BU 2021-22: Albie's Great Adventure

[ColinWilsonFan]

I did. I was generally referring to his collective performances to date. Stats don't lie. His GAA is amongst the worst in the league and perhaps the nation. I think some of those tips are saved by a John Curry, Sean Fields, Kieran Millan, O'Connor, Maguire even Rollheiser his over all stats are not nearly what any BU goalie has ever needed to be competitive in this league at this point in the season. Sorry my hockey mind tells me he won't be stealing a game that's what I am saying. He's serviceable. However, if Jack were around, I think he would already be riding the pine. I see him out of position, tentative in the crease and not following the puck. I have been watching and playing for 45 years. Maybe he needs a few section 8 weeks to rest his head as his job is 70% mental. Have you looked? He has a .887 save %. That currently ranks 49 out of 50 NCAA goalies with at least 33% of the total minutes between the pipes. I had to go back nearly 5 decades to find a worse % for a BU starter, granted there have been a lot worse who split time or were backups. Sorry to upset the very PC BU apple cart but we are approaching the break and it needed to be said. It's the real elephant in the room. Albie can't be blamed for this issue but he can be blamed for not having a plan B. However, trust me, this issue is in the back of his mind. If Albie survives another season, he needs to fix it. It happens, NU put the handwriting on the wall to politely allow their last gollie to realize his full potential elsewhere..at Union. HE isn't for everyone.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about especially when it comes to goaltending … as has been the entire time under albie there is no discipline zero defensive structure and frankly very little battle . There’s one main problem with this team and it isn’t the goaltender . It’s the same thing that’s plagued this team for years as I have said again and again - great guy , great recruiter , good hockey knowledge , terrible terrible head coach on about every level -it’s simple.

 

[vicious]

Ok we have precedent now get to it

Leon Abbott is a former college ice hockey coach who is most remembered for being fired by Boston University six games into the 1973–74 season

Abbott used an ineligible player and BU was forced to forfeit a bunch of games. There was a smoking gun. Apples and oranges with the present situation.

 

[RossiRules]

Abbott used an ineligible player and BU was forced to forfeit a bunch of games. There was a smoking gun. Apples and oranges with the present situation.

He used two ineligible players, both of whom were eventually reinstated. They received pay for play in a JR league which sometimes happened in call ups in CAN, that pay made them lose NCAA eligibility. Also he wasn't a prior player or a team Capt who took the team to the frozen four on more than one occasion, so yeah it's apples and oranges. Has hardly ever happened outside of death or illness in NCAA hockey.

 

[Sean Pickett]

Abbott used an ineligible player and BU was forced to forfeit a bunch of games. There was a smoking gun. Apples and oranges with the present situation.

He used two ineligible players, both of whom were eventually reinstated. They received pay for play in a JR league which sometimes happened in call ups in CAN, that pay made them lose NCAA eligibility. Also he wasn't a prior player or a team Capt who took the team to the frozen four on more than one occasion, so yeah it's apples and oranges. Has hardly ever happened outside of death or illness in NCAA hockey.

These are both correct statements. In 1972-73 BU had a player, Dick Decloe, declared ineligible and BU had to forfeit 11 games. The following season two sophomores, Bill Buckton and Peter Marzo, were declared ineligible (first by the ECAC, I believe), but they got a court ordered injunction which allowed them to continue to play and finish their careers at BU. The ECAC eventually reinstated them both, but but the NCAA only reinstated Buckton. You can read Buckton v. National Collegiate Athletic Assn., 436 F. Supp. 1258 (D. Mass. 1977) at Justoa.com.

As for coaches fired in season, I'm aware of the following four:
Leon Abbot, BU, 1973-74, 6 games
Mark Morris, Clarkson, 2001-02, 3 games
Tim Watters, MTU, 2000-01, 9 games
Brian Cavanaugh, Canisius, 2005-06, 15 games

Coach Watters was fired for his team's poor results (1-7-1), while the other 3 were fired for other reasons.

Sean

 

[Harry Cleverly]

Abbott used an ineligible player and BU was forced to forfeit a bunch of games. There was a smoking gun. Apples and oranges with the present situation.

There were three players involved - Bill Buckton, Peter Marzo and Dick Decloe - who were declared ineligible because they had played in Canadian Jr. A, where they had received nominal expense money.
Buckton and Marzo were reinstated. Decloe left school, but later turned up playing for Holland in the 1980 Olympics at Lake Placid as a full amateur.

Abbott took the fall. A lot of alumni were unhappy that he, as an outsider and coach at RPI, replaced Jack Kelley instead of longtime assistant Bob Crocker. Crocker left for UPenn, and eliminated BU from the 1972-73 playoffs. And Jack Parker replaced Abbott after six games into the 1973-74, when BU won the first of four straight ECAC championships.

 

[vicious]

These are both correct statements. In 1972-73 BU had a player, Dick Decloe, declared ineligible and BU had to forfeit 11 games. The following season two sophomores, Bill Buckton and Peter Marzo, were declared ineligible (first by the ECAC, I believe), but they got a court ordered injunction which allowed them to continue to play and finish their careers at BU. The ECAC eventually reinstated them both, but but the NCAA only reinstated Buckton. You can read Buckton v. National Collegiate Athletic Assn., 436 F. Supp. 1258 (D. Mass. 1977) at Justoa.com.

As for coaches fired in season, I'm aware of the following four:
Leon Abbot, BU, 1973-74, 6 games
Mark Morris, Clarkson, 2001-02, 3 games
Tim Watters, MTU, 2000-01, 9 games
Brian Cavanaugh, Canisius, 2005-06, 15 games

Coach Watters was fired for his team's poor results (1-7-1), while the other 3 were fired for other reasons.

Sean

Sean, excellent research, as usual. Thank you. Morris was fired for a physical altercation with a player. I am not sure about Cavanaugh.

Rossi, my point - Coach Watters aside - is that it generally takes a lot more than just a poor win-loss record to fire a coach mid-season. That's why, for those looking for a coaching change mid-season, it would seem to take something pretty damning to make that happen (note this is not a comment on whether Abbot was treated unfairly, or not).

 

[BU93]

Well, we had just about everyone in the lineup this weekend. Big game, big venue, quality opponent. Didn’t matter. Same results. Really no excuses at this point. Trying to figure out BU hockey. Minnesota-Duluth and Minnesota State are kings of the college hockey world. UMass Amherst, Lowell and Northeastern are taking turns as Hockey East’s best team. With our resources (including some of my money)
why can’t we get back in the world of contenders? Hopefully our AD is actively asking that question (it’s his job)

 

[RossiRules]

Well, we had just about everyone in the lineup this weekend. Big game, big venue, quality opponent. Didn’t matter. Same results. Really no excuses at this point. Trying to figure out BU hockey. Minnesota-Duluth and Minnesota State are kings of the college hockey world. UMass Amherst, Lowell and Northeastern are taking turns as Hockey East’s best team. With our resources (including some of my money)
why can’t we get back in the world of contenders? Hopefully our AD is actively asking that question (it’s his job)

Because the landscape of college hockey has changed there are more quality players from all over the country and as a result the pipelines of locals that once exclusively fed the top NE programs, like BU and BC for half a century no longer do so in the same way they once did. The traditional powers were also once academically far superior as well. Those gaps have also closed. There are now great players everywhere now not just NU, UMASS. Take a school like Quinnipiac..think about how much they built in terms of a respectable program in a relatively short period of time.

 

[RossiRules]

Sean, excellent research, as usual. Thank you. Morris was fired for a physical altercation with a player. I am not sure about Cavanaugh.

Rossi, my point - Coach Watters aside - is that it generally takes a lot more than just a poor win-loss record to fire a coach mid-season. That's why, for those looking for a coaching change mid-season, it would seem to take something pretty damning to make that happen (note this is not a comment on whether Abbot was treated unfairly, or not).

That was my point there is not much of a historical precedent to remove a coach mid season..you proved my point even further with your research. Most have been removed for as you indicate reasons other than performance. However, it's really about $. Now think of the number of college basketball and football coaches who have been removed during a season..why..tv rev..money. Hockey may break even at some schools and probably loses money in 1/2 of the DIV 1 programs in this country. Also most of the schools that sponsor hockey in most consider athletics and accutument to academics not the converse. So you don't go firing coaches.

 

[Bomber]

Speaking of $, did you all see the $ and perks Lincoln Riley got from USC. * insert giant eye-bulge emoji here *

Albie isn't going anywhere, but hopefully they are working on who's going to coach the team next year. I want someone with head coaching experience. (And a track record of success.)

And finally, since BU Hockey is a dumpster fire, watch this documentary about ... well ... : ). It's amazing. https://www.netflix.com/title/81026438

 

[mookie1995]

How much longer do you think that will be the case (transfers and recruits)? Also, does anyone have insights about departures over the Christmas break? I have no information, but I wouldn't be surprised if there were, and I'm not referring to the coach here.

the only way that portal stays in place is if the players union promises to take pay for play off the table!

 

[Thiessen'sBetter]

Levi is a great example of inflated stats as he played in front of a loaded team canada team where an orange cone would have had a .950 save percentage. NU also has played a pretty easy schedule to boot. Levi plays in front of a structured team with what has recently been called the best dman in college hockey in jordan harris. You think that helps? Toss Levi in a BU jersey and he would have the same stats as the Bu goalies.

I've admittedly only watched BU a few times this year so I won't comment on Commesso, but the "Levi's numbers are only because of the team in front of him" sentiment is very very wrong. He's been spectacular, especially the last month with 4 top 6 forwards out...NU would be under .500 with an average goalie. Seems like every game is 2-1 and he makes 4 or 5 unbelievable saves.

 

[Sean Pickett]

Hockey may break even at some schools and probably loses money in 1/2 of the DIV 1 programs in this country. Also most of the schools that sponsor hockey in most consider athletics and accutument to academics not the converse. So you don't go firing coaches.

According to the 2020 NCAA Financials for the 28 public schools I have the reports from only one, North Dakota, had an earned profit* for the 2019-20 season, with the other 27 all having an earned loss. When including all revenue 10 schools earned a profit, four balanced the books and 14 still reported a loss. Of the 31 private schools that release much more limited financial information I only have up to 2019, but only 6 reported an overall earned profit, 21 balance the books and 2 reported losses.

Some here have implied or outright stated that the schools all lie on their financial reports submitted to the NCAA. I don't believe that, but after compiling the data for the public schools for over a decade I have seen that some schools interpret the categories differently than other schools and therefore comparing them is like comparing different types of apples. And sometimes a schools changes how they interpret a category from year year to the next, but not often. So, I think the financial information does give a pretty good indication of revenue and expenses for the public schools.

Sean

*Revenue excluding student fees, government support and direct & indirect institutional support

 

[Sean Pickett]

I've admittedly only watched BU a few times this year so I won't comment on Commesso, but the "Levi's numbers are only because of the team in front of him" sentiment is very very wrong. He's been spectacular, especially the last month with 4 top 6 forwards out...NU would be under .500 with an average goalie. Seems like every game is 2-1 and he makes 4 or 5 unbelievable saves.

I believe that the discussion was about the defense in front of Levi, not the offense. A good defense does help a goalie a lot. However, if you say he has made 4 or 5 great saves a game I have no reason to doubt you.

Sean

 

[Lemonade]

I believe that the discussion was about the defense in front of Levi, not the offense. A good defense does help a goalie a lot. However, if you say he has made 4 or 5 great saves a game I have no reason to doubt you.

Sean

My point is the team defense has and the system that NU plays is conducive to great goalie numbers. Levi has a superb defense in front of him (An Athletic article last week called Jordan Harris the best defenseman in college hockey). Lets also keep in mind that Northeastern plays a much more structured game than BU. BU is an absolute mess in the dzone. The games vs BU - Levi didn't have to make any spectacular saves...all basic good positional saves. When BU had a chance they either missed the net or didn't even get a shot off. BU has made every goalie look great and they have made their own goalies look awful with no help. Let also look at this MASSIVE difference:

Northeastern has taken 60 penalties for 134 minutes and 8.4 minutes per game that they are shorthanded.
BU has taken 81!!!!! penalties for 189 minutes and 12.6 minutes per game that they are shorthanded.

For reference - UMass has taken only 42 penalties for 95 total minutes....Umass Lowell 52 penalties...MinnDuluth #1 ranked has 42 penalties...winning hockey is staying out of the box.

BU is shorthanded 33% more time than NU and almost TWICE as much as UMASS!!! The refs aren't to blame its AWFUL discipline and poor accountability from the coach that leads to all these penalties and thus losing hockey games. You can't win at this level giving teams power plays.

BU plays essentially over a half a period per game shorthanded. BU plays 21% of the game shorthanded!!!! Good luck goalies!!!!!

 

[Sean Pickett]

I want someone with head coaching experience. (And a track record of success.)

OK, say you can get any coach you want to take the BU job. Who would you pick?

Sean

 

[Friend_of_BU_Hockey]

OK, say you can get any coach you want to take the BU job. Who would you pick?

Sean

Next year's head coach will be:

A) Albie
B) Jay Pandolfo
C) David Quinn
D) Other ex-BU player not named in A-C
E) Current D1 coach outside of BU hockey lineage

 

[Split-N]

Next year's head coach will be:

A) Albie
B) Jay Pandolfo
C) David Quinn
D) Other ex-BU player not named in A-C
E) Current D1 coach outside of BU hockey lineage

Not trying to intrude on your thread but this is an intriguing question. And my outside two bits would ride on E). Some outside names that come to mind are Rand Pecknold (QPac); Rick Bennett (Union); Eric Lang (AIC); Brett Riley (LIU). The former two are known quantities; the latter two are longshots, short on top-level experience, but Lang has had consistent success at his current level while Riley has built something out of nothing and comes from the Riley family coaching tree.

 

[Lemonade]

Not trying to intrude on your thread but this is an intriguing question. And my outside two bits would ride on E). Some outside names that come to mind are Rand Pecknold (QPac); Rick Bennett (Union); Eric Lang (AIC); Brett Riley (LIU). The former two are known quantities; the latter two are longshots, short on top-level experience, but Lang has had consistent success at his current level while Riley has built something out of nothing and comes from the Riley family coaching tree.

I think the #1 qualification that the higher ups will require is that it has to be a BU alum that gets the job.

 

[Terrier86]

I think the #1 qualification that the higher ups will require is that it has to be a BU alum that gets the job.

Don't disagree and unfortunately that is partially why we're in the current mess. It's time to blow up the old school, parochial thinking and get the best person for the job regardless of whether they played here or not (like most of our other sports, our classroom professors, etc around our great and inclusive university). Pecknold or Bennett or the like would immediately get us back to our past glorious levels.