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Fire Mike Eaves?

oldtyme25 said:
McCabe came from the NTDP not straight from WIAA, that was the point.
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Not all kids can go right from MNHS hockey to D1 either. I agree with you, some time playing Juniors is in the best interest of most kids. But it will be hard to not offer any of those kids until after they have succeeded in juniors and still get the majority of the good ones. There is risk in recruiting and you cannot mitigate it all.
 
Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

oldtyme25 said:
That's where you are wrong....Eaves should make an all out effort to get early commitments from Wisconsin BLUE CHIPPERS, but stop offering any WIAA players anything until they play AND SUCCEED in the USHL!

If you look at the track records of the players in Juniors, I would bet Eaves would not have offered scholarships to any of the players mentioned earlier, while a player like Navin would actually have the chance to develop in junior hockey instead of looking lost at the NCAA pace of play after coming directly from WIAA hockey.
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I agree 100%.

The Navin thing just mystified me when he brought him in when he did. Of course, he could have lit up the USHL, but still end up on the pine and/or miscast on the 4th line like Turnbull and Gorowsky most of their careers.

WI needs more kids from Canada on the roster. The talent pool size difference between WI and Canada almost incomprehensible.
 
Timothy A said:
I agree 100%.

The Navin thing just mystified me when he brought him in when he did. Of course, he could have lit up the USHL, but still end up on the pine and/or miscast on the 4th line like Turnbull and Gorowsky most of their careers.

WI needs more kids from Canada on the roster. The talent pool size difference between WI and Canada almost incomprehensible.
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That's like comparing the talent pool size of table tennis players between Wisconsin and China. You don't think Eaves is trying to land top recruits in Canada?

I don't get why some people act like there are lines of kids up in Canada waiting to come here to play hockey. In case no one has noticed, the CHL has stepped up efforts to retain the best of those kids, and to nab our best down here.

I'm not saying don't recruit in Canada, but to plan sustained success on it is a mistake.
 
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Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

JDUBBS1280 said:
Youare going to miss out on lots of talent if you wait that long to offer some kids. Every program has misses. Gophers have had their fair share too. Bigger problem is bringing in guys who aren't ready directly from high school. For instance, Navin has talent, but I'm sure he would have benefited from some time in the USHL before coming in.
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Once again I have to disagree with you JDUBBS!

The last WIAA player to come out of the state of Wisconsin who had an impact on the Badger hockey program was Craig Smith. If I recall correctly, he was not extended a scholarship offer until he was playing AND having success at Waterloo of the USHL (where he played 3 seasons). The same is true for Keegan Meuer.

If you look at the rest of the WIAA Wisconsin players who were offered before Juniors, do you really think an scholarship offer would have been made to any of these players (other than Dahl) if they went off of the success they had in the USHL. Jefferson Dahl's production would have gotten him a ride somewhere, but most likely not a Wisconsin level school.

We are supposed to be an elite program, thus we should be getting elite talent!
 
oldtyme25 said:
Once again I have to disagree with you JDUBBS!

The last WIAA player to come out of the state of Wisconsin who had an impact on the Badger hockey program was Craig Smith. If I recall correctly, he was not extended a scholarship offer until he was playing AND having success at Waterloo of the USHL (where he played 3 seasons). The same is true for Keegan Meuer.

If you look at the rest of the WIAA Wisconsin players who were offered before Juniors, do you really think an scholarship offer would have been made to any of these players (other than Dahl) if they went off of the success they had in the USHL. Jefferson Dahl's production would have gotten him a ride somewhere, but most likely not a Wisconsin level school.

We are supposed to be an elite program, thus we should be getting elite talent!
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First off, no program is entitled to be an elite program. And if there were such a thing, UW wouldn't be in the Top 5 of that list. Every program struggles at points in their history. Minnesota just went thru it and Michigan was virtually irrelevant for a few decades. So please, spare us the sense of entitlement.

As for your point on WIAA players, you bring up some valid points. History certainly seems to support your theory. But my question is, how can you expect to have sustained success in a sport when you rely on winning recruits from places where it's an uphill battle?

Again, not saying don't recruit in Canada, but you're fighting the CHL for those kids. In Minnesota you are fighting other MN schools. Penn State just added a D1 program. Before long, getting kids out of PA will be a bigger battle than it already is. What if Illinois adds a program soon?

In every other sport the mantra is that getting the best in-stste guys is a must. IMO, if the Badgers want to see the kind of sustained success that Michigan, Boston College, etc.. has had recently, they need to continue to grow the sport locally and land all the top in-state guys.

That means, if a kid has loads of potential and is playing in WIAA, you can't always wait to offer him. Though I wouldn't bring many straight in.
 
Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

He's signing so many WI kids who have proved basically nothing other than they can score or play against on other kids from WI, big deal. Spend less time recruiting marginal kids from WI and more time recruiting kids from Canada. Recruit the few blue chippahs heavy, then get out of state.
 
Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

You can't blame Eaves for losing Will Butcher. His family had strong ties to the DU coaching staff.

The hockey world is tiny and odds are high that elite players are the sons of ex-elite players. Expecting geographic borders to contain recruits is ridiculous.

That being said, DU has seven Colorado players on the roster, including 5 of the top 10 scorers on the team. Colorado youth hockey is producing results and Wisconsin may not be is due to a couple of factors. Larger population base, more disposable income, NHL youth programs set up by the Avs, almost all the rinks have elite programs and 99% the elite kids play USHL hockey instead of high school hockey.
 
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Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

There's too many inaccuracies on recruits in this thread to even begin to correct. My head wants to explode reading through the last few pages of this thing.
 
Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

oldtyme25 said:
Fire Mike Eaves?

Heck Yeah!

As everyone knows, recruiting is the life blood of any college sport. Mike Eaves has consistently either lost the battle or wasted scholarship dollars on players who have returned little or nothing to the program. The moment you can tell when a program has lost its mojo, is when the home state's best prospects start leaving for greener pastures. What did Barry Alverez do when he got the job, he stated that he was going to build a wall around the state and not let its best players leave for other programs, and it worked!

Let's look and see how Big Mike has been faring lately with Wisconsin's top home grown prospects:

Jordan Schmaltz - NHL 1st round pick - North Dakota
Will Butcher - NTDP - Denver
Ian McCoshen - USHL - Boston College

The other area that he has failed miserably is the scholarship dollars he has wasted on Wisconsin Prep Hockey Players who he has offered scholarships to before they played one minute in JR Hockey!

Current Wisconsin Wi Born Players and where they were recruited from:

Jake McCabe - NTDP - 6 points
Keegan Meuer - USHL - 4 points
Ryan Little - WIAA - 2 points
Brad Navin - WIAA - 1 point
Gavin Hartzog - WIAA - 0 points
Sean Little - WIAA - 0 points
Jefferson Dahl - WIAA - 0 points
Matt Pappe - WIAA - 0 points
Chase Drake - WIAA - 0 points

Lets also not forget two other former WIAA players and former WI Prep Hockey players of the year who committed to Wisco and never made it to campus

Travis Erstad
Cody Strang

So when you wonder why Wisco Hockey sucks.....take a look at the local players who are getting away and the ones who they landed.

So, is it time to fire Mike Eaves???

Yes is the answer!
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the bolded part is what really irks me. I recall reading S. Little, R. Little, M. Paape and looking at their prep stats and going ***? really? then you get a guy like Navin who had great stats (but again, it's Wisconsin hs hockey which is light years behind Minnesota HS, Mass prep, hell even Illinois turns out better prospects, michigan obviously, etc) and hasn't done anything.

add to that,guys who are supposed to score or at least at a secondary level, Lee, Barnes, LaBate and they're just not panning out that way.

I mean something has to give. UW fans want to really pin their hopes on just 2 players? Dvorak and Besse? I think it would take 2 each of these types (at least) in consecutive classes along with a Skille or two to really turn this around.
 
Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

My earlier comments were not about whether an individual player panned out or not. It was about the overall systemic failure of Mike Eaves recruiting results. There was a time when Wisconsin rarely lost out on an instate player they wanted, so the fact that they have lost out on the top 3 instate players in the last year is an indication that perhaps the perception of Coach Eaves/Badger Hockey is getting a bit tarnished.

My comments earlier about WIAA Prep Hockey was only about lack of return they have gotten from their investment and a hope that they will forgo this channel in the future until they see how the prospect performs in a junior hockey setting.
 
oldtyme25 said:
My earlier comments were not about whether an individual player panned out or not. It was about the overall systemic failure of Mike Eaves recruiting results. There was a time when Wisconsin rarely lost out on an instate player they wanted, so the fact that they have lost out on the top 3 instate players in the last year is an indication that perhaps the perception of Coach Eaves/Badger Hockey is getting a bit tarnished.

My comments earlier about WIAA Prep Hockey was only about lack of return they have gotten from their investment and a hope that they will forgo this channel in the future until they see how the prospect performs in a junior hockey setting.
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I thought a lot of what you said makes sense. Missing out on top WI recruits should be a concern. And I don't completely disagree with your points on WIAA players. I just don't think it's black and white. There may be cases where you have to offer a talented kid early or lose out on him. That said, you are right on the money that most kids need to play Juniors before playing college. The transition is steep, even coming from MN HS or AAA hockey.
 
solovsfett said:
the bolded part is what really irks me. I recall reading S. Little, R. Little, M. Paape and looking at their prep stats and going ***? really? then you get a guy like Navin who had great stats (but again, it's Wisconsin hs hockey which is light years behind Minnesota HS, Mass prep, hell even Illinois turns out better prospects, michigan obviously, etc) and hasn't done anything.

add to that,guys who are supposed to score or at least at a secondary level, Lee, Barnes, LaBate and they're just not panning out that way.

I mean something has to give. UW fans want to really pin their hopes on just 2 players? Dvorak and Besse? I think it would take 2 each of these types (at least) in consecutive classes along with a Skille or two to really turn this around.
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Even though I know you hate me Solo, you are one of my favorite Badger posters. You are old school like I am, and a good dude. I'm sorry if I was a jerk to you in the past, and I hope the Badgers turn things around. Our rivalry isn't as fun when one of our programs are down.
 
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