Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

[Kepler]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

She's good. But there's way better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEG-ly9tQGk

Now you've sent me down the internet rabbit hole. Thanks.

Lars isn't everybody's favorite.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Same as for hunting. A single shot weapon. Two if you'd like.

Sounds good. Let's make them acquire and carry five guns and have to switch back and forth. I think actually trying to make it more difficult is a good idea.

I honestly question your understanding of firearms. I don't think you understand why you want more than a bolt-action for hunting. I don't think you understand why you would want more than one round to defend your home. I don't think you understand how easy it is to drop a magazine out of a handgun and reload nor do I think you understand how quick it would be to switch handguns.

You seem to ignore the fact that most gun-owners have more than one and often more than 10 guns in the house. So we can already obtain more than one. I don't know what you hope to accomplish.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Well since PETA probably frowns on hunting anyway...

...Kill PETA?

 

[hockeyplayer1015]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Well since PETA probably frowns on hunting anyway...

Probably, but regardless, the point stands. I'd wager that the vast majority of hunters wish to minimize the suffering of the animal they are trying to kill. Sometimes, that requires more than 1 shot, for various reasons.

I've shot, wounded and was unable to find a buck before. I felt horrible about it, but could only hope that it lived to see another day.

 

[burd]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Do you speed where you know the cops are, or aren't (soft target).

That's not my point, though, sic, and I did not explain myself very well. In your example, cops are analogous to people with guns, but that does not account for part of the benefit/detriment analysis that has to take place to evaluate this problem.

People want to restrict gun ownership because they think the abundance of guns contributes to more deaths and injuries--that the mere presence of more guns presents a risk. So when you talk about that soft target concept, you balance the risk those additional guns present with the benefit (deterring bad guys with guns). But other than flaggy, not many see the presence of more cops as having the same risk factor that having more guns does.

So yes, the presence of cops will discourage speeding, but until you attribute a risk factor to the presence of more cops, it's a pretty loose-fitting analogy.

Or something like that. 5:00 is a little early for sundowning.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Those who are on one side of the "gun control" debate will read this and agree completely, those on the other side will find endless flaws in the methodology of the studies, the conclusions or whatever they suspect the author's political leanings are.

I'm not entirely sure what he's getting at? The only thing he's proposed is background checks. I think everyone agrees on background checks.

The other part that bothers me is

My study also shows a strong correlation between mass shooting casualties and overall death by firearms rates. However, in this last analysis, the relation seems to be mainly driven by the very high number of deaths by firearms in the United States. The relation disappears when the United States is withdrawn from the analysis.

There can't be a strong correlation if one data point makes the trend. His math doesn't seem sound.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Same as for hunting. A single shot weapon. Two if you'd like.

The third guy through the door on the home invasion thanks you.

 

[WeAreNDHockey]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Personally I own more than 10 guns, and haven't bought one since 1998, so I wasn't even one of those applications. I have family members who own probably another 20-25 guns, and I doubt more than one or two of those have been purchased since 1998. If our family is anything close to typical, how many guns are out there?

I only point these numbers out because like the idea that we're just going to round up 8 million Mexicans and bus them back to Mexico, the idea of getting guns off the streets and keeping them out of the hands of bad guys is a lot closer to impossible than it ever will be to realistic.

I think this is an often overlooked point, and a correct one. There have been millions of firearms in the country for friggin' ever. And for most of that time in most of the country it has been fairly easy to obtain a firearm, both legally AND illegally. As well, since the country has existed, virtually every firearm has not been used in a criminal manner. My guess is that 99% of them have never been fired at another human in anger.

But something has changed over the years as we are seeing more and more of these mass shootings (almost however one chooses to define them). A change in the conditions usually warrants a change in the response. I doubt we will ever see it. These kinds of mass killings, whether they are pure political terrorism, hate crimes, or just some psychopathic nutjob, are here to stay. They are the new normal. My guess is before the presidential election, there will be at another. And another after that one. And another one after that. As a people we can do better if the political will was there and the leaders of this nation -- on both sides of the aisle and the argument -- had the courage. I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Why do people insist on obfuscating the reality of mass shootings by stating they killers could reach their end game via other means? Sure they could - but what is the frequency of a Tim McVeigh vs. an Omar Mateen?

And a handgun doesn't have nearly the power or load capacity as what he used.

Not advocating for any specific bans for what it's worth, but these points are key.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

I honestly question your understanding of firearms.

It's a common problem. It's similar with electricity too.

I have a simple question for electricity: "Where does electricity come from?"
If the answer I get is "out of the outlet" ... you win. I don't even try.

I'm trying to create the same for firearms.

1. "Caliber" of a gun is a measure of:
( a ) the length of a gun's barrel
( b ) the length of a round the gun fires
( c ) the weight of a round the gun fires
( d ) the diameter of a round the gun fires
( e ) none of the above

2. The difference between semi-automatic and automatic is:
( a ) one round per trigger pull versus rounds fire until the trigger is released (or there are no more rounds)
( b ) automatics have magazines; semi-autos do not
( c ) semi-autos have magazines; automatics do not
( d ) none of the above

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

There is a difference between speaking out about not liking a group of folks and advocating their annihilation, yes?

"The good news is that at least fifty of these pedophiles are not going to be harming children anymore. The bad news is that a lot of the homos in the bar are still alive, so they’re going to continue to molest children and recruit people into their filthy homosexual lifestyle.”

How is that not recommending their annihilation?

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Why do people insist on obfuscating the reality of mass shootings by stating they killers could reach their end game via other means? Sure they could - but what is the frequency of a Tim McVeigh vs. an Omar Mateen?

And a handgun doesn't have nearly the power or load capacity as what he used.

Not advocating for any specific bans for what it's worth, but these points are key.

You missed Seattle in December 2013 (earlier today) I bet: http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...t-reaches-out-to-victims-of-orlando-massacre/

As far as load capacity ... (that's for the most common handgun out there) ...

 

[unofan]

It's a common problem. It's similar with electricity too.

I have a simple question for electricity: "Where does electricity come from?"
If the answer I get is "out of the outlet" ... you win. I don't even try.

I'm trying to create the same for firearms.

1. "Caliber" of a gun is a measure of:
( a ) the length of a gun's barrel
( b ) the length of a round the gun fires
( c ) the weight of a round the gun fires
( d ) the diameter of a round the gun fires
( e ) none of the above

2. The difference between semi-automatic and automatic is:
( a ) one round per trigger pull versus rounds fire until the trigger is released (or there are no more rounds)
( b ) automatics have magazines; semi-autos do not
( c ) semi-autos have magazines; automatics do not
( d ) none of the above

And yet you and several others on here keep trying to tell the rest of us that all guns are the same and there's no reason to regulate one type or another for civilians.

For the record, 1 is either d or e (it's also the internal diameter of the barrel) and 2 is a.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

How is that not recommending their annihilation?

What the man said is not worth repeating; however, did he say, "Go harm them"?

The imam in question said, "Gays must die." The guano loco crowd just heard a command.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

And yet you and several others on here keep trying to tell the rest of us that all guns are the same and there's no reason to regulate one type or another for civilians.

For the record, 1 is either d or e (it's also the internal diameter of the barrel) and 2 is a.

Congrats, you live in the midwest.

(And yes, Q1 could be argued about "nominal diameter", etc, etc.)

 

[leswp1]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

If they'd have kept his fabulous father (as shown by Kep) out, he'd have been out.

Well, with that logic, applied to extreme, most of us would be out. Go back a generation and my Swedish/Scottish a55 would have been bporn somewhere else.

Agreed. There's middle ground. I'm trying to find it. I posted (twice!) my immediate "concessions" rolleyes and had some follow-up items. I'm not sure I'm for a California-style assault weapons ban beyond what is already banned federally. I am open to a number of regulations that make obtaining a semiautomatic rifle more restrictive, but not an outright ban.

What I don't understand is the complete obstructionst reaction to requiring people to have to be knowledgeable about the weapon they are buying. I was shooting before the age of 10. I was also required to be able to take down/clean my gun after use. Guns were serious business. (Dad was military).

The third guy through the door on the home invasion thanks you.

I see this argument often. Are there any stats that show this is something that happens more than one time a year? It sounds impressive but I can't say I have seen anything supporting the usefulness of weapons in protecting oneself vs the harm that comes of the hot dogs who think they will protect themselves and have no bleeding idea how to use the weapon when confronted with the situation and disrespect gun safety.

I think this is an often overlooked point, and a correct one. There have been millions of firearms in the country for friggin' ever. And for most of that time in most of the country it has been fairly easy to obtain a firearm, both legally AND illegally. As well, since the country has existed, virtually every firearm has not been used in a criminal manner. My guess is that 99% of them have never been fired at another human in anger.

But something has changed over the years as we are seeing more and more of these mass shootings (almost however one chooses to define them). A change in the conditions usually warrants a change in the response. I doubt we will ever see it. These kinds of mass killings, whether they are pure political terrorism, hate crimes, or just some psychopathic nutjob, are here to stay. They are the new normal. My guess is before the presidential election, there will be at another. And another after that one. And another one after that. As a people we can do better if the political will was there and the leaders of this nation -- on both sides of the aisle and the argument -- had the courage. I'm not holding my breath.

Before people owned guns because they used them to hunt or shoot for sport. I can't remember anyone when I was little owning a gun solely to protect their property (maybe I lived in a more civilized portion of the country?). Guns went from being a tool to being something people weren't as knowledgeable about but had to own. I am not for banning guns. I am for making sure people have a sense of what they own and how to be safe. I had a blast shooting when I was a kid but I learned to respect the gun long before I was allowed to touch it. As a medical person who cares for kids one of the things I would ask was if there were guns in house were they stored safely (cue massive, misplaced outrage here) just as I asked if medications and chemicals were safely stored. You cannot believe the number of buffoons who own guns and have no idea what they are doing. It makes me crazy when the various gun lobby people block requirements to assure people know how to be safe around guns. Would this stop some of these shootings? No, probably not but it may make it more difficult to own if you needto put forth effort and deter those who view guns as toys and then use them seriously later.

Why do people insist on obfuscating the reality of mass shootings by stating they killers could reach their end game via other means? Sure they could - but what is the frequency of a Tim McVeigh vs. an Omar Mateen?

And a handgun doesn't have nearly the power or load capacity as what he used.

Not advocating for any specific bans for what it's worth, but these points are key.

This, this and this. There are plenty of real arguments. That is a lazy one.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

I was shooting before the age of 10. I was also required to be able to take down/clean my gun after use. Guns were serious business. (Dad was military).

Yup, yup, and yup. Old man was Army; his best friend was a Jarhead. I have no problem with setting high standards for safe ownership.

 

[walrus]

It's a common problem. It's similar with electricity too.

I have a simple question for electricity: "Where does electricity come from?"
If the answer I get is "out of the outlet" ... you win. I don't even try.

I'm trying to create the same for firearms.

1. "Caliber" of a gun is a measure of:
( a ) the length of a gun's barrel
( b ) the length of a round the gun fires
( c ) the weight of a round the gun fires
( d ) the diameter of a round the gun fires
( e ) none of the above

2. The difference between semi-automatic and automatic is:
( a ) one round per trigger pull versus rounds fire until the trigger is released (or there are no more rounds)
( b ) automatics have magazines; semi-autos do not
( c ) semi-autos have magazines; automatics do not
( d ) none of the above

Don't expect to get many correct answers on here

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

I haven't seen any obstructionism with regards to knowledge of the gun. I'm a little confused about that part.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

There was a time when the day of deer hunting opener that all the kids in high school would park on the city street and not the school lot because guns weren't to be on school property. (The season started at noon.)

I'm pretty sure there was enough fire power in those cars to overthrow a small Central American nation. (Hyperbole alert there.)

Yet, we didn't have the world we have today.