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ECAC Officiating First Half

Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

Got 6 said:
I am the first to admit that the call that Brutlag of RPI got against us at Appleton where we got the game-winner was a terrible call. However, it was a makeup call in my opinion. I'd rather they just make the right call first, instead of the makeup call as winning on a bad call cheapens the win.

Not to start a flame war, but the team that seems to benefit most is Cornell. They clutch, grab and pick all game and never seem to pay for it. Not all their players do it and they don't do it all the time and there are some players at Cornell every year that every team would love to have....but how they don't get more calls against is beyond me.
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Speaking of Cornell, I have been watching Scrivens kick his net off for 3.5 years when under pressure in his end, and it happens at a minimum of 2-3times per game, and I have never witnessed a penalty.

Is it the school ?, The Coach, The Goalie. Is it human nature that allows inconsistencies amongst Sports Teams, Players, Etc.
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

As far as faceoffs are concerned, on what basis does the linesman have the right to eject a player? I was watching the Rangers Red Wings last night and realized that you rarely see that called at least comparatively speaking, whereas as observed above it's probably some huge percentage of late as far as what I've seen in Union games this year. It really slows things down and frankly I don't see the point. BTW, one thing mentioned on TV last night was that the visiting player has to drop his stick first which I never realized. Is that the same in college?
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

Got 6 said:
Compared to these guys, I miss Belanger, Amian and Noeth! It really is not worth complaining about, but it is still frustrating.
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Got6: I only mentioned those 3 as they stood out over my many years as the most frustrating. Kotyra is definitely on that list also. RPI is now 2-23-1 when he is the ref and he was 1/2 of the abortion that was the second Cornell game of last years second round playoffs for us. He and Murphy combined to completely change that series with a myriad of horrible calls. BTW not saying we deserved to beat cornell-we were not the better team at all-but they called one of the worst most one sided games in memory. All I ask is for a reasonable amount of consistency-and most of all I would like to enjoy the games without having to notice the refs and linesmen. The best games are when you don't even seem to know they are there.:)
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

DrDemento said:
As an old timer I can say for certain that bad reffing is nothing new in the ECAC. Names like Mike Noeth, Harry Amian and Pierre Berlanger bring up horror stories in my mind.
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The latter two of that list were good refs. They were both *****ly people (and Pierre appeared to hate French Canadians for some reason) but at least they called predictable games and knew the rules. They were also famously hated by the Lynah Crowd, so that's a point in their favor, eh? John Murphy is another ref who fits that list of "reviled but fair."

Noeth... I'm not gonna argue there. :p

I'm always a little appalled / amused by the comic level of local yokel broadcaster indignation whenever a call goes against the home team. There are very good broadcasters out there, but there are also guys who are legendary in their Constant Verge of Heart Attack Over the Latest Crime. It tends to lap over into their fanbases as well, and so there are entire towns who are convinced they are always getting the shaft because it's been poured in their ears for decades.

I haven't noticed any real change in overall officiating quality in the ECAC, although it seems to me the quality in the other conferences has gotten better over the years. The refs' mistakes irritate me much less than the linesmen, who continue to be, well... capricious. There are games called very well and then there are games like the one at Troy last Friday where the stripes must have missed a dozen offsides and icings, evenly divided between the teams. Penalties are one thing -- there's judgment. But with procedural calls there's just no room for the amount of variance we get.
 
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Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

doghok said:
kick his net off for 3.5 years when under pressure in his end, and it happens at a minimum of 2-3times per game, and I have never witnessed a penalty.
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This is so common throughout the league it even has a name -- "pulling a Gaudet." :p (To be fair, I've never really associated Bob's teams with that particular strategy. The first time I noticed it as a pattern was the Colgate teams of the early 90's, but I'm sure it comes and goes like hemlines. FWIW, I don't think Scrivens is a big practitioner, but that could certainly be bias.)

Like you, I have never seen it called as delay, which it ought to be.
 
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Kepler-I don't think I will ever forget Pierre taking a puck to the head in a game in the 80"s at the Houston Fieldhouse and while he lay motionless and then carried out on the stretcher the fans cheering for his removal-he was absolutely hated there. You are correct about Amian-I guess i just remember his bad games;) As I mentioned before in that post-i think we have always had our difficulties with refs and it will remain so with the current crop. I agree however that there is no excuse for the linesmen not being more proficient.
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

DrDemento said:
Kepler-I don't think I will ever forget Pierre taking a puck to the head in a game in the 80"s at the Houston Fieldhouse and while he lay motionless and then carried out on the stretcher the fans cheering for his removal-he was absolutely hated there. You are correct about Amian-I guess i just remember his bad games;) As I mentioned before in that post-i think we have always had our difficulties with refs and it will remain so with the current crop. I agree however that there is no excuse for the linesmen not being more proficient.
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Wow...despite how horrible a ref can be, there's no excuse for cheering when the guy is being taken out on a stretcher.

My Pierre memory is from a 1991 Cornell-Clarkson game. I can't remember if he called 21 penalties total (18 on Clarkson, 3 on Cornell) or 21 penalties on Clarkson alone, but one of them was an unsportsmanlike bench minor on Clarkson because the band played Three Blind Mice. :eek:

The game ended in a tie and it was Clarkson's only blemish (18-0-1) during their final season at Walker Arena.
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

doghok said:
Speaking of Cornell, I have been watching Scrivens kick his net off for 3.5 years when under pressure in his end, and it happens at a minimum of 2-3times per game, and I have never witnessed a penalty.

Is it the school ?, The Coach, The Goalie. Is it human nature that allows inconsistencies amongst Sports Teams, Players, Etc.
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It's the coach, the whiniest baby to ever come near the game of college hockey. All he has to do is say "more calls should go against team XXX" and the next night your team has 18 penalties and is spending 1/3 of the game with only 3(4 counting the goalie) players on the ice
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

ADK11 said:
..and don't tell me that Union is getting all the calls this season after watching Brutlag HEAD BUTT a Union player TWICE right in front of the refs and only get a minor penalty.. brutal
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it's cause he missed the first one, but lets not forget that the Union guy hit him first AND prior to that there was 2 of the worst calls i've ever seen in my life on RPI. Maybe when you guys stop cheap-shotting Polacek, Pirri, and D'Amgio for the entire game Brutlag won't get so angry. The ref's turned that game completely on bad calls all in Union's favor, otherwise RPI would've most likely had a 4-0 lead going into the second

er sorry for double post ~
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

ThePeople said:
It's the coach, the whiniest baby to ever come near the game of college hockey. All he has to do is say "more calls should go against team XXX" and the next night your team has 18 penalties and is spending 1/3 of the game with only 3(4 counting the goalie) players on the ice
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Why, exactly, do you think the Cornell Coach wields such power over the officials??? Especially over RPI?

According to collegehockeystats.net over the last seven seasons, RPI in penalty minutes has had the following rankings (ECAC only, backwards from 08-09): 3rd, 1st, 5th, 10th, 7th, 5th, 4th.

Same years for Cornell: 9th, 3rd, 8th, 5th, 12th, 6th, 9th.

Schafer sure is a powerful guy. Except those three years he was in the top half of the league for PIM.

Seems to me the real whiny babies are some of the RPI posters. If the shoe fits...:rolleyes:
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

I am not going to bash Schafer at all. His record speaks for itself. He is among the coaches though that get lost in the event while on the bench. There are a few guys that are kind of jerks on the bench, but good guys outside...Schafer, Donato and Gaudet lead in that category!

Kepler nailed it. We all hated Belanger, Noeth and Amian too, but it was remarkably consistent and I actually think it is/was a penalty for playing three blind mice....I know the bands / stereo had to stop playing that at Appleton because they were told to by the league I guess. ECAC officiating now is like a box of chocolates!!!

Kotyra is on my list because when he has put the screws to us, it is in the playoffs.

As for our radio guys...sure there have been times where Greg went a bit overboard, but more often than not I am at the games and not listening. That we agree on most matters related to officiating makes him good in my opinion.

During the Belanger era, it was a much tougher league. You paid the price big time for parking in front of the net. Now, any contact that looks bad is called regardless of whether it is actually a penalty. I agree, the linesmen can be brutal on some nights and those calls HAVE to be reliable. I don't want an edge. I want players on both teams protected and I want consistency. I find the officiating incredibly inconsistent.

Hell, at Union last year I think every penalty called on SLU was by one ref (Barnard) and every penalty called on Union was by the other ref. I don't remember what the total calls ended up being, but it was not a well officiated game. Sorry to those at Union that counted the 7th player ballots....I stuffed the ballot box that night with the Union 7th player being Referee Barnard!!:D
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

As someone in the know put it to me, Schafer knows that there are certain guys he can bully around and he uses that to his advantage to get calls for his team.

Of course, I think we all agree that we view ECAC officials as pretty spineless anyhow.
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

I don't know much about the ECAC officiating since I'm from the State of Hockey, but we will glad ly give up Derrick Shepard and Marco Hunt for just about anyone !!!:mad:
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

doghok said:
The reffering in this league is below what is required, and the better the player, depending on the team I've come to notice, the more the reaction penalty is handed out, as opposed to the initiation.

Mr. Stewart, the head of officiating, had a wonderful NHL career both as a player and referree. However, I have never seen him at any games watching our product to assess and evaluate his talent.

I cannot remember any games the "Murphy's" have reffed at any rink that stands out. I know they must dis-like the Coach's and/or our current
captian(s) at Colgate. If he even sneezes, they send him to the Sin-Bin for littering.

One would have hoped that the Two Ref system would be a marked improvement. However, in saying all this, ECAC hockey is frantic hockey, and isn't coached or played within systems similar to the WCHA or the CCHA.

We can discuss this subject until we are blue in the face, however, the problem usually starts or ends, from the Top down.
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I haven't been at QU in 2 years since I graduated, but he went to almost every Quinnipiac home game 2 years ago. My assumption is that he did that so he got the rotation of refs coming to him, instead of travelling around and maybe seeing the same refs over and over.
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

aweise said:
Wow...despite how horrible a ref can be, there's no excuse for cheering when the guy is being taken out on a stretcher.

My Pierre memory is from a 1991 Cornell-Clarkson game. I can't remember if he called 21 penalties total (18 on Clarkson, 3 on Cornell) or 21 penalties on Clarkson alone, but one of them was an unsportsmanlike bench minor on Clarkson because the band played Three Blind Mice. :eek:

The game ended in a tie and it was Clarkson's only blemish (18-0-1) during their final season at Walker Arena.
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And one of those penalties was against Clarkson's goaltender (John Fletcher) - Pierre made Fletcher go to the bin, and Clarkson had to change goalies. I haven't seen that before or since. Cornell got the tying goal on the other goalie.

Didn't even know that could happen...
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

ThePeople said:
the Union guy hit him first
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When driving to the mall the other day my 5 and 7 year old were in the back seat. By the time we reached the mall the 2 kids were screaming, fighting, and the tears were running. I scolded them and tried to bring peace back to the car. What was the 5 year olds response to me? "He started it. He hit me first."
Grow up.
 
Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

So all I have seen is negative, is there any positive?

Are there any guys that this group rates as good?

REFEREES
Baker, Mike
Carusone, Joe
Dell, Alex
Dumas, Harry
Durfee, Jay
Ernst, Eric
Feola, Peter
Gilbert, Dean
Hicks, Bryan
Kotyra, Tim
Leonard, Rich
Litterio, Nick
McDonald, Chip
Millea, Jack
Murphy, Dan
Murphy, John
O'Brien, Andy
Petrus, Andy
Ritchie, Bob
Wahl, Derek
Whittemore, Scott

LINESMEN

Barrett, Matt
Boylan, Leo
Briggs, Jim
Brown, Dave
Butova, David
Caie, Brian
Carissimo, Tory
Cooke, Glen
Cronin, Tom
DiFusco, Andrew
Dumais, Greg
Durfee, Jay
Funaro, Craig
Harper, Jim
Hicks, Bryan
Litterio, Nick
Lyons, Bill
Mann, Andrew
Patry, Richard
Petrus, Andy
Piti, Christopher
Pleau, Michael
Prim, Scott
Reed, Brett
Riegert, Matt
Shufelt, Stephen
Simeon, Paul
St. Lawrence, Robert
Sullivan, Marc
Taggart, Dan
Testa, Joe



make groups who you would want doing your games and who you don't.

I comming from CT area know that I don't want to see Hicks @ the Q and Whal @ Yale anymore.


Good List : still to come



Bad List : Thinking
 
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