Did the officials screw up

[unofan]

Re: Did the officials screw up

They've got four sets of eyes out there, use them. There has to be something they can do where the decision to blow the play dead isn't solely on the shoulders of one ref, especially when so many goals are being nullified as a result of the play being blown dead prematurely.

While you're probably correct, how would this work from a mechanics standpoint? In other words, how would one of the other 3 sets of eyes communicate "the puck is not covered" to the ref on the goal line in the split second before he blows his whistle? Especially since the other pairs of eyes aren't always following the puck but watching for infractions away from the play.

To the extent the other refs can yell "LOOSE!!!" - it helps but is hardly a foolproof system And they should be doing that already - if my beer league refs do that, so can NCAA refs.

 

[PCM]

Re: Did the officials screw up

Here's a good example of a goal that was disallowed that should have counted. The ref is in good position to see the puck. It's under the goalie's pad, but, as the overhead view shows, it's not frozen and still moving toward the goal line. That's why the ref didn't blow the whistle. The MTU players see this, too, and continue poking at the puck. Zajac knocks the puck in and the ref who's right on top of the play signals a goal.

But the goal was disallowed because the ref said he blew his whistle, even though it's obvious he didn't. Very bizarre call.

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8r7R0hnQYoE&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8r7R0hnQYoE&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

 

[J.D.]

Re: Did the officials screw up

The question here is what constitutes possession of the puck? There was a delayed penalty being called. On the flip side of what happened, what if Knapp had the puck and the ref doesn't blow the whistle, allowing guys to hack away and knock the puck in? He lost sight of the puck and from his view it appeared Knapp had the puck...you can't wait forever. Tough call to make either way.

 

[unhpuckfan2001]

Re: Did the officials screw up

The question here is what constitutes possession of the puck? There was a delayed penalty being called. On the flip side of what happened, what if Knapp had the puck and the ref doesn't blow the whistle, allowing guys to hack away and knock the puck in? He lost sight of the puck and from his view it appeared Knapp had the puck...you can't wait forever. Tough call to make either way.

A lot of this has to do with protecting the player that a lot of people will argue is one of the most valuable on the ice. It's like the questionable flags for roughing the passer in football; where do you draw the line between protecting the goalie and blowing the whistle too soon.

It's a debate we'll continue to have.

 

[ATLhockeyfan]

Re: Did the officials screw up

well part of what's frustrating is that it didn't really appear Knapp had the puck -- Knapp was looking around for the puck and clearly had no idea where the puck was.

The question here is what constitutes possession of the puck? There was a delayed penalty being called. On the flip side of what happened, what if Knapp had the puck and the ref doesn't blow the whistle, allowing guys to hack away and knock the puck in? He lost sight of the puck and from his view it appeared Knapp had the puck...you can't wait forever. Tough call to make either way.

 

[HCSmooth]

Re: Did the officials screw up

I am never upset to see Michigan lose a game. But they rightfully won that game and were done in by a ref who was about 20 feet from the action and in no position to be able to know what was happening. Miami's players were still trying to find the puck, which is a clear sign that there was no possession or freezing of the puck. Blown call no matter how you slice it. Though, once it went to review there was nothing that could be done. The whistle ends the play unless you're in the NBA and get 5 steps after a foul to get off a shot

 

[SPCSMAN]

Re: Did the officials screw up

Gravallese and Bunyon were able to get some attention for Hockey East even in a down year!!!

 

[Pucknut]

Re: Did the officials screw up

The question is, did Grav blow the whistle because he lost site of the puck or did he see the Michigan player touch the puck on the delayed call?

 

[J.D.]

Re: Did the officials screw up

well part of what's frustrating is that it didn't really appear Knapp had the puck -- Knapp was looking around for the puck and clearly had no idea where the puck was.

Yes, but from the ref's angle it appeared he had it. It's a much tougher call of when to blow the whistle than a lot of people think in my opinion.

Unfortunate that it happened that way, but I don't really think Michigan got screwed.

 

[chickod]

Re: Did the officials screw up

... but also too bad that the NCAA stuck 2 of the 4 WCHA entries in St. Paul to knock each other out (and ditto the 2 CCHA entries in Ft. Wayne, who played the tourney's best game so far and probably both deserved to go per the caliber of their play).

Stop whining! How do you think we (BU) felt in 2005 when they stuck BC in our regional after we had beaten them FOUR CONSECUTIVE times? We didn't show up and they cleaned our clock and went to the Frozen Four. It's not 1960 anymore...there are more leagues. That's just the way it is, so get over it! If they worried about only having one team from each conference in a regional, you couldn't have a tournament. And they didn't stick them there to "knock each other out." If you didn't notice, most of the buildings were half-empty. Moving teams all over the country is not the greatest idea where attendance in concerned. You obviously didn't go, because I would think you would happy that you didn't have to travel as far.

 

[MaizeRage]

Re: Did the officials screw up

On the flip side of what happened, what if Knapp had the puck and the ref doesn't blow the whistle, allowing guys to hack away and knock the puck in?

Then they can review the play, say the goalie had possession, and wave off the goal.

Football officials have figured out how to use replay to their advantage because they know the consequences of getting a call wrong. It would be nice if hockey officials caught on as well.

 

[gscott13]

Re: Did the officials screw up

The question is, did Grav blow the whistle because he lost site of the puck or did he see the Michigan player touch the puck on the delayed call?

delayed penalty was on miami... a michigan player touching it wouldn't have prompted a whistle...

grav either blew the whistle b/c he lost sight of the puck (which i can understand given that knapp was between him and the puck), he thought knapp had enough possession to blow the whistle because of the delayed penalty on miami, or he thought knapp had it under him....

first reason is the most likely scenario, followed by the the other two in no particular order...

fwiw, i don't have a dog in the fight, and i didn't have a problem with it...

 

[unofan]

Re: Did the officials screw up

Then they can review the play, say the goalie had possession, and wave off the goal.

And then people will rage when the first goalie inevitably has his hand broken after being hit multiple times with a stick due to the ref's slow whistle.

 

[J.D.]

Re: Did the officials screw up

Then they can review the play, say the goalie had possession, and wave off the goal.

Football officials have figured out how to use replay to their advantage because they know the consequences of getting a call wrong. It would be nice if hockey officials caught on as well.

I don't think what you're suggesting is in the rule book--to allow the refs to make such a decision, no? They'd only be allowed to review whether or not there was intent to blow the whistle. You can't go back and say, well, I should have blown the whistle here.

 

[MaizeRage]

Re: Did the officials screw up

I don't think what you're suggesting is in the rule book--to allow the refs to make such a decision, no? They'd only be allowed to review whether or not there was intent to blow the whistle. You can't go back and say, well, I should have blown the whistle here.

That's the whole reason "intent to blow the whistle" is in the rulebook. It's meant to erase the technicality of a player scoring after the play is dead, but before the official blows his whistle.

And maybe there's a greater chance for injury. But there's also similar chance of injury, probably even moreso, with the increase of scrums for fumbles in football, yet nobody seems to mind. Everyone just wants to see the right calls made. There was the possibility for the right one to be made last night, and it was not.

 

[Larch]

Re: Did the officials screw up

well part of what's frustrating is that it didn't really appear Knapp had the puck -- Knapp was looking around for the puck and clearly had no idea where the puck was.

I'm not commenting on this play because I haven't seen it, but as a ref, that happens probably 2-3 times a game. The goalie isn't always sure where it is, but they have control and we are required to blow it dead. If we always waited for the goalie to know where it was, we would have a lot more injured goalies. On the flip side, and it happened just this last weekend, sometimes the goalie is positive they know where the puck is and they have it covered when in reality the puck is loose.

'Control' is in the determination of the ref, plain and simple.

I'm not defending or accusing, but the refs have a tough job and everybody wants to talk about how the teams are tired, but don't you think the refs might be a little gassed too? They may not skate as hard, but they are on the ice the whole 60 minutes. They get worn out too and may not be thinking as clearly.

 

[Wisko McBadgerton]

Re: Did the officials screw up

I'm not commenting on this play because I haven't seen it, but as a ref, that happens probably 2-3 times a game. The goalie isn't always sure where it is, but they have control and we are required to blow it dead. If we always waited for the goalie to know where it was, we would have a lot more injured goalies. On the flip side, and it happened just this last weekend, sometimes the goalie is positive they know where the puck is and they have it covered when in reality the puck is loose.

'Control' is in the determination of the ref, plain and simple.

I'm not defending or accusing, but the refs have a tough job and everybody wants to talk about how the teams are tired, but don't you think the refs might be a little gassed too? They may not skate as hard, but they are on the ice the whole 60 minutes. They get worn out too and may not be thinking as clearly.

If you can't think of something bad to say about a ref please don't say anything at all.

They're all evil.

 

[No Legs]

Re: Did the officials screw up

No in fact the official called it like he saw it. UM thinks it took one in the shorts sorry! It is what it is always has been that way and always will be.

Been on both sides of the fence concerning the call coaching and was even dumb enough to ref a couple of years my-self.

Ref was in the area he was suppose to be, lost sight of the puck blew the play dead. You all have to remember we get to enjoy it over and over in slow motion from many angles he has a split second to see what is seen and make the call.

For the life of me I can't figure out why it even went to review. The Whistle blew he waived off the shot the play was over.

Just Saying! Was one heck of a game though.

 

[dvgmacdonald]

Re: Did the officials screw up

I saw the play and the replays. I think the right call was made on the replay, the whistle had blown, the goal was no good. Unfortunately (I hate Michigan) I think that there's some reason for blue fans to gripe. This & the 2nd Miami goal could both have gone the other way just as easily (and maybe been more correct).

I don't think there was any bias, but I think that Michigan was slighted by the officiating (which wasn't tremendously good in the other facets of the game, either). Some games just go this way. If this was November, I don't think it would be a big deal. It's unfortunate, though when it ends somebody's season.

 

[MUhawks628]

Re: Did the officials screw up

When we were waiting for the call in the stands (as a Wings fan) all I was thinking about:

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/CzfMggdHzRg&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/CzfMggdHzRg&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

On the other side of it now, but by the book they made the right call there and made the right call last night. Doesn't make it any less ****ty for the team it happens to.