Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
Harbaugh was about to get booted. There really was no "stealing" of him.
Harbaugh was about to get booted. There really was no "stealing" of him.
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B1G Championship in Detroit
- Thread starter alfablue
- Start date
MGoBlueHockey
Wolverine Devotee
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
Again, I would concede that hockey is bigger in Minnesota statewide...but it's a whole state of 5 million vs. the Detroit-Flint-Ann Arbor area of 5 million plus a few hockey pockets elsewhere...
True right now. We had more than Minnesota before the Great Recession, which impacted this state particularly badly and has impacted youth hockey badly. And we do have high school hockey here with non-USA Hockey-registered players. It's just that the best don't go that route, and nobody cares about it besides the players and parents.
D1, see my comments about the CHL. And is it really 2 to 1? It wasn't quite that extreme 5 years ago, but I haven't seen recent numbers.
NHL all time, more or less granted (256 to 156), but current numbers, fairly close: 68 Minnesota to 54 Michigan. Compare that to 30 from Massachusetts (population 6.8m), 20 (!) from California (38m), 18 from Illinois (13m) and 15 each from NY State, and Pennsylvania (13m/20m)... it's still the same states at the center of US hockey, although California's rise is intriguing.
Olympics all time, granted, but recent numbers: you had more in 2014, we had more in 2010.
I probably spoke too narrowly describing the rural areas as giving Minnesota the statewide advantage. It's the mid-size towns like Duluth, too. Places like Grand Rapids, Muskegon, and Traverse City have a good hockey presence, but nothing like Duluth and of much more recent provenance, and some mid-size towns like Lansing and the Tri Cities still aren't really hotbeds of the game at all.
If you are conceding that the Wings' support is at least equal to the Wild's--and you seem to be the only poster who has lived in both states--then it partially supports my point about Detroit vs. Twin Cities, as opposed to Michigan vs. Minnesota: we were talking about tournament attendance, and I was focused on a spectator point-of-view. That said, I wouldn't doubt that, if participation statistics existed for the metro areas rather than state wide, as many Detroiters play as Twin Cities-dwellers (or at least did before the recession).
Certainly, the Michiganians who support the minor pro and major junior teams are a niche.
I don't agree with this point completely. Granted, there was a fan survey about 5 years ago that found that the Wings were the most popular local team, while the NFL was the favorite league, which would tend to support your point. On the other hand, that may have just been cynical Detroit hockey fans (and we are a cynical bunch) hating on Bettman and the salary cap. But you can go into a barbershop here (or listen to sports radio) and people will be talking about the Wings as much as any team, and not just about the players. You will hear them talking about the cycle or butterfly goalies. The game itself is loved here. Other levels do not arouse much spectator passion, agreed, but I do not think that the Wings are popular primarily because of the personalities. (Notwithstanding that the Zamboni driver is a celebrity.) The Wings simply are the embodiment of the game here.
In the end, this was one of my two main points. Some people were ragging on Michigan's/Detroit's hockey culture because of the tournament attendance. I think that we can all agree that the B1G has done an awful job with this tournament in both cities. These are the best two hockey states, which used to draw great crowds for the WCHA and CCHA. It doesn't reflect on our hockey culture here, or there, that attendance was bad.
My other point was that you cannot compare Michigan and Minnesota based on the colleges...the college game is not, and probably never will be, as big here as there. You can disagree with my conclusion that Detroit is as good/better of a hockey town as the Twin Cities, but I hope that you agree that you have to look at all levels, and direct comparison is hard because the lower levels are so different.
Anyway, congratulations to the Gophers. No question, the best team in the conference this year, if not by much. The strange decline of Michigan hockey continues...three straight years out of the NCAA tournament. You look at what Mel Pearson has accomplished at Tech since he left and begin to wonder...but that's a topic for another thread.
Again, I would concede that hockey is bigger in Minnesota statewide...but it's a whole state of 5 million vs. the Detroit-Flint-Ann Arbor area of 5 million plus a few hockey pockets elsewhere...
True right now. We had more than Minnesota before the Great Recession, which impacted this state particularly badly and has impacted youth hockey badly. And we do have high school hockey here with non-USA Hockey-registered players. It's just that the best don't go that route, and nobody cares about it besides the players and parents.
D1, see my comments about the CHL. And is it really 2 to 1? It wasn't quite that extreme 5 years ago, but I haven't seen recent numbers.
NHL all time, more or less granted (256 to 156), but current numbers, fairly close: 68 Minnesota to 54 Michigan. Compare that to 30 from Massachusetts (population 6.8m), 20 (!) from California (38m), 18 from Illinois (13m) and 15 each from NY State, and Pennsylvania (13m/20m)... it's still the same states at the center of US hockey, although California's rise is intriguing.
Olympics all time, granted, but recent numbers: you had more in 2014, we had more in 2010.
I probably spoke too narrowly describing the rural areas as giving Minnesota the statewide advantage. It's the mid-size towns like Duluth, too. Places like Grand Rapids, Muskegon, and Traverse City have a good hockey presence, but nothing like Duluth and of much more recent provenance, and some mid-size towns like Lansing and the Tri Cities still aren't really hotbeds of the game at all.
If you are conceding that the Wings' support is at least equal to the Wild's--and you seem to be the only poster who has lived in both states--then it partially supports my point about Detroit vs. Twin Cities, as opposed to Michigan vs. Minnesota: we were talking about tournament attendance, and I was focused on a spectator point-of-view. That said, I wouldn't doubt that, if participation statistics existed for the metro areas rather than state wide, as many Detroiters play as Twin Cities-dwellers (or at least did before the recession).
Certainly, the Michiganians who support the minor pro and major junior teams are a niche.
I don't agree with this point completely. Granted, there was a fan survey about 5 years ago that found that the Wings were the most popular local team, while the NFL was the favorite league, which would tend to support your point. On the other hand, that may have just been cynical Detroit hockey fans (and we are a cynical bunch) hating on Bettman and the salary cap. But you can go into a barbershop here (or listen to sports radio) and people will be talking about the Wings as much as any team, and not just about the players. You will hear them talking about the cycle or butterfly goalies. The game itself is loved here. Other levels do not arouse much spectator passion, agreed, but I do not think that the Wings are popular primarily because of the personalities. (Notwithstanding that the Zamboni driver is a celebrity.) The Wings simply are the embodiment of the game here.
In the end, this was one of my two main points. Some people were ragging on Michigan's/Detroit's hockey culture because of the tournament attendance. I think that we can all agree that the B1G has done an awful job with this tournament in both cities. These are the best two hockey states, which used to draw great crowds for the WCHA and CCHA. It doesn't reflect on our hockey culture here, or there, that attendance was bad.
My other point was that you cannot compare Michigan and Minnesota based on the colleges...the college game is not, and probably never will be, as big here as there. You can disagree with my conclusion that Detroit is as good/better of a hockey town as the Twin Cities, but I hope that you agree that you have to look at all levels, and direct comparison is hard because the lower levels are so different.
Anyway, congratulations to the Gophers. No question, the best team in the conference this year, if not by much. The strange decline of Michigan hockey continues...three straight years out of the NCAA tournament. You look at what Mel Pearson has accomplished at Tech since he left and begin to wonder...but that's a topic for another thread.
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Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
He was offered to the Browns before last season. The Browns didn't want him. Just sayin'. Halfway through the NFL season (with the way MI was going) it was the worst kept secret: he was going to MI.
He was offered to the Browns before last season. The Browns didn't want him. Just sayin'. Halfway through the NFL season (with the way MI was going) it was the worst kept secret: he was going to MI.
Spartanforlife4
Generic Catchy Message
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
Phew, it took until after the tournament, but we got a Harbaugh reference in this thread. I thought we might miss the opportunity.
Phew, it took until after the tournament, but we got a Harbaugh reference in this thread. I thought we might miss the opportunity.
Spartanforlife4
Generic Catchy Message
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
Woah, let's not go that far. I'm the one laughing at the articles about Harbaugh buying a rocking chair, not the one eagerly waiting for the next one to be posted.
Also, thank you for winning tonight.
He's (technically) your people.
Woah, let's not go that far. I'm the one laughing at the articles about Harbaugh buying a rocking chair, not the one eagerly waiting for the next one to be posted.
Also, thank you for winning tonight.
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
Just saying he's a Michigander. Michiganian.....Michigandonian? A person from Michigan.
(It's the first one, I know)
Just saying he's a Michigander. Michiganian.....Michigandonian? A person from Michigan.
(It's the first one, I know)
And no real mention of who won the tournament.
Geez.
Again, congrats gophers, you controlled the game most of the time, and earned it.
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
We won the tourney. The games were simply a formality.
We won the tourney. The games were simply a formality.
wT is right, you are tInsecure.
Pirateasaur
Member
how could Harbaugh have let any of this happen?
MGoBlueHockey
Wolverine Devotee
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
I know your thing is to troll, but have you heard about the problems between Harbaugh and the 49ers owner? He wanted a yes man to push around. Harbaugh was not getting fired because of his record (which was exceptional in addition to his NFC ring and 3 NFCCGs.).
Watch the 49ers this year. They're going to suck beyond belief and go back to what they were before Harbaugh turned them into an NFC Champion again.
I know your thing is to troll, but have you heard about the problems between Harbaugh and the 49ers owner? He wanted a yes man to push around. Harbaugh was not getting fired because of his record (which was exceptional in addition to his NFC ring and 3 NFCCGs.).
Watch the 49ers this year. They're going to suck beyond belief and go back to what they were before Harbaugh turned them into an NFC Champion again.
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
You just proved my point. MI didn't steal Harbaugh. He was out of a job, and MI told him to take their money.
You just proved my point. MI didn't steal Harbaugh. He was out of a job, and MI told him to take their money.
MGoBlueHockey
Wolverine Devotee
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
No, I really didn't since I said he was swiped from the NFL where several teams where gunning for him but ok.
No, I really didn't since I said he was swiped from the NFL where several teams where gunning for him but ok.
Typical Ann Arbor Arrogance. How successful was all that money this year? It bought a whole lot of middle of the pack.
Re: B1G Championship in Detroit
There wasn't a single team gunning for him. SF was shopping him around before this season (we only know about the offer to the Browns, officially).
There wasn't a single team gunning for him. SF was shopping him around before this season (we only know about the offer to the Browns, officially).