Business, Economics, and Taxes 2: That's Why We Fight to Take the Means Back

[Kepler]

Don't forget Greenland!

To be honest... I had.

 

[Kepler]

Every child born to a Republican should have one.

By the time they are 12 they do. Between their ears. It says stuff like "Jesus wants you re-enslave black people!" and "Call ICE on the neighbor's gardener!"

 

[ticapnews]

You are no longer free to move about the country

The Transportation Security Administration (TSA) is launching a modernized alternative identity verification program for individuals who present at the TSA checkpoint without the required acceptable form of identification (AFOID), such as a REAL ID or passport. This modernized program provides an alternative that may allow these individuals to gain access to the sterile area of an airport if TSA is able to establish their identity. To address the government-incurred costs, individuals who choose to use TSA's modernized alternative identity verification program will be required to pay an $18 fee. Participation in the modernized alternative identity verification program is optional and does not guarantee an individual will be granted access to the sterile area of an airport.

 

[ticapnews]

A Cuban cigar?

 

[MichVandal]

You are no longer free to move about the country

I'm confused by your conclusion- a Real ID or better is required right now to fly. The requirement for Real ID originates in law back in 2008, and had multiple delays up until this year when it was finally required.

What you are reporting is a way to get an ID that is NOT a Real ID from a state and still fly. Meaning it will add people to be able to fly than the current number of people with a Real ID complaint identification.

I get that it sounds bad, but the reality is that it opens things up ever so slightly.

 

[Handyman]

You are no longer free to move about the country

Not sure what the problem is here. Tbese things already exist...

 

[ticapnews]

I'm confused by your conclusion- a Real ID or better is required right now to fly. The requirement for Real ID originates in law back in 2008, and had multiple delays up until this year when it was finally required.

What you are reporting is a way to get an ID that is NOT a Real ID from a state and still fly. Meaning it will add people to be able to fly than the current number of people with a Real ID complaint identification.

I get that it sounds bad, but the reality is that it opens things up ever so slightly.

So if you don't have a passport or real ID then you are charged $18 (every 10 days) to have your identity verified so you can enter a "sterile" area of the airport. And this seems normal? OK...

Glad I don't fly.

 

[Handyman]

Without a Real ID or passport you cant fly period. The original law was passed in 2005 and delayed in implementation as states had to create compliant IDs and make them available.

Real ID is just an enhanced drivers license that costs a bit more. You need a bit more documentation but thats it. You can also use a passport card (extra $10 when you get your passport book) or if you travel internationally a lot get "Global Entry" to bypass customs and you can use that.

Of the TSA hassles out there the ID was the easiest to deal with because at some point you need to renew your ID anyways so just upgrade then. Like getting your flu shot when you do a normal doctors visit.

The sterile room thing is just for that TSA program and my guess is to keep the other lines moving while they check you out. Most people who travel even a couple times a year have TSA Precheck or Clear (or Global Entry if they travel internationally) so this is all moot. Airports suck without them because people need security theater.

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

I assume this is replacing the existing process where they phone in whatever you're able to give them (credit cards, ID cards that aren't fed or state, etc.). Then they make you answer 3-4 random questions about your personal data, and finally you get the enhanced security pat-down even if you're TSA Pre (mandatory body x-ray, mandatory shoe removal, mandatory carry-on search/swab). It's a pain in the ass, but they don't charge you for it.

Just another way to bilk taxpaying consumers.

 

[Handyman]

I assume this is replacing the existing process where they phone in whatever you're able to give them (credit cards, ID cards that aren't fed or state, etc.). Then they make you answer 3-4 random questions about your personal data, and finally you get the enhanced security pat-down even if you're TSA Pre (mandatory body x-ray, mandatory shoe removal, mandatory carry-on search/swab). It's a pain in the ass, but they don't charge you for it.

Just another way to bilk taxpaying consumers.

Yep.

I wont lie...I doubt I would fly at all if I didnt overpay for all the amenities.

 

[MichVandal]

So if you don't have a passport or real ID then you are charged $18 (every 10 days) to have your identity verified so you can enter a "sterile" area of the airport. And this seems normal? OK...

Glad I don't fly.

Uh, yea. It's a way to fly without a RealID or Passport

Normal or not, your ID is more scrutinized now due to the laws, and it was going to be that way for a really long time now. It's just something you have to accept to travel easily. And if you want even more convenience, you can get more scrutinized to have TSA Pre.

 

[MichVandal]

Without a Real ID or passport you cant fly period. The original law was passed in 2005 and delayed in implementation as states had to create compliant IDs and make them available.

Real ID is just an enhanced drivers license that costs a bit more. You need a bit more documentation but thats it. You can also use a passport card (extra $10 when you get your passport book) or if you travel internationally a lot get "Global Entry" to bypass customs and you can use that.

Of the TSA hassles out there the ID was the easiest to deal with because at some point you need to renew your ID anyways so just upgrade then. Like getting your flu shot when you do a normal doctors visit.

The sterile room thing is just for that TSA program and my guess is to keep the other lines moving while they check you out. Most people who travel even a couple times a year have TSA Precheck or Clear (or Global Entry if they travel internationally) so this is all moot. Airports suck without them because people need security theater.

So you used what seems to be correct words, but in fact, you used words that actually represent another form of ID.

In some border states, you can get an Enhanced Drivers License, that can be used for land border crossings or closed loop cruises instead of a Passport. And Enhanced Drivers License is the actual name for it. You can get an EDL with a passport or with other documents that include a valid birth certificate.

As a matter of fact, if you live in Minnesota, this matters, as it's one of a handful of states that have Enhanced Drivers Licenses- in addition to Michigan, New York, Vermont, and Washington.

We have them as a back up for a passport and cruising. And if we wanted to go to Canada, but left our passports at home. What was funny is that they have a chip in them as a requirement, so Michigan incudes and RFID blocking sleeve for it...

 

[ticapnews]

Uh, yea. It's a way to fly without a RealID or Passport

Normal or not, your ID is more scrutinized now due to the laws, and it was going to be that way for a really long time now. It's just something you have to accept to travel easily. And if you want even more convenience, you can get more scrutinized to have TSA Pre.

Just another example of the surveillance state. I'm old enough to remember when we didn't have to do this.

 

[MichVandal]

Just another example of the surveillance state. I'm old enough to remember when we didn't have to do this.

So you've never crossed a border, anywhere?

Especially never have traveled to Europe, where they take your passport to just check into a hotel, so that they can supply a list to the local and federal police.

If you have ever crossed an international border in your life, you would have to be really, really old to have not been tracked.

 

[ticapnews]

So you've never crossed a border, anywhere?

Especially never have traveled to Europe, where they take your passport to just check into a hotel, so that they can supply a list to the local and federal police.

If you have ever crossed an international border in your life, you would have to be really, really old to have not been tracked.

Thanks for reaffirming that I am old

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Just another example of the surveillance state. I'm old enough to remember when we didn't have to do this.

Yeah, and pretty much anyone with a ticket could just walk onto a plane with a blade or loaded gun (prior to 1972) and even smoke a cig (prior to the late 80s).

Quite a bit of what the TSA does is a theatrical joke, but some security measures are necessary.

 

[aparch]

"What can I use as a dildo substitute?"

 

[Handyman]

So you used what seems to be correct words, but in fact, you used words that actually represent another form of ID.

In some border states, you can get an Enhanced Drivers License, that can be used for land border crossings or closed loop cruises instead of a Passport. And Enhanced Drivers License is the actual name for it. You can get an EDL with a passport or with other documents that include a valid birth certificate.

As a matter of fact, if you live in Minnesota, this matters, as it's one of a handful of states that have Enhanced Drivers Licenses- in addition to Michigan, New York, Vermont, and Washington.

We have them as a back up for a passport and cruising. And if we wanted to go to Canada, but left our passports at home. What was funny is that they have a chip in them as a requirement, so Michigan incudes and RFID blocking sleeve for it...

Yeah I know that hence why it isnt capitalized. Priceless doesn't have to care about that since it is not material to what we are explaining.

I have a Passport Card and Global Entry so I have a normal license. Its a stupid waste if you have a Passport.

 

[ticapnews]

Yeah, and pretty much anyone with a ticket could just walk onto a plane with a blade or loaded gun (prior to 1972) and even smoke a cig (prior to the late 80s).

Quite a bit of what the TSA does is a theatrical joke, but some security measures are necessary.

When I was a kid I was flying back from vacation with my parents and I had a balloon from Busch Gardens. And no one had an issue with that. Until we were at cruising altitude...

"Attention, passengers. Please don't be alarmed if you hear a loud bang. An 8-year-old brought a balloon on board and it might explode."

It didn't explode and I kept it on my wall as a souvenir until I left for college and my mom finally tossed it.

 

[MichVandal]

Yeah I know that hence why it isnt capitalized. Priceless doesn't have to care about that since it is not material to what we are explaining.

I have a Passport Card and Global Entry so I have a normal license. Its a stupid waste if you have a Passport.

Maybe, maybe not- there are timing issues with passports- they have to be valid for more than 6 months to travel to some countries. And instead of rushing to get a passport more than 6 months early (we had a small window to get a passport between trips), it was pretty cheap to get an EDL- which was valid for the travel we had. So we could wait to make sure our passports lasted for the full 10 years and we had a large window to get them without extra costs.

The extra cost of the EDL was way less than expediting a passport. And they are cheaper than a passport card. EDL and Passport cards allow for the same travel.