 13,418 for the attendance.

Tonight, I would guess ~ 17k for the title game...Probably not a sellout...

I am curious to the items mentioned about enhancing the G.L.I. by Tech a week ago.
It is in need of a bit of refreshening at this point.
I miss them televising the whole tournament, but obviously that started the negative attendance trend. I wish they would show both 2nd day games though, it would not hurt attendance for the third place as nobody shows up to that one anyway.

As for the game today, I think State will show up and play today.
I was surprised how they came back on CC in the third period yesterday.

Tech really needs Brett Olson back. I sure hope he is able to play against St. Cloud....

They screwed up the GLI when they moved it from the weekend dates. Not nearly as many people want to watch college hockey in the middle of the week, especially since it's typically a UM/MSU final, and they are other games with the those teams at the JLA other times of the year. There isn't much to get excited about, Tech is Tech, and the 4th team is either an east coast school or other WCHA'er, not much to draw fans from either, but I think the date change really killed things.

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

I don't think they really have a choice on the dates. They usually don't want it to start until the 27th, and the Red Wings need the arena back by the 31st. That leaves the 27th to the 30th as your four-day window, whatever days of the week those dates happen to fall on in any given year.

 

[JW Tigers]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

Prophetic after tonight. What a game- score four PPG's and lose.

I hate that I was right.

Overall I am fairly happy with the showing for CC, but it is tough to swallow blowing a lead with 5 minutes left and losing.

Next time CC plays in the GLI, I definitely want to head out to Detroit for it. This year, the finances just weren't there. I think it would be a fun tournament to see.

 

[streaker]

Re: GLI 2010 - Or - Battle of the Endangered Coaches

I hate that I was right.

Overall I am fairly happy with the showing for CC, but it is tough to swallow blowing a lead with 5 minutes left and losing.

Next time CC plays in the GLI, I definitely want to head out to Detroit for it. This year, the finances just weren't there. I think it would be a fun tournament to see.

Well, the tying goal on the PP was due to a weak penalty, (not that CC didn't get some weak PP's either) and the GWG was a fluke from the corner. They did just about everything to re-tie it. This game exposed Michigan's biggest weakness: special teams. Losing Jaden Shwartz for CC and Merrill for Michigan was a wash, but Michigan really missed him and Brown's physical presence.

CC fans are always welcome at the GLI. Met a bunch back in 2005 at the regional in GR and had a good time (until we blew that lead and lost...)