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Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

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Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

amherstblackbear said:
FF, I think you're right in that the coverup is worse than the crime. Obama opened the door for this sort of thing when he boasted he would have the most transparent administration in history.
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Whatever you think of the Obama administration...it is not transparent and never has been. Although I don't suspect any administration going forward to be transparent.
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

The former Massachusetts governor said that if the law is upheld (Obamacare), he would work to repeal it as president, and if it gets struck down, he would replace it with "real reform." Romney did not specify what such reforms would entail.
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This seems to be a theme with Romney. We heard the same crap on immigration. The Devil in the details. I want to know what the "replace and reform" is before I vote for someone.
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

ScoobyDoo said:
This seems to be a theme with Romney. We heard the same crap on immigration. The Devil in the details. I want to know what the "replace and reform" is before I vote for someone.
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Honestly, here's the problem. If Romney wins, we're probably looking at expansions of the majority in the House and a flip of the Senate. I don't think there's a single thing the Republicans alone could even agree to pass as Health Care Reform with as strong a Tea Party bloc in the House. Frankly, the Tea Party is more likely to want to repeal the laws requiring hospitals to treat indigent patients. As such, I have to assume that Romney winning means Obamacare gets repealed and nothing else changes. That's unacceptable.
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

bronconick said:
Honestly, here's the problem. If Romney wins, we're probably looking at expansions of the majority in the House and a flip of the Senate. I don't think there's a single thing the Republicans alone could even agree to pass as Health Care Reform with as strong a Tea Party bloc in the House. Frankly, the Tea Party is more likely to want to repeal the laws requiring hospitals to treat indigent patients. As such, I have to assume that Romney winning means Obamacare gets repealed and nothing else changes. That's unacceptable.
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Well, since Obamacare is the biggest job killing bill ever passed (credit: Future President Michelle Bachmann) just think of all the jobs he'll generate when it's repealed.
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

amherstblackbear said:
The substance of the Fortune article - and I haven't followed the whole ordeal very closely - seems to suggest a slight twist: the coverup is the only crime.
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My impression is that was really the only substantive charge all along. The program was a mess (as was its predecessor program under Bush) and a failure, but nothing about it was criminal. To be honest it wasn't even criminally stupid -- law enforcement run tracing scams like that all the time, this one was just handled terribly. All the hubub about that as incompetence is completely understandable. All the noise about it being a conspiracy to undermine gun rights is as laughable as everything else that comes out of the GOP rump.

Claiming exec privilege and holding onto documentation, on the other hand, smells really bad, just like every other time it's been done, from Watergate to water boarding. It's difficult to ascertain whether there's any merit in it. It's like invoking the Fifth -- it shouldn't be prejudicial since it's a basic right, but it also makes you look guilty as hell.

My political guess in all this is that Obama eventually sacks Holder, then goes before the moderates and says "for I loved you so much I sacrificed my only begotten son." Just like Bush and Rummy. It's the usual play.
 
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Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

Any notice that CJ Roberts called Obamacare a tax? Bush 41, here we come.
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

Old Pio said:
Interesting piece. Frankly, I haven't paid much attention to this matter. Although I find a 40-year old annecdate from his teen age years unpersuasive as to Issa's motivations. There is also the little matter of that letter, in which (paraphrasing Butterfly McQueen) the DOJ said: "We don't know nothin' 'bout no Fast and Furious." When, in fact, they knew quite bit. Is this election year politics? To be sure. Is there some "there" there? I suspect so.

And the pathetic efforts to drag Bush into this I also find unpersuasive. The Willie Horton business (first raised by Al Gore) is an article of Demcratic faith of the wickedness of Bush I. Yet I recall Bob Beckel saying this furlough policy in MA, although started by the previous governor, was fully embraced and defended and continued by Dukakis. It became his baby as a result. Similarly, this is Holder's (and perhaps His Privilegeness') baby. And no amount of blame shifting can change that.
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I think whatever OP has to say should be repeated, so everyone can be sure that they have read his posts. I will make it a point to quote his posts from now, if this annoys you, you're too liberal. :D
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

FlagDUDE08 said:
Any notice that CJ Roberts called Obamacare a tax? Bush 41, here we come.
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No new taxes on any couple making less than 250,000, isn't that what Obama said?.
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

walrus said:
No new taxes on any couple making less than 250,000, isn't that what Obama said?.
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Not quite, he was misquoted. What he actually said was "no newt taxes."

Just ask the Miami Heats how often Obama mis-speaks. ;)
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

French Rage said:
Of course I did. The play was over when the ballhandler's knee touches the ground and when someone made a forward lateral. You can see the final score on the Axe:

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/kelly_hirano/2767814681/" title="The Stanford Axe shows the correct score in 1982 by Kelly Hirano, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3259/2767814681_0c1e28ebed.jpg" width="333" height="500" alt="The Stanford Axe shows the correct score in 1982"></a>
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This unsubstantiated lie has been repeated by Stanford Alums for years. Believe not a word of it.
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

French Rage said:
Of course I did. The play was over when the ballhandler's knee touches the ground and when someone made a forward lateral. You can see the final score on the Axe:
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Actually, they only put up that plaque when Stanford has the axe. The correct score is displayed when Cal has the axe.
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

bigblue_dl said:
I think whatever OP has to say should be repeated, so everyone can be sure that they have read his posts. I will make it a point to quote his posts from now, if this annoys you, you're too liberal. :D
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There's a minor flaw in your plan... ;)
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

So everyone who voted for Obamacare voted for a tax increase, I'll bet they don't mention Obamacare ever during their campaigns this fall.

When will I be made to buy other stuff from private companies? The insurance companies must be laughing their asses off. Of course that won't last long
 
Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

I'd like our righty friends out here to clarify something for me.

You're truly expecting a man who enacted into law on a state level the very federal law that so offends you to be the one who repeals it? A politician with a well documented history of telling you one thing and then a day later taking the exact opposite position to a different audience. A man upon election would have to sign a law that repealed coverage for adult children & allowed insurers to once again deny coverage due to pre existing conditions. Even though he's given zero indication of what he's replace the law with given that the public is going to want to keep these goodies for themselves. Good luck with that...
 
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Re: Elections 2012:What unites us is greater than what divides us

walrus said:
So everyone who voted for Obamacare voted for a tax increase
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My taxes aren't going up. I don't know about anyone else though.

When will I be made to buy other stuff from private companies?
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