dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
$2.6 million a year extra from the BTN?
$2.6 million a year extra from the BTN?
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Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
- Thread starter dxmnkd316
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Almington
Blood Boiling with Rage and Hate
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
We all get that, how does forming a B10 hockey conference make more money for the B10? It isn't that they will be able to make huge money selling comercials because of the low rating that hockey will get nor will they be able to demand more per subscriber. Live broadcasts are not cheap to produce (it is the sat time that is expensive, not the other production costs).
I's not the BTN alone that has made huge money for the league, but also their FB and BB contracts with ABC/ESPN.
How UW hockey lost money last year, I do not know. Almost seems like some weird accounting issue.
We all get that, how does forming a B10 hockey conference make more money for the B10? It isn't that they will be able to make huge money selling comercials because of the low rating that hockey will get nor will they be able to demand more per subscriber. Live broadcasts are not cheap to produce (it is the sat time that is expensive, not the other production costs).
I's not the BTN alone that has made huge money for the league, but also their FB and BB contracts with ABC/ESPN.
How UW hockey lost money last year, I do not know. Almost seems like some weird accounting issue.
Almington
Blood Boiling with Rage and Hate
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
No he didn't. He explained how the BTN adds revenue to the schools, not how the BTHC is going to increase revenue.
No he didn't. He explained how the BTN adds revenue to the schools, not how the BTHC is going to increase revenue.
Frank the Tank
New member
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
Then why do Fox Sports North and Fox Sports Detroit broadcast any games and actually pay schools like Minnesota and Michigan a material amount for them? There's local interest. That's really the entire value proposition of the BTN. Not that many people across the nation really care about, say, an Indiana vs. IUPUI basketball game in November, but the ones that do care happen to care about it a lot (to the point where they'd switch cable providers if they didn't carry the BTN) and are highly concentrated in a particular market (Indianapolis and the rest of the Indiana). Add up a whole bunch of various events within the Big Ten region like that (including hockey) and this is how the BTN makes its money. Hockey *by itself* isn't necessarily a financial driving force, but that sport combined with football, basketball and other events is what sells the channel. You have to look at the offerings of the network as a whole (and this is the case with any cable network).
Then why do Fox Sports North and Fox Sports Detroit broadcast any games and actually pay schools like Minnesota and Michigan a material amount for them? There's local interest. That's really the entire value proposition of the BTN. Not that many people across the nation really care about, say, an Indiana vs. IUPUI basketball game in November, but the ones that do care happen to care about it a lot (to the point where they'd switch cable providers if they didn't carry the BTN) and are highly concentrated in a particular market (Indianapolis and the rest of the Indiana). Add up a whole bunch of various events within the Big Ten region like that (including hockey) and this is how the BTN makes its money. Hockey *by itself* isn't necessarily a financial driving force, but that sport combined with football, basketball and other events is what sells the channel. You have to look at the offerings of the network as a whole (and this is the case with any cable network).
dggoddard
New member
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
Two problems with multipurpose arenas. It usually costs $5,000 to $10,000 each time you convert them and you can't play or practice if its set in the other format.
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
Frank The Tank:
I think you make some very good points. I do think you're undervaluing Minnesota from a Big Ten Network perspective a bit by just looking at the success of the football & basketball programs on a national level rather than the market it delivers with the subscribers in the Minneapolis/St. Paul & suburban market. Just my thought, though.
I do question one thing: do you think the BTN will realistically be able to add to subscriber fees simply because of hockey? In economic times like this, I could see people scraping it because of increased fees. Even though .10 is really nothing in the big scheme of things, it's more the principal and the collective attitude of "higher rates? Screw cable/satellite." I don't see hockey bringing in as many new subscribers as the BTN does.....but then again, they know a lot more regarding what they're talking about considering the success that they've had.
Frank The Tank:
I think you make some very good points. I do think you're undervaluing Minnesota from a Big Ten Network perspective a bit by just looking at the success of the football & basketball programs on a national level rather than the market it delivers with the subscribers in the Minneapolis/St. Paul & suburban market. Just my thought, though.
I do question one thing: do you think the BTN will realistically be able to add to subscriber fees simply because of hockey? In economic times like this, I could see people scraping it because of increased fees. Even though .10 is really nothing in the big scheme of things, it's more the principal and the collective attitude of "higher rates? Screw cable/satellite." I don't see hockey bringing in as many new subscribers as the BTN does.....but then again, they know a lot more regarding what they're talking about considering the success that they've had.
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
Just a point that should illustrate this whole debacle for everyone:
One, JUST ONE, Big Ten school made a profit on hockey last year. ONE! That was Minnesota.
The average operating expenses of a Big Ten member that had a men's hockey team was $2.7 million (the previous $1.6 million came from ALL teams in NCAA who have a D1/D2 football team). Big Ten teams made a total of -$488,774 last year. Take away Minnesota's $3.5 million surplus and you have a net of nearly -$4 million.
Just a point that should illustrate this whole debacle for everyone:
One, JUST ONE, Big Ten school made a profit on hockey last year. ONE! That was Minnesota.
The average operating expenses of a Big Ten member that had a men's hockey team was $2.7 million (the previous $1.6 million came from ALL teams in NCAA who have a D1/D2 football team). Big Ten teams made a total of -$488,774 last year. Take away Minnesota's $3.5 million surplus and you have a net of nearly -$4 million.
Almington
Blood Boiling with Rage and Hate
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
I may keep going.
I may also start writing random $2000 checks to schools that are not located in Madison or Minneapolis.
You don't have to stop going to the F5
I may keep going.
I may also start writing random $2000 checks to schools that are not located in Madison or Minneapolis.
BlueDevilRadio
Bi-Winning
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
As a Wisconsin fan, this whole Big Ten Conference deal sucks. That's all that needs to be said...
As a Wisconsin fan, this whole Big Ten Conference deal sucks. That's all that needs to be said...
Shirtless Guy
Old Dirty Basterd
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
I know one in Houghton that's going to need help financially to be able to afford Cary Eades, I can send you the mailing address
Almington
Blood Boiling with Rage and Hate
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
Sure, why not start at the bottom and work my way up.
I know one in Houghton that's going to need help financially to be able to afford Cary Eades, I can send you the mailing address
Sure, why not start at the bottom and work my way up.
Shirtless Guy
Old Dirty Basterd
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
Do you really think Comcast in Minnesota would not lose a ton of subscribers if they only way they could watch gopher hockey was BTN and Comcast decided not to carry it? How many subscribers did DishNetwork lose this fall over FSN North?
Almington
Blood Boiling with Rage and Hate
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
That sounds kinda fun, where do I sign up?
That sounds kinda fun, where do I sign up?
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
I have changed carriers twice over the loss of Gopher hockey coverage, once from Comcast to Dish, once from Dish to Direct.
I have changed carriers twice over the loss of Gopher hockey coverage, once from Comcast to Dish, once from Dish to Direct.
Frank the Tank
New member
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
Yes, you are correct that Minnesota does bring value to the BTN with its home state households (so it's fair to point out that I've undervalued them from that perspective).
I partially addressed this in another post, but increasing subscriber fees won't happen *simply* because of hockey. It's looking at the BTN as a collective. Does having Gopher football, basketball and hockey make it a tad more valuable in its home market than just Gopher football and basketball alone? Can we apply the same analysis in Wisconsin and Michigan? Once we add that all up, does it justify an increase in rates? Note that it's not individual people that decide to buy the BTN (it's not like HBO), but rather the cable company deciding whether it's worth it to pay up for the BTN for its entire subscriber base or risk losing too many customers. In that sense, more events that people care passionately about is better and provides more leverage in those negotiations.
Yes, you are correct that Minnesota does bring value to the BTN with its home state households (so it's fair to point out that I've undervalued them from that perspective).
I partially addressed this in another post, but increasing subscriber fees won't happen *simply* because of hockey. It's looking at the BTN as a collective. Does having Gopher football, basketball and hockey make it a tad more valuable in its home market than just Gopher football and basketball alone? Can we apply the same analysis in Wisconsin and Michigan? Once we add that all up, does it justify an increase in rates? Note that it's not individual people that decide to buy the BTN (it's not like HBO), but rather the cable company deciding whether it's worth it to pay up for the BTN for its entire subscriber base or risk losing too many customers. In that sense, more events that people care passionately about is better and provides more leverage in those negotiations.
bronconick
Yep, still here
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
Comcast carries both FSN & BTN though......BTN isn't going to be gaining any subscribers.
With Dish & FSN, FSN has a combo of Wild, Wolves & Gophers, not to mention the Twins if it dragged on into the spring. They're playing a different game.
I don't think BTN is going to be leaving the Comcast regular lineup even if rates increased from the BTN side, but I could see people scrapping Comcast if they're fed up with increased fees. Other avenues for money to be spent on in life.
Comcast carries both FSN & BTN though......BTN isn't going to be gaining any subscribers.
With Dish & FSN, FSN has a combo of Wild, Wolves & Gophers, not to mention the Twins if it dragged on into the spring. They're playing a different game.
I don't think BTN is going to be leaving the Comcast regular lineup even if rates increased from the BTN side, but I could see people scrapping Comcast if they're fed up with increased fees. Other avenues for money to be spent on in life.
G
Gurtholfin
Guest
Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus
By saying to Charter in Madison, hey we added hockey and your fans can only see these games on our network and we need .15 per month per household more.
No way is Charter gonna eliminate the BTN.
Even in Milwaukee where Badger Hockey is less popular, they're going to pay more to keep football and hoops.
By saying to Charter in Madison, hey we added hockey and your fans can only see these games on our network and we need .15 per month per household more.
No way is Charter gonna eliminate the BTN.
Even in Milwaukee where Badger Hockey is less popular, they're going to pay more to keep football and hoops.
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