What's new
By:
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

Handyman said:
He knows your inner most thoughts and feelings...how dare you question his wisdom!! ;)

He assumes yo speak in absolutes...since you question some cops you hate all cops and think they are evil or stupid even though you have said nothing of the sort. :)
Click to expand...

Got it. For knucks, existential qualification = universal quantification. :p
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

Handyman said:
Funny thing he is not a knuck :eek:
Click to expand...

The guy who confused ∃ and ∀ below is. I know Slap Shot isn't but he hasn't responded yet. I have a feeling he'll bring something a lot stronger than that derp.
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

The original "bad cop" thread and hits like this after a cursory search lead me to the impression:

http://board.uscho.com/showthread.php?111523-Bad-Cop-Bad-Cop-Whatcha-gonna-do&p=6154164&viewfull=1#post6154164
http://board.uscho.com/search.php?searchid=752724

There are some other posts from at least one other poster here that imho go too far. However, I think I over-extended your overall approach to the matter and quite possibly conflated your opinions with others including at another forum. mea culpa

btw - replace "Tanner" with "Kepler" with "Handy" playing the part of Kelly Leak: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIpGkd5y9l8 :D
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

So often, the narratives seem to begin with "racist" cops (three of the police charged in Freddie Gray's death were black, so does that mean that black cops are also racist against black suspects??)

I suspect that may be less causation than possibly correlation, however.

Suppose that a new police officer starts out on the job without any racist bias or slant at all. His/her experiences on the job then shape his/her perceptions. Might it be possible that police over time respond to blacks differently than other races based on how they are treated by blacks compared to how they are treated by other races while on the job?


To me the real problem is not how police treat suspects as much as how police treat victims. This might well be the source of a negative feedback loop: when some people call the police and get a quick helpful response, that creates one set of relationships, while when other people call the police and they don't show up at all or show up late or take a desultory interest in solving the crime, that creates a different set of relationships.
 
FreshFish said:
So often, the narratives seem to begin with "racist" cops (three of the police charged in Freddie Gray's death were black, so does that mean that black cops are also racist against black suspects??)

I suspect that may be less causation than possibly correlation, however.

Suppose that a new police officer starts out on the job without any racist bias or slant at all. His/her experiences on the job then shape his/her perceptions. Might it be possible that police over time respond to blacks differently than other races based on how they are treated by blacks compared to how they are treated by other races while on the job?


To me the real problem is not how police treat suspects as much as how police treat victims. This might well be the source of a negative feedback loop: when some people call the police and get a quick helpful response, that creates one set of relationships, while when other people call the police and they don't show up at all or show up late or take a desultory interest in solving the crime, that creates a different set of relationships.
Click to expand...

Are you really saying black people are the real culprits because they create racist cops?

That's a new twist on the "you're the bigot for not tolerating my bigotry" card.
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

FreshFish said:
To me the real problem is not how police treat suspects as much as how police treat victims. This might well be the source of a negative feedback loop: when some people call the police and get a quick helpful response, that creates one set of relationships, while when other people call the police and they don't show up at all or show up late or take a desultory interest in solving the crime, that creates a different set of relationships.
Click to expand...

There's one thing you're forgetting: Domestic terrorists believe they're always the victim. It's especially true during the "internal investigations".
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

unofan said:
Are you really saying black people are the real culprits because they create racist cops?
Click to expand...

No. Not at all.



At one point, for every immigrant / minority community, there was tension between members of said community and the police: police were seen as the instrument of oppression for the majority who did not want to give room to allow the immigrants/minorities to take a full place at the table (why do we call police custodial vans "Paddy" wagons today, eh?). That kind of setup creates feedback loops, the majority bias against newcomers encourages the police to view everyone in the minority as a potential problem; the minorities' suspicions of whether the police can actually be trusted to be "honest brokers" of law enforcement or whether the police are also part of the conspiracy against them can easily lead to violence against the police.

These kinds of structural problem issues have been around ever since we've had immigration and police. We even had armed insurrections in the 1790s over the federal government trying to collect excise tax on home-brewed distilled spirits (primarily whiskey).



I'm merely saying that "racist cops" is far too glib and superficial to be useful or informative. There is nothing particularly new or different about a minority population feeling like the police are out to get them.
 
Last edited:
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

Kepler said:
This is an outrage. That student does not appear to be black.
Click to expand...
Actually, she is. There are three videos of this thing, all from different angles. The third video is the shortest in duration, but it gives the clearest view of the officer taking the girl out of her desk.

In all honesty, reading everything that lead up to the cop's actions, I don't know what all he was supposed to do in that situation to bring it to a close.

The person who posted the Instagram video says the student was initially asked to leave the class for telling the teacher that she would not put away her phone. The poster says the teacher disciplined the student with a write-up for being disrespectful and disobedient. After being asked to leave again, and her refusing, an administrator came to remove her, she refused, and that is when the SRO was called in.

The poster of this video claims when Fields got to the classroom, he asked her to get up from her desk 4 or 5 times and again, she tells him no. After moving objects from around the student, and asking again to leave the classroom, and her refusing, that is where you see the officer getting physical.
Click to expand...

How does this get resolved without the officer physically taking the girl out of her desk? Given the string of events, there had to have been a good 20-minute build up to this video. The officer didn't beat her. He upended her desk, she can be seen taking a swing at the cop, and he slides her on her back to the front of the room in order to cuff her. I expect he'll be exonerated.
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

St. Clown said:
How does this get resolved without the officer physically taking the girl out of her desk? Given the string of events, there had to have been a good 20-minute build up to this video. The officer didn't beat her. He upended her desk, she can be seen taking a swing at the cop, and he slides her on her back to the front of the room in order to cuff her. I expect he'll be exonerated.
Click to expand...

I suppose the only other option would have been to have everyone else leave the classroom with her left alone as the only one in it; and even then if she tried to follow along someone would have had to stand in her way.......
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

St. Clown said:
In all honesty, reading everything that lead up to the cop's actions, I don't know what all he was supposed to do in that situation to bring it to a close.
Click to expand...

He did exactly what he had to do to remove this unruly student from the classroom. The analysis of the second video Steven Crowder is bang on.

Now if you can’t watch that video on Instagram (though I recommend you do), here are some important things to note.

As you can see here, the cop never applied a chokehold. A headlock- or any kind of head-control does not equal a chokehold. To subdue any person, you’ve got to control either the head, or the hips. Here we see him trying to control her head, but more importantly, contrary to the initial accusations, he did NOT flip her desk. See his hand? It’s on her pant-leg.
Click to expand...

This is exactly the scenario that James Comey was talking about when he spoke of the "chill wind" blowing through law enforcement and how cops are "backing off." It's the FIDO principal. Ironically, his FBI is now investigating this incident for possible civil rights violation. And with the reaction from Obama to Comey's comments, I expect he'll fall on his sword any day now.
 
Last edited:
Good thing there weren't cell.phones at St Marys, the nuns would have whacked that kid with a yard stick till she bled. And her parents would have told the nuns to do it again if she didn't learn the first time
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

walrus said:
Good thing there weren't cell.phones at St Marys, the nuns would have whacked that kid with a yard stick till she bled. And her parents would have told the nuns to do it again if she didn't learn the first time
Click to expand...
Didn't go to Catholic school....but some of my teachers back in the "unenlightened" 60's would have fired a piece of chalk at her, and likely they would have scored a direct hit. :p
 
Re: Cops 2: Pay No Attention to the Rioters Behind the Curtain

SteveP said:
Didn't go to Catholic school....but some of my teachers back in the "unenlightened" 60's would have fired a piece of chalk at her, and likely they would have scored a direct hit. :p
Click to expand...

Went to Catholic K-8 in the 80's. Rulers across the knuckles, standing with arms outstretched while holding thick books. Yep. And anyone who received that punishment...they deserved it. Including yours truly.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top