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COVID-19 - Part 2
- Thread starter Chuck Murray
- Start date
- Status
Slap Shot
I got nothing
Re: COVID-19 - Part 2
Chuck, it's so precious you think that was a real rebuttal. Nothing can touch Trump's frequency of incivility, dishonesty, selfishness and un-Presidential behavior. But you're a good little #FAP member and that reality somehow escapes you. Good luck with that 5, buddy.
Chuck, it's so precious you think that was a real rebuttal. Nothing can touch Trump's frequency of incivility, dishonesty, selfishness and un-Presidential behavior. But you're a good little #FAP member and that reality somehow escapes you. Good luck with that 5, buddy.
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
rufus
rock and roller
Re: COVID-19 - Part 2
Read about this yesterday. I can't explain it so well, so I'll just link to where I read it. Basically, there's evolving research that Covfefe-19 doesn't attack the respiratory system in the way doctors have assumed it does, so using ventilators the way they have traditionally been used hasn't been as effective, and may actually be damaging the patients' lungs.
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/possible-developments-in-the-treatment-of-acute-covid-19
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/possible-developments-in-the-treatment-of-critical-covid-19-2
Read about this yesterday. I can't explain it so well, so I'll just link to where I read it. Basically, there's evolving research that Covfefe-19 doesn't attack the respiratory system in the way doctors have assumed it does, so using ventilators the way they have traditionally been used hasn't been as effective, and may actually be damaging the patients' lungs.
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/possible-developments-in-the-treatment-of-acute-covid-19
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/possible-developments-in-the-treatment-of-critical-covid-19-2
French Rage
NICKERSON HAS [CENSORED]
Re: COVID-19 - Part 2
We need to differentiate the threads with subtitles based on their content. I recommend this one be called "Reviewing Epidemiological Topics And Re-evaluating Daily Statistics".
We need to differentiate the threads with subtitles based on their content. I recommend this one be called "Reviewing Epidemiological Topics And Re-evaluating Daily Statistics".
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
MinnesotaNorthStar
Minding the gap
unofan
Well-known member
Psst. Read the capitalized letters of his
aparch
Well-known member
Reading? That's some librul elitist bullsh**!!
in case anyone from the RETARDS (thanks, French!) thread missed it, my mom’s step-brother’s lung burst on Saturday while on a ventilator in ICU, so I am well aware that there are dangers and definitely have concerns. However, I think it’s more than a bit disingenuous to say that COVID-19 death rates on ventilators are “higher than normal.” This virus is new - what is the definition of normal?
And only human trash would stand on the sidelines screaming, “Since you scientists haven’t developed 100% effective and safe treatment within the first two months, I’m not going to listen to anything you have to say.”
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: COVID-19 - Part 2
<img src="https://i.ytimg.com/vi/UYjss6WIzHw/maxresdefault.jpg" height=666>
<img src="https://i.ytimg.com/vi/UYjss6WIzHw/maxresdefault.jpg" height=666>
net presence
Active member
Re: COVID-19 - Part 2
How Europe failed the coronavirus test
The contagion’s spread is a story of complacency, overconfidence, and lack of preparation.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/08/how-europe-failed-the-coronavirus-test-174199
They failed to heed experts who said no country could fight the virus on its own, failed to perceive that the world’s most advanced health care systems were at grave risk of being overwhelmed. They failed to understand that drastic measures would be needed until Italy — patient zero among EU member countries — frantically imposed travel restrictions that impeded European leaders’ own movements.
How Europe once again ended up as a killing field of infectious disease, as it did with plague in the 1300s and influenza a century ago, is less a blame game of individual finger-pointing than a story of collective complacency, and of dangerous overconfidence. Politicians seeking to prevent public panic reassured themselves into inaction — failing to build rapid testing capacity or to stockpile medical supplies over the two months following the virus’ emergence in China.
EU nations, despite their pledge to an ever-closer union, reacted selfishly and chaotically once the threat became evident. Health ministers — four of who quit or were fired during the crisis — bickered. Governments misled Brussels about their preparedness, then hoarded essential equipment and haphazardly shut their borders, disrupting commerce and stranding citizens.
and more
On January 26, four days after von der Leyen and Hatchett spoke in Davos, Tom Ingelsby, the director of the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security in the U.S., took to Twitter to urge world leaders to anticipate the worst.
“Global and national leaders should be looking ahead to what must be done to prepare for the possibility nCoV (novel coronavirus) can’t be contained, even as we continue to work as hard as possible to contain it in China and beyond,” Ingelsby wrote.
In addition to “crash vaccine development,” Ingelsby called for “urgent serology development programs” to figure out how many people had been exposed to the coronavirus and developed antibodies. He called for “massive expansion of diagnostics development capacity in China and around world,” for “rapid clinical trials for antivirals” and for “major expansion of personal protective equipment for health care workers.”
Other public health officials voiced little concern.
On January 27, Lothar Wieler, president of the Robert Koch Institute, Germany’s center for disease control, told the broadcaster ZDF in an interview that he saw “low danger” from the coronavirus. “We expect that single cases in different countries can occur,” Wieler said. “The chance for those single cases to then spread is at this point limited.”
Excellent reporting from Politico .....
How Europe failed the coronavirus test
The contagion’s spread is a story of complacency, overconfidence, and lack of preparation.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/08/how-europe-failed-the-coronavirus-test-174199
They failed to heed experts who said no country could fight the virus on its own, failed to perceive that the world’s most advanced health care systems were at grave risk of being overwhelmed. They failed to understand that drastic measures would be needed until Italy — patient zero among EU member countries — frantically imposed travel restrictions that impeded European leaders’ own movements.
How Europe once again ended up as a killing field of infectious disease, as it did with plague in the 1300s and influenza a century ago, is less a blame game of individual finger-pointing than a story of collective complacency, and of dangerous overconfidence. Politicians seeking to prevent public panic reassured themselves into inaction — failing to build rapid testing capacity or to stockpile medical supplies over the two months following the virus’ emergence in China.
EU nations, despite their pledge to an ever-closer union, reacted selfishly and chaotically once the threat became evident. Health ministers — four of who quit or were fired during the crisis — bickered. Governments misled Brussels about their preparedness, then hoarded essential equipment and haphazardly shut their borders, disrupting commerce and stranding citizens.
and more
On January 26, four days after von der Leyen and Hatchett spoke in Davos, Tom Ingelsby, the director of the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security in the U.S., took to Twitter to urge world leaders to anticipate the worst.
“Global and national leaders should be looking ahead to what must be done to prepare for the possibility nCoV (novel coronavirus) can’t be contained, even as we continue to work as hard as possible to contain it in China and beyond,” Ingelsby wrote.
In addition to “crash vaccine development,” Ingelsby called for “urgent serology development programs” to figure out how many people had been exposed to the coronavirus and developed antibodies. He called for “massive expansion of diagnostics development capacity in China and around world,” for “rapid clinical trials for antivirals” and for “major expansion of personal protective equipment for health care workers.”
Other public health officials voiced little concern.
On January 27, Lothar Wieler, president of the Robert Koch Institute, Germany’s center for disease control, told the broadcaster ZDF in an interview that he saw “low danger” from the coronavirus. “We expect that single cases in different countries can occur,” Wieler said. “The chance for those single cases to then spread is at this point limited.”
Excellent reporting from Politico .....
Re: COVID-19 - Part 2
THIS terrifying animation shows how coronavirus particles from a single cough can hang in the air "several minutes" and spread across two aisles of a supermarket.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11359...cloud-coronavirus-across-supermarket-lingers/
So much for the six feet stuff .....
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11359...cloud-coronavirus-across-supermarket-lingers/
The scientists involved say that the best way to avoid catching the virus is to stay away from busy public spaces like shops and stations.
Professor Ville Vuorinen of Aalto University in Finland told the BBC: "If you go there, only go there seldom as possible. Stay there as short a time as possible"
In a statement accompanying the video, the researchers said: "Preliminary results indicate that aerosol particles carrying the virus can remain in the air longer than was originally thought, so it is important to avoid busy public indoor spaces.
Great ... any more good news?
THIS terrifying animation shows how coronavirus particles from a single cough can hang in the air "several minutes" and spread across two aisles of a supermarket.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11359...cloud-coronavirus-across-supermarket-lingers/
So much for the six feet stuff .....
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11359...cloud-coronavirus-across-supermarket-lingers/
The scientists involved say that the best way to avoid catching the virus is to stay away from busy public spaces like shops and stations.
Professor Ville Vuorinen of Aalto University in Finland told the BBC: "If you go there, only go there seldom as possible. Stay there as short a time as possible"
In a statement accompanying the video, the researchers said: "Preliminary results indicate that aerosol particles carrying the virus can remain in the air longer than was originally thought, so it is important to avoid busy public indoor spaces.
Great ... any more good news?
net presence
Active member
Re: COVID-19 - Part 2
QUOTE=Chuck Murray;6937156]Wide range of discussion topics with some decent questions (others less so), so let's start here ...
Chuck, first, you do realize that the few models predicting a worst case scenario of 1-2 million deaths in the U.S. is based on doing zero social distancing/sheltering-in-place for the first 18 months. Most models actually were only predicting worst case death scenarios of around 450K. However, with effective mitigation, that number dropped to 100K-200K. Thus, if they're now adjusting it down to 50K-100K, that's not nearly the degree of "miss" on the predictions. Regardless, the fact you're getting all high and mighty about your criticism of these scientists is laughable. Here is a link to an article in "The Scientist" about how difficult it is trying to model this
virus:https://www.the-scientist.com/news-...ict-the-future-of-the-covid-19-pandemic-67261
From the article:
Left unchecked, infectious outbreaks typically plateau and then start to decline when the disease runs out of available hosts. But it’s almost impossible to make any sensible projection right now about when that will be, Boni says, or about how many people will ultimately be affected. Modelers can try, but to do so they need much better information, such as how many people infected show natural immunity.
Most of these forward-looking “scenario planning” models currently assume everyone on the planet is susceptible, Edmunds says. Only better surveillance and data, in particular, from serum tests that would indicate whether people have been exposed to the virus whether or not they developed symptoms, will make those calculations more realistic. “At the moment, we’ve got no data to tie that model down. But as the epidemic proceeds and everytime more data comes out, like every day or every week, we refit the model and then we redo our projections.”
If you take the time to read the entire article, you'll see just how difficult modeling this virus truly is. As often seems to be the case, your "argument" falls apart when exposed to accurate information. Next, regarding Hillary. I'm not a fan either and, thankfully, I didn't need to vote for her (although it was much closer than expected in Minnesota). I have to say that your attempt to conflate Hillary calling the 38% that makes up Trump's base "deplorables" as meaning she was calling them "racists, sexists, etc..yada, yada, yada." is kind of cute. Completely ridiculous but cute. Sorry, you can't automatically assume that's what she meant. You're getting desperate Chuck. This moron -- he's literally got the emotional intelligence of a 12 year old -- is the absolute worst president we've ever had. Remember, I have actually voted for more Republicans for president than Democrats. Unfortunately, the party is now under the control of white nationalists like Stephen Miller, as well as individuals who obviously only really care about the 1%ers and corporations. It's unfortunate that someone who seems to be fairly intelligent can't see through the Fox News Fog...
Regarding your anti-science rant/global warming is a left wing hoax rant; it's interesting you choose to link to two non-scientists to try and sway the audience. If you really have any scintilla of actual open-mindedness that human affected global climate change just might, MIGHT, be occurring, then go to this link from the NASA website. Remember, these are the scientists and engineers responsible for moon landings, the space shuttle, and robots landing on mars for crying out loud. How do they gain from trying to propagate a "climate change hoax"?!?
https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
From the article:
Scientific evidence for warming of the climate system is unequivocal.
- Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
The current warming trend is of particular significance because most of it is extremely likely (greater than 95 percent probability) to be the result of human activity since the mid-20th century and proceeding at a rate that is unprecedented over decades to millennia.1
Earth-orbiting satellites and other technological advances have enabled scientists to see the big picture, collecting many different types of information about our planet and its climate on a global scale. This body of data, collected over many years, reveals the signals of a changing climate.
The heat-trapping nature of carbon dioxide and other gases was demonstrated in the mid-19th century.2 Their ability to affect the transfer of infrared energy through the atmosphere is the scientific basis of many instruments flown by NASA. There is no question that increased levels of greenhouse gases must cause the Earth to warm in response.
Ice cores drawn from Greenland, Antarctica, and tropical mountain glaciers show that the Earth’s climate responds to changes in greenhouse gas levels. Ancient evidence can also be found in tree rings, ocean sediments, coral reefs, and layers of sedimentary rocks. This ancient, or paleoclimate, evidence reveals that current warming is occurring roughly ten times faster than the average rate of ice-age-recovery warming.3
The evidence for rapid climate change is compelling:
Chuck, here's another link to a PBS NOVA special called "Decoding the Weather Machine". I challenge you and any of our other climate change deniers to actually watch the entire show and come back and tell me there isn't absolutely any evidence for climate change affected/caused by human activity.
https://www.thirteen.org/programs/nova/decoding-the-weather-machine-vgqhot
Finally, I want to say ditto to aparch's response to your abortion talking point. To be clear, I don't approve of late term abortions except in the case of health of the mother, or if the pregnancy is a result of incest or rape. But please, I'd really like to hear your answer to the question aparch posed. If we're to consider that ball of cells a life that should be cherished at almost all costs, then in today's times, why wouldn't that child's mom receive the $500 from the Covid stimulus?
QUOTE=Chuck Murray;6937156]Wide range of discussion topics with some decent questions (others less so), so let's start here ...
Chuck, first, you do realize that the few models predicting a worst case scenario of 1-2 million deaths in the U.S. is based on doing zero social distancing/sheltering-in-place for the first 18 months. Most models actually were only predicting worst case death scenarios of around 450K. However, with effective mitigation, that number dropped to 100K-200K. Thus, if they're now adjusting it down to 50K-100K, that's not nearly the degree of "miss" on the predictions. Regardless, the fact you're getting all high and mighty about your criticism of these scientists is laughable. Here is a link to an article in "The Scientist" about how difficult it is trying to model this
virus:https://www.the-scientist.com/news-...ict-the-future-of-the-covid-19-pandemic-67261
From the article:
Left unchecked, infectious outbreaks typically plateau and then start to decline when the disease runs out of available hosts. But it’s almost impossible to make any sensible projection right now about when that will be, Boni says, or about how many people will ultimately be affected. Modelers can try, but to do so they need much better information, such as how many people infected show natural immunity.
Most of these forward-looking “scenario planning” models currently assume everyone on the planet is susceptible, Edmunds says. Only better surveillance and data, in particular, from serum tests that would indicate whether people have been exposed to the virus whether or not they developed symptoms, will make those calculations more realistic. “At the moment, we’ve got no data to tie that model down. But as the epidemic proceeds and everytime more data comes out, like every day or every week, we refit the model and then we redo our projections.”
If you take the time to read the entire article, you'll see just how difficult modeling this virus truly is. As often seems to be the case, your "argument" falls apart when exposed to accurate information. Next, regarding Hillary. I'm not a fan either and, thankfully, I didn't need to vote for her (although it was much closer than expected in Minnesota). I have to say that your attempt to conflate Hillary calling the 38% that makes up Trump's base "deplorables" as meaning she was calling them "racists, sexists, etc..yada, yada, yada." is kind of cute. Completely ridiculous but cute. Sorry, you can't automatically assume that's what she meant. You're getting desperate Chuck. This moron -- he's literally got the emotional intelligence of a 12 year old -- is the absolute worst president we've ever had. Remember, I have actually voted for more Republicans for president than Democrats. Unfortunately, the party is now under the control of white nationalists like Stephen Miller, as well as individuals who obviously only really care about the 1%ers and corporations. It's unfortunate that someone who seems to be fairly intelligent can't see through the Fox News Fog...
Regarding your anti-science rant/global warming is a left wing hoax rant; it's interesting you choose to link to two non-scientists to try and sway the audience. If you really have any scintilla of actual open-mindedness that human affected global climate change just might, MIGHT, be occurring, then go to this link from the NASA website. Remember, these are the scientists and engineers responsible for moon landings, the space shuttle, and robots landing on mars for crying out loud. How do they gain from trying to propagate a "climate change hoax"?!?
https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
From the article:
Scientific evidence for warming of the climate system is unequivocal.
- Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
The current warming trend is of particular significance because most of it is extremely likely (greater than 95 percent probability) to be the result of human activity since the mid-20th century and proceeding at a rate that is unprecedented over decades to millennia.1
Earth-orbiting satellites and other technological advances have enabled scientists to see the big picture, collecting many different types of information about our planet and its climate on a global scale. This body of data, collected over many years, reveals the signals of a changing climate.
The heat-trapping nature of carbon dioxide and other gases was demonstrated in the mid-19th century.2 Their ability to affect the transfer of infrared energy through the atmosphere is the scientific basis of many instruments flown by NASA. There is no question that increased levels of greenhouse gases must cause the Earth to warm in response.
Ice cores drawn from Greenland, Antarctica, and tropical mountain glaciers show that the Earth’s climate responds to changes in greenhouse gas levels. Ancient evidence can also be found in tree rings, ocean sediments, coral reefs, and layers of sedimentary rocks. This ancient, or paleoclimate, evidence reveals that current warming is occurring roughly ten times faster than the average rate of ice-age-recovery warming.3
The evidence for rapid climate change is compelling:
Chuck, here's another link to a PBS NOVA special called "Decoding the Weather Machine". I challenge you and any of our other climate change deniers to actually watch the entire show and come back and tell me there isn't absolutely any evidence for climate change affected/caused by human activity.
https://www.thirteen.org/programs/nova/decoding-the-weather-machine-vgqhot
Finally, I want to say ditto to aparch's response to your abortion talking point. To be clear, I don't approve of late term abortions except in the case of health of the mother, or if the pregnancy is a result of incest or rape. But please, I'd really like to hear your answer to the question aparch posed. If we're to consider that ball of cells a life that should be cherished at almost all costs, then in today's times, why wouldn't that child's mom receive the $500 from the Covid stimulus?
Jimjamesak
Already insane, UAA making it worse
Chuck Murray
WIS & Effingwoods Hockey Almanac
Re: COVID-19 - Part 2
I guess when your guys couldn't stand the heat any more ... you had to pull a slimy retreat like this.
Yukking it up in the teachers' lounge ... how adorable!! Back to the safe space of your echo chamber.
SO weak. Not surprising, mind you, given the high snowflake content here. But just sooooo weak.
Your unconditional surrenders are accepted. The French Army ain't got nothing on you wusses.
And good luck with that Biden 2020 thingie … *bwaahahahahahahahahahaha …
* - I'm not laughing with you … I'm laughing at you. Over and out.
Who's bright idea was this?
I guess when your guys couldn't stand the heat any more ... you had to pull a slimy retreat like this.
Yukking it up in the teachers' lounge ... how adorable!! Back to the safe space of your echo chamber.
SO weak. Not surprising, mind you, given the high snowflake content here. But just sooooo weak.
Your unconditional surrenders are accepted. The French Army ain't got nothing on you wusses.
And good luck with that Biden 2020 thingie … *bwaahahahahahahahahahaha …
* - I'm not laughing with you … I'm laughing at you. Over and out.
MinnesotaNorthStar
Minding the gap
- Status